Lurch & Pennant - Deja Vu all over again?

[brendan]

Well, another highly contentious signing, which has disappointed many Kopites and made me think about the myriad similarities between Lurch & Pennant.

Both itinerant footballers who flopped miserably following their first big money move to a "big club".

Both with plenty to prove on arrival at Liverpool.

Both had their only good season playing for sides that got relegated.

Both LAUGHABLY overpriced, considering neither player was exactly "hotly contested".

Neither player would get anywhere NEAR the first team of our close rivals.

The *real* difference is that Lurch is, by all accounts, a decent, nice, intelligent bloke, who has never caused any manager a picosecond of trouble.

The most *important* difference is that I actually rate Pennant far more highly than I do Lurch (although that isn't hard). I know many rate Lurch, but I think he's horribly ordinary, so I have much higher hopes for Jermaine.

Let's see how Pennant does.

It's going to be interesting, if nothing else!

[murder_inc]

But what else can we do Brendan. The board or Rafa are unwilling to pay TOP DOLLAR on signings like Simao and Joaquin so we have to make the best out of a bad situation. I actually dont mind Pennant as long as he can behave himself and i do think 8m is a tad too high but its tradition for us now to pay over the odds for a player who isnt everybodys cup of tea but not stumping up the cash for a player we would love to see in red.
Just gotta get on with it i suppose.

[JRG]

Well, another highly contentious signing, which has disappointed many Kopites and made me think about the myriad similarities between Lurch & Pennant.

Both itinerant footballers who flopped miserably following their first big money move to a "big club".

Both with plenty to prove on arrival at Liverpool.

Both had their only good season playing for sides that got relegated.

Both LAUGHABLY overpriced, considering neither player was exactly "hotly contested".

Neither player would get anywhere NEAR the first team of our close rivals.

The *real* difference is that Lurch is, by all accounts, a decent, nice, intelligent bloke, who has never caused any manager a picosecond of trouble.

The most *important* difference is that I actually rate Pennant far more highly than I do Lurch (although that isn't hard). I know many rate Lurch, but I think he's horribly ordinary, so I have much higher hopes for Jermaine.

Let's see how Pennant does.

It's going to be interesting, if nothing else!

Interesting observations.

I am just hoping that as complemantary people and footballers they gel as well says he hopes they will. His crossing ability is something I've admired, and hopefully with the discipline and ambition in this club he should improve all round.

Here's hoping

[MrMichael]

Agree that there are a lot of similaritiies between the 2 deals. Ultimately the problem as I see it is just about cost. Crouch was a little over priced, as is Pennant, both have undoubted footballing ability but this has only been proven at a lower level, and in many ways both are very "unfashionable" buys. However that's why Rafa is such a good manager in my opinion, if he sees something in a player that he thinks he can work upon and will add something extra to his plan for the club, then he'll go for it, whatever everyone else might think. Courage of his convictions and all that.

I think you under-rate Crouchinho though, and that will be seen when he has intelligent strikers like Bellamy and Fowler playing off him (rather than Moro/Cisse)

You're right though, it certainly will be interesting. Bring on the new season I say :D

[MrMichael]

But what else can we do Brendan. The board or Rafa are unwilling to pay TOP DOLLAR on signings like Simao and Joaquin so we have to make the best out of a bad situation.

I'm not sure it is a bad situation though. We can't afford to try and match the like of Chelsea financially, we'll always come off worse. Our record when we spend big isn't great either, for every Alonso we've got 3 Cisse, Heskey and Dioufs. Neither Joaquin or Simao would be worth anywhere near the money we'd have to stump up, then they might not settle/turn out to be that great either. Crouch I'm sure we'd at least get our money back for now. I hope the same hapens with Pennant, but if not it won't be an absolute disaster at all. My poinion of our board's financial management has gone up considerably in the last 15 months or so.

[scubykuntz]

God, talk about a lot of negitivity.. Everyone's entitled to their own opinion, but how can you say that you don't rate Crouch. I mean sure he is not a leathal 20 goal a season striker, but he has qualities that are pretty hard to find in todays game,and Rafa defo rates him. In fact, I'd say our 20 point improvement over the season before had a lot to do with crouch, along with Momo and Reina of course.
I'm very optimistic about the start of the season, and feel we really do have a squad to challenge the chavs.

[brendan]

God, talk about a lot of negitivity.. Everyone's entitled to their own opinion, but how can you say that you don't rate Crouch. I mean sure he is not a leathal 20 goal a season striker, but he has qualities that are pretty hard to find in todays game,and Rafa defo rates him. In fact, I'd say our 20 point improvement over the season before had a lot to do with crouch, along with Momo and Reina of course.
I'm very optimistic about the start of the season, and feel we really do have a squad to challenge the chavs.

Well, I'm loathe to turn this into a thread about Lurch, but I think he's fcuking useless. Always have.

[G_Man]

I think Crouch is a brilliant player and he's produced good performances 75% of the time I've watched him live.
He is a bargain at 7 million pounds, a class player with bags of potential.

:handshake:

[anfieldanfield]

Another summer '06 signing. Another criminal.

I am quite frankly staggered that Bellamy and Pennant are our two main summer signings, if you'd have told me this at the end of last season I'm almost certain I would have strained a muscle or two laughing at the absurdness of the suggestion.

That a club with the presitge and fanbase of ours, having just won European and FA Cups in consecutive seasons with unquestionably one of the top five managers in world football, should have to settle for second, (maybe even third) best, is a source of great frustration and discontent.

In the past couple of summers we've allowed world class (largely) attainable players, such as Figo, Torres, Villa, Jaoquin, Simao, Alves and co, slip through our fingers.

I'm aware that this isn't Rafa's fault, whether we should be blaming Parry and Moores is a different (and exceptionally interesting) debate altogether.
But, even if we do have to bring in *good*, rather than great players, as a result of our tight financial situation, the signing of Pennant can only be described as an almighty and audacious gamble at best, and the dealings of a nonsensical madman, at worst.

You could *just* about argue that Bellamy deserved another chance, but Pennant's had his fair share, everywhere he's gone, his stay has erupted in a chaotic, self induced explosion of alcohol, page three girls, fast cars and policemen.

It may take weeks it may take months, it may even take a season or two, but Pennant WILL find some way to screw this up for himself, I'd bet my left testicle on it.

I'm not happy. At all.

*shakes head*

[G_Man]

Didn't Figo turn us down?
Didn't Villa prefer to stay in Spain?
Benfica messed us around over Simao, I would argue that a club with our prestige should not be held to ransom by other clubs.
Joaquin is not rated by Rafa so what's the point in signing him? You think he's world class-fair enough, but Rafa doesn't.
Torres I would argue is NOT attainable because his club has overpriced him out of a deal. I hope he walks on a free becuase Atletico are talking ridiculous prices.

We've bought expensive imports in the past and we've had mixed results. Nando-flop, Xabi-great. We know what we're getting with Pennant and Bellamy. We know they've got baggage but we also know they can produce the goods.
In the right environment with a strong guiding hand like Rafa, they could/should flourish. Whenever you sign a player, you take a gamble. The fact is English/British players always have a decent resale value whereas foreign flops usually go for buttons.

I'm happy we have strengthened the squad again :)

[H]

It may take weeks it may take months, it may even take a season or two, but Pennant WILL find some way to screw this up for himself, I'd bet my left testicle on it.


Didnt you lose that when Fowler re-signed:D

[scubykuntz]

Another summer '06 signing. Another criminal.

I am quite frankly staggered that Bellamy and Pennant are our two main summer signings, if you'd have told me this at the end of last season I'm almost certain I would have strained a muscle or two laughing at the absurdness of the suggestion.

That a club with the presitge and fanbase of ours, having just won European and FA Cups in consecutive seasons with unquestionably one of the top five managers in world football, should have to settle for second, (maybe even third) best, is a source of great frustration and discontent.

In the past couple of summers we've allowed world class (largely) attainable players, such as Figo, Torres, Villa, Jaoquin, Simao, Alves and co, slip through our fingers.

I'm aware that this isn't Rafa's fault, whether we should be blaming Parry and Moores is a different (and exceptionally interesting) debate altogether.
But, even if we do have to bring in *good*, rather than great players, as a result of our tight financial situation, the signing of Pennant can only be described as an almighty and audacious gamble at best, and the dealings of a nonsensical madman, at worst.

You could *just* about argue that Bellamy deserved another chance, but Pennant's had his fair share, everywhere he's gone, his stay has erupted in a chaotic, self induced explosion of alcohol, page three girls, fast cars and policemen.

It may take weeks it may take months, it may even take a season or two, but Pennant WILL find some way to screw this up for himself, I'd bet my left testicle on it.

I'm not happy. At all.

*shakes head*

I actually couldn't disagree with you more.
Pennant has valuable experience in the EPL, at worst he will make a good squad member, at best he could really develop in to a really top class player. If we do have to sell him on at some stage I'd say we won't lose too much. Alves on the other hand is nearly twice the price and could be a total flop, we could end up losing a bundle on him a la the cisse scenario. Not many brazilians have been a success in the EPL have they?

Figo would have been a total disaster in my opinion, big name charle who's over rated and over the hill.
Aslo, your aware that this is not Rafa's fault. How do you know this? Do you have Rafa's confidence or something.
I personally think that rafa calls the shots, otherwise he wouldn't have signed his contract extension. If the reports are to be believed that we will end up paying

[Bob]

Well, another highly contentious signing, which has disappointed many Kopites and made me think about the myriad similarities between Lurch & Pennant.

Both itinerant footballers who flopped miserably following their first big money move to a "big club".

Both with plenty to prove on arrival at Liverpool.

Both had their only good season playing for sides that got relegated.

Both LAUGHABLY overpriced, considering neither player was exactly "hotly contested".

Neither player would get anywhere NEAR the first team of our close rivals.

The *real* difference is that Lurch is, by all accounts, a decent, nice, intelligent bloke, who has never caused any manager a picosecond of trouble.

The most *important* difference is that I actually rate Pennant far more highly than I do Lurch (although that isn't hard). I know many rate Lurch, but I think he's horribly ordinary, so I have much higher hopes for Jermaine.

Let's see how Pennant does.

It's going to be interesting, if nothing else!

For what it's worth I agree with nearly all that.

I do rate Crouch a little higher than you though. He is effective in some sytems Rafa plays, and his hold up play is as good as you'd expect from a strong target man. That said more often than not I wish he was doing it at another club.

[Gavzie]

Didn't Figo turn us down?
Didn't Villa prefer to stay in Spain?
Benfica messed us around over Simao, I would argue that a club with our prestige should not be held to ransom by other clubs.
Joaquin is not rated by Rafa so what's the point in signing him? You think he's world class-fair enough, but Rafa doesn't.
Torres I would argue is NOT attainable because his club has overpriced him out of a deal. I hope he walks on a free becuase Atletico are talking ridiculous prices.

We've bought expensive imports in the past and we've had mixed results. Nando-flop, Xabi-great. We know what we're getting with Pennant and Bellamy. We know they've got baggage but we also know they can produce the goods.
In the right environment with a strong guiding hand like Rafa, they could/should flourish. Whenever you sign a player, you take a gamble. The fact is English/British players always have a decent resale value whereas foreign flops usually go for buttons.

I'm happy we have strengthened the squad again :)
:handshake:

[Red_Polo]

"Since we cannot get what we like, let us like what we can get." Spanish proverb

We would have liked Alves, but we will like Pennant. At the end of the day we've filled a problem position, and Pennant has shown that although he is not world class, he is consistantly competent in the necessary deparments.

[Morse]

I think Crouch is a brilliant player and he's produced good performances 75% of the time I've watched him live.
He is a bargain at 7 million pounds, a class player with bags of potential.

:handshake:


I think you are being over kind G.
He is a decent player but not brilliant. His finishing is shocking.

[G_Man]

I think you are being over kind G.
He is a decent player but not brilliant. His finishing is shocking.

Just trying to balance up the post by that Brendan lad.
He exaggerated his criticism so I exaggerated my praise.
He's a good footballer, his control is brilliant but he has a lot of areas in which he can still improve.
For 7 million I think he's a great signing but that's just a personal view. His finishing is improving constantly.

[rebel23]

considering Seville wanted 12m for Alves and Benfica wanted 14m for Simao and the fact that Barce payed 12m for Zambrotta i would say Pennant was as cheap as deal as we're likely to do for a semi decent right sided player

I agree with those who say he is a bargain and disagree with those who say he is overpriced. if he is overpriced, what the feck are the other options and not to mention SWP, another right sided british player cost chelski 22 million. in context, it's a very good deal especially as his wage is also 25k a week

[El Jefecito]

considering Seville wanted 12m for Alves and Benfica wanted 14m for Simao and the fact that Barce payed 12m for Zambrotta i would say Pennant was as cheap as deal as we're likely to do for a semi decent right sided player

I agree with those who say he is a bargain and disagree with those who say he is overpriced. if he is overpriced, what the feck are the other options and not to mention SWP, another right sided british player cost chelski 22 million. in context, it's a very good deal especially as his wage is also 25k a week
Agree, decent right wingers are a rare commodity. Probably the reason we haven't had once since Mcmoneyman. Small price to pay for our future if you ask me. JP + a striker pretty much completes our squad. Which means from next year onwards we can be looking at spending our whole transfer budget on a world class player to go straight into the first team. All in all seems to represent in both the short term and long term a very good deal.

[murder_inc]

cant realy argue with that speedy. If it means paying 8m for JP and 10m on Kuyt or Klose then surely this time next year we should have the funds to blow our wad on true world class who would walk straight into the team. Although if these players do the biz, why fix it if it aint broken.

sorry, talking bollox now. Very tired and im off to beddy byes.
night all.

[El Jefecito]

cant realy argue with that speedy. If it means paying 8m for JP and 10m on Kuyt or Klose then surely this time next year we should have the funds to blow our wad on true world class who would walk straight into the team. Although if these players do the biz, why fix it if it aint broken.

sorry, talking bollox now. Very tired and im off to beddy byes.
night all.
Ronaldinho next year :haha:

[FowlerLeftFoot]

Nicked from Teamtalk.com duncan's style.

Jermaine Pennant

1983: January 15: Born in Nottingham.

1998: December 22: Makes Notts County debut, aged 15, in an LDV Vans Trophy defeat by Hull.

1999: January 15: Signed by Arsenal on his 16th birthday after two games for Notts County. A tribunal dictated Arsenal had to pay County

[Finnish_Red]

I wouldn't play it down too much, it's a big enough deal to get him sentenced to prison for three months...

That said, the guy seems to be over the moon about this transfer. If this ain't enough to get him focused on football and cut down the antics off the field, than I don't know what is.

Here's hoping he'll be the wing wizard we've been craving for :handshake:

:lfc:

[Howard_lfc]

I think Crouch is a brilliant player and he's produced good performances 75% of the time I've watched him live.
He is a bargain at 7 million pounds, a class player with bags of potential.

:handshake:

'Kinell G-man - take it easy mate !!
For me Crouch is neither brilliant nor a bargain.
Would I sell him? If somebody offered our money back then I'd really have to think about it.........unless he can improve another 20% or so.

[RedJersey]

'Kinell G-man - take it easy mate !!
For me Crouch is neither brilliant nor a bargain.
Would I sell him? If somebody offered our money back then I'd really have to think about it.........unless he can improve another 20% or so.
With respect mate, you wouldn't have to think about it. You're just some bloke on an internet forum. :) The manager of LFC has declared himself very happy with Peter Crouch. It's beyond contention that his presence in the team last year, his hold-up play and ability to play-in other players, was one of the primary reasons for our vastly improved form.

If we bring Kuyt in, Crouch may not play as many games this season, but he'll still have a large part to play.

[Sipowicz]

For starters can we lay off the nickname business? This was a name invented by Oldham (who as we know is certainly no LFC fan) and is just pandering to the idiot fans who shout out 'freak' every other week. This is not a thread title for Liverpool fans.

As for Pennant, if we were willing to welcome big Jan back with open arms after his bird, we can't start getting all morally superior now. I'm willing to give him a go, and if it doesn't work out Rafa will get rid. Simple as.

[Howard_lfc]

With respect mate, you wouldn't have to think about it. You're just some bloke on an internet forum. :)

With respect mate - this is a forum where people post their opinions - and that's mine.

[Gavzie]

I would be happy to see Crouch and Bellers have a go together if we dont get kuyt. Although not the vest in the air at 6ft7 his touch is excellent and is the type of player think Bellers will enjoy playing with. This plus pennant and Speedy / HK should male for a lot quality from wide out and Bellers will thrive on the knock downs that Crouch will give him. Needless to say SG storming forward form the centre will also prove to be too many attacking threats for most teams.

Happy Days

[dww]

I actually think that the Crouch deal was good value for money, when you consider the wages as well as the fee. I don't think there were any other players available who offered his quality of link up play and general contribution. He needs to improve his scoring record but once he scored his first goal he scored at a goal every other game - which isn't bad. On the point about not getting near any other top clubs team I for one would play him above Adebeyor any day of any week and possibly also Drogba.


At the minute I'm not so sure about Pennant - although I guess my lack of knowledge of his wages and those of Alves or Simao makes it difficult to judge. I think Pennat is a good player who does offer the qualities we need in the squad. If he is the only player who can do this and leave us enough money for more signings then he is good value.

[Peter Delvechio]

I think Crouch is a brilliant player and he's produced good performances 75% of the time I've watched him live.
He is a bargain at 7 million pounds, a class player with bags of potential.

:handshake:

I'm assuming you've watched him live only once and it was one of those rare games when he scored a goal.

[discobiscuit]

I despise any cock that calls Crouch "L urch"

[brendan]

I despise any cock that calls Crouch "Lurch"

Yeah, same here

Hahahaha

[brendan]

For starters can we lay off the nickname business? This was a name invented by Oldham (who as we know is certainly no LFC fan)

Dunmin didn't invent that nickname for Lurchio, it's been knocking about for fcuking YONKS and was also used by Villa fans.

Cheers

[discobiscuit]

Yeah, same here

Hahahaha

Look at you, aren't you a bright spark

[zimbo]

Just wondering, if we're having the deja vu all over again, when did we have it before?

Right, carry on....

[RedJersey]

With respect mate - this is a forum where people post their opinions - and that's mine.

Well done. Nice to see an opinion expressed in such a novel and quaint way.

[G_Man]

I'm assuming you've watched him live only once and it was one of those rare games when he scored a goal.


Never assume, it makes an "ass" out of "u" and "me". :handshake:

I watched him live 8 times last season and he had 6 good games.

[Howard_lfc]

Well done. Nice to see an opinion expressed in such a novel and quaint way.

oh please.......:rolleyes: