View Full Version : This is how the world will end.
This made my blood run cold.
I just listened to a guy from a scientific think tank named the Horizon project talk about ancient civilization anomalies. By that I mean how some civilizations just disappeared off the face of the planet, how even stranger still, technologies were literally forgotten. Evidence of civilizations understanding the technology of the Gear system and suddenly its gone not to be found again for another 200 years, it would be akin to us not knowing how to use Electricity in 200 years time. Strange to say the least. We have found huge cities under the sea, one such city more accurately a metropolis off the coast of Japan is huge and completely intact, it takes a half an hour to fly over it. We have found an ancient battery in Iraq which is 1000’s of years old. We have found a spherical clock which not only tells the time but also longitude and latitude with a level of gear sophistication which leaves us even today marveling at its complexity.
In ice core samples scientist have long been perplexed, or more accurately geophysicists because the data fell outside there specialty have put to one side a layer of cosmic dust found in ice core samples regular as cosmic clock work. At a complete loss to how this material is embedded in our ice sheets and essentially records of the planet scientists just put it to one side. Until now, this think thank is made up of over 300 scientists from a cross section of specialties. The common consensus is we are about to eminently enter into a catastrophic period which has been repeating itself for millions even billions of years.
Just as we orbit the sun so too does our solar system orbit the galactic center, this orbit is elliptical and as such we move through the galactic center twice every orbit. This just so happens to coincide with most of the major extinctions we have recorded. How it works is quite simple. Our solar system is surrounded by a ring of giant snowballs if you like called the Kuplier Belt. The solar system is also surrounded by a spherical ball of cosmic duct way way out at the very limit of what could still be classed as the solar system.
When our solar system moves through the galactic center the gravity field from the super massive black hole which anchors our Galaxy comes into direct contact or interaction with our Solar system, planets, sun etc. The effects on a Galactic scale are akin to a minor blip but for us it is catastrophic. The Kuplier belt becomes unstable raining in commets like a cosmic snowball fight, the comic dust which I mentioned earlier is forced inwards towards us a the speed of light, blowing a 3rd of our atmosphere away immediately upon contact. Solar activity becomes incredibly unstable, producing mass ejections which play havoc with our weather systems. The geographic poles switch, the planet stops spinning momentary and water levels everywhere rise to the extent that we are all suddenly 200 feet under water. Signs proceeding this are increasing erratic weather patterns. 2006 was officially the most anomalous year on record for weather across the globe. Temperature rises across the solar system, unfortunately all of the planets are dramatically warming up from the inside out, earth too, which would explain the highly anomalous seaboard temperature rises across the planet which have nothing to do with global warming. The majority of the human race around the planet will die almost instantly, the rest will die within 6 months and the small remaining numbers will be starting everything from scratch, which is a lot easier said then done. This apparently has happened many times in the past.
Plastic is practically un destroyable yet it would take just a mere 200 years for all trace of our civilization to disappear like we never was here.
Do you want the Good news ?? Lol there is none, we are fucked. This is happening now and chances are its going to happen with the next 10 years most likely 2012. None of this is conjecture and they are 100 % certain it will happen and has happened before. Best get away from the coast around that time.
Here are some youtube videos I have found on the subject, the production is not great but listen closely to the material.
This shit is scary as hell. Hey at the very least its interesting stuff but I tell you I believe this. Its all based on observable science, none of it is theory and unfortunately its going to happen in either months of years at best.
Enjoy the ride whilst you can ..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QZxoHqbl45g
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U6ieV000wb0
Spread the word .. We are all Fucked :rock:
Pretty doomsday scenario and pretty much as you say based on 'observable' data, meaning no theory to prove what has been collected.
Very interesting read though mate and thanks for putting all that together. :handshake:
anfieldpurch
30-01-07, 08:55 PM
Wicked cool when we die ill be partying in ibiza laughing as a die praising Satan (Yes i am a satanist) Rocking out to Led Zeppellin and Iron Maiden and Lordi
Wicked cool when we die ill be partying in ibiza laughing as a die praising Satan (Yes i am a satanist) Rocking out to Led Zeppellin and Iron Maiden and Lordi
Rock on Matey .. :rock:
Did'nt think they were into Iron Maiden on Ibiza ..
What got you in to the Old Satanism
spud_gun
30-01-07, 09:46 PM
Not a chance of this happening.
The Americans / South Koreans / Iranians will have nuked the planet before this ever happens :handshake:
Well they better get a move on, they have a half a dozen years at best, 2008 we will all start to see very serious worrying signs, the current strange weather is just a precursor
Shit. I was looking forward to the London Olympics in 2012 and everything. Lord Coe will be pissed.
RedProf
30-01-07, 10:32 PM
Well Nicey I'm disappointed now - and there was me looking forward to a new golden age of understanding, alien contact etc etc having avidly followed the Small threads from KT days and on here.
What a real shame! I had such high hopes for new technology that would change our lives so much and now it's all set to end in a rain of comets, no atmosphere and crazy weather and floods.
We'd better get to work on the Est Ark then.......
Red Chilli
30-01-07, 11:04 PM
I'll believe it when I see it. :p
Isn't this what Buddhists believe happens and also the Mayans have predicted the end of an age.
Buddhists believe in death followed by reincarnation and believe this happens to the solar system, even the universe, the same as it does for humans, unless you become enlightened and get out of the cycle.
Buddha taught this thousands of years ago. :eyebrow:
Apparently some will survive, the floods and cities undersea are caused by the equinox literally changing geographic position, Mts will fall and seabeds will rise up. Keep an eye out you and will start to see signs everwhere
Pluto is undergoing global warming, as evidenced by a three-fold increase in the planet's atmospheric pressure during the past 14 years, a team of astronomers from Massachusetts Institute of Technology (MIT), Williams College, the University of Hawaii, Lowell Observatory and Cornell University announced in a press conference Wednesday at the annual meeting of the American Astronomical Society's (AAS) Division for Planetary Sciences in Birmingham, Ala.
Then an astronomer makes this statement:
"Jay Pasachoff, an astronomy professor at Williams College, said that Pluto's global warming was "likely not connected with that of the Earth. The major way they could be connected is if they were caused by a large increase in sunlight. But the solar constant --the amount of sunlight received each second-- is carefully monitored by spacecraft, and we know the sun's output is much too steady to be changing the temperature of Pluto."
If not the sun, then what?
But hey lets not worry, Pluto is at the edge of our solar system right?
Well more good news follows
Sun: More activity since 1940 than in previous 1150 years, combined. Currently entering the worst Sun cycle ever seen, if the models are correct, which the seem to be considering the Sun had 7 x class flares last year, X Class are the absolute worse kind of flares, the kind if they were directed at us would wipe us out instantly.
Mercury: Unexpected polar ice discovered, along with a surprisingly strong intrinsic magnetic field … for a supposedly “dead” planet
Venus: 2500% increase in auroral brightness, and substantive global atmospheric changes in less than 30 years
Earth: Substantial and obvious world-wide weather and geophysical changes
Mars: “Global Warming,” huge storms, disappearance of polar icecaps
Jupiter: Over 200% increase in brightness of surrounding plasma clouds
Saturn: Major decrease in equatorial jet stream velocities in only ~20 years, accompanied by surprising surge of X-rays from equator
Uranus: “Really big, big changes” in brightness, increased global cloud activity
Neptune: 40% increase in atmospheric brightness
Pluto: 300% increase in atmospheric pressure, even as Pluto recedes farther from the Sun
Don't worry be happy :) :handshake:
Neil Young
31-01-07, 08:29 AM
If I were you I'd be a lot more concerned about the American naval build-up in the Gulf and the possibility of an attack on Iran.
Red_Polo
31-01-07, 08:38 AM
I find this thrad hilarious :D
redheart
31-01-07, 09:06 AM
Oh sweet lord what nonsense. This is the pseudo-scientific version of a conspiracy theory. Take some dubious, unrelated facts and tie them all together to make one big pointless theory.
This sums up this crap
"Sun: More activity since 1940 than in previous 1150 years"
What the feck does Sun activity mean? How could we accurately measure this sun activity over the period from 700-1940ad?
Even if this does all happen I will be ok. Coz I'm gonna be flying in the shuttle to destroy the asteroid just like in Armageddon
If I were you I'd be a lot more concerned about the American naval build-up in the Gulf and the possibility of an attack on Iran.
I've rented a little dinghy to get out there and cheer them on.
Kronenburg1892
31-01-07, 10:00 AM
How could we accurately measure this sun activity over the period from 700-1940ad?
The space between growth rings in tree trunks.
Those Youtube clips looked like a recruitment video for the Branch Davidians' Church.
Oh sweet lord what nonsense. This is the pseudo-scientific version of a conspiracy theory. Take some dubious, unrelated facts and tie them all together to make one big pointless theory.
This sums up this crap
"Sun: More activity since 1940 than in previous 1150 years"
What the feck does Sun activity mean? How could we accurately measure this sun activity over the period from 700-1940ad?
Even if this does all happen I will be ok. Coz I'm gonna be flying in the shuttle to destroy the asteroid just like in Armageddon
Spot on.
I have a feeling I will be reading a very similar scenario around that time and again another 10 years later. How can anyone be so convinced? I'm sure that quite a bit of what is being proposed is in the realms of reality but it's also mixed in with a nice bit of junk. What on earth does this Iraqi battery suggest? That perhaps we were once before as technologically envolved as we are now and that the earth did a reboot leaving behind a single watch and a battery as evidence?
I'm not trying to have a pop but this scare mongering doesn't really help anything and actually gives ammunition to the wankers that care very little for the pollution of this planet.
This reeks of David Icke.
tomasjj
31-01-07, 11:01 AM
"We have found huge cities under the sea, one such city more accurately a metropolis off the coast of Japan is huge and completely intact, it takes a half an hour to fly over it. We have found an ancient battery in Iraq which is 1000’s of years old. We have found a spherical clock which not only tells the time but also longitude and latitude with a level of gear sophistication which leaves us even today marveling at its complexity."
Prove this before I invest more time in this.
"We have found huge cities under the sea, one such city more accurately a metropolis off the coast of Japan is huge and completely intact, it takes a half an hour to fly over it. We have found an ancient battery in Iraq which is 1000’s of years old. We have found a spherical clock which not only tells the time but also longitude and latitude with a level of gear sophistication which leaves us even today marveling at its complexity."
Prove this before I invest more time in this.
There many examples of "sunken acient cities" around the globe" here is just a couple. All of the above are facts. observed, recorded facts. No FUCKING conspiaracy theories ... IF you dont like it FUCK OFF to another thread. Fucking ignoramus's, you have an issue with the information ask me more more info, I am just passing on information.
National Geographic Magazine will sponsor another underwater exploration of the sunken city off the Coast of Cuba this fall. Russian-Canadian oceanographer Pauline Zelitsky will head the expedition. Political differences prevent the US from participating, and much of the work has been done by France and Russia. So far, the exploration has been done by remote-controlled mini submarines, armed with video cameras. Their provocative images have shown what look like stepped pyramids, extending as far as South America (where these types of pyramids were built by the Mayans).
Zelitsky's theory is that a peninsula once stretched from the Yucatan to Cuba, which collapsed due to seismic activity. This reinforces the theory that early man did not arrive in the Americas by crossing the Bering Straits (a land bridge from Russia which no longer exists) but instead arrived from Asia via the Pacific Ocean. British archeologists have found human footprints in Puebla, Mexico that are 40,000 years old. On her early expeditions, Zelitsky discovered an underwater city with not only pyramids, but geometrically precise passages, tunnels and temples, many carved with ancient symbols. Since natural structures can be pyramid-shaped and have straight lines as well, these carvings are especially important. There is still controversy about whether the underwater pyramid off the coast of an island in Japan was manmade or is a natural formation.
Keep up with the REALLY important news by visiting unknowncountry.com every day. And listen to Dreamland, where you'll hear weekly reports of edge news by our science reporter Linda Howe. Keep us going— subscribe today.
naguni:Ancient Unknown Submerged Structures Off The Coast of Japan
Yonaguni is a small island south-west of Okinawa in the Japanese archipelago. In 1988, scuba divers led by Kihachiro Aratake discovered an enormous stone structure on the seabed off the coast of Yonaguni.
The structure lay more than 75 feet below the surface. Investigation showed it was 600 feet long, 450 feet wide and 90 feet high. The locals decided it was a natural formation.
Click and drag photo to resize. Script from The Java Script Source
Ten years later, the experts weren't so sure. The first geologist to investigate the site was Professor Masaki Kimura of Ryuku University on Okinawa. In April 1998, he discovered a structure divided into five distinct layers and decided it had to be manmade. It is easy to see why. Underwater photographs and video footage reveal a stepped, ziggurat-like monument of extraordinary proportions.
Each step is about 3 feet high with clean edges and sharp angles. There is also an archway and two parallel monoliths among other intriguing features like drainage channels. Further investigation led to the discovery of smaller satellite ziggurats near the main edifice.
Each is about 30 feet wide and 6 feet high. Each appears to be constructed of stepped slabs. Divers also found what looks like a road surrounding the main structure.
Robert Schoch, the American geologist who re-dated the sphinx, dived to examine the Yonaguni Monument and later commented that while natural water erosion and rock splitting might possibly produce a structure of this type, he had never seen anything quite like it before.
Professor Kimura was even more forthcoming. He maintained bluntly that if the sharp steps were the result of natural erosion there would be debris on the seabed surrounding them. In fact, there is none.
Click and drag photo to resize. Script from The Java Script Source
The aptly named Team Atlantis expedition who dived to make a video documentary of the site concluded that while the monument may be a natural formation in part, it had certainly been extensively modified by human hands.
In other words, someone in the depths of prehistory discovered a suitable rock formation and used sophisticated engineering techniques to shape it the way they wanted.
But if the various structures in the Yonaguni complex are artificial, there is no known Japanese civilization that could have created them. Geological dating places the site above water no later than 8000 BC. (The actual time-span is somewhere between 8000 and 10,000 BC.)
Orthodox prehistory claims the most advanced culture in Japan at the time was small groups of hunter-gatherers. As Professor Kimura points out, there is no way they could have built or even modified the Yonaguni Monument.
He believes for something of this size some sort of machinery must have been involved.
The Yonaguni Discovery;
Original American Story on the Underwater Site
by Frank Joseph -
Ancient American-Archeology of the Americas Before Columbus
One of the greatest discoveries in the history of archaeology was made last summer, off Japan.
There, spread over an amazing 311 miles on the ocean floor, are the well-preserved remains of an ancient city. Or at the very least, a number of closely related sites.
In the waters around Okinawa and beyond to the small island of Yonaguni, divers located eight separate locations beginning in March 1995. That first sighting was equivocal - a provocative, squared structure, so encrusted with coral that its manmade identity was uncertain.
Then, as recently as the summer of 1996, a sports diver accidentally discovered a huge, angular platform about 40 feet below the surface, off the southwestern shore of Okinawa. The feature's artificial provenance was beyond question.
Widening their search, teams of more divers found another, different monument nearby. Then another, and another. They beheld long streets, grand boulevards, majestic staircases, magnificent archways, enormous blocks of perfectly cut and fitted stone - all harmoniously welded together in a linear architecture unlike anything they had ever seen before.
Click and drag photo to resize. Script from The Java Script Source
(This photo of the "face" purportedly from Yonaguni sites were printed in Ancient American) In the following weeks and months, Japan's archaeological community joined the feeding-frenzy of discovery.
Trained professionals formed a healthy alliance with the enthusiasts who first made the find. In a progressive spirit of mutual respect an working alliance, academics and amateurs joined forces to set an example of cooperation for the rest of the world. Their common cause soon bore rich fruit.
In september, not far from the shore of the island of Yonaguni, more then 300 airline miles south from Okinawa, they found a gigantic, pyramidal structure in 100 feet of water.
In what appeared to be a ceremonial center of broad promenades and flanking pylons, the gargantuan building measures 240 feet long. Exceptionally clear sub-surface clarity, with 100 foot visibility a common factor, allowed for thorough photographic documentation, both still photography and video.
These images provided the basis of Japan's leading headlines for more than a year. Yet, not a word about the Okinawa discovery reached the US public, until the magazine, "Ancient American" broke the news last spring. Since that scoop, only the CNN network televised a report about Japan's underwater city. Nothing about it has been mentioned in any of the nation's other archaeology publications, not even in any of our daily newspapers.
One would imagine that such a mind-boggling find would be the most exciting piece of news an archaeologist could possibly hope to learn. Even so, outside of the "Ancient American" and CNN's single report, the pall of silence covering all the facts about Okinawa's structures screens them from view more effectively then their location at the bottom of the sea.
Why? How can this appalling neglect persist in the face of a discovery of such unparalleled magnitude? At the risk of accusations of paranoia, one might conclude that a real conspiracy of managed information dominates America's well-springs of public knowledge.
Click and drag photo to resize. Script from The Java Script Source
(Photo Carved Stairway?)
UPDATE MAY 2001 Japanese Scientists Say Yonaguni Pyramid Manmade
Massive Steps
Complex Structure
"On Dreamland, Ancient American Magazine editor Frank Joseph reports on a conference he recently attended in Japan at which Japanese geologists and archaeologists argued that the sunken pyramid off the island of Yonaguni near Okinawa has been found to be manmade.
It appears to be a construction made of wide terraces, ramps and large steps. However, American geologists have contented that the structure is not manmade, but a natural formation.
According to the report, Japanese scientists have documented marks on the stones that indicate that they were hewn. Not only that, the tools used in this process have been found in the area, and carvings have been discovered. A small stairway carved into the rocks appears to render the theory that this is a natural formation implausible.
The problem with all of this for western scientists is that it implies that an unknown eastern culture had developed a high degree of organization thousands of years before the earliest western civilizations. Geologically, the Yonaguni pyramid sank into the ocean at the end of the last ice age, around ten thousand years ago.
Some western geologists have theorized that, if it is manmade, it must have risen from the sea in more recent times, and been carved then.
However, the discovery of other, similar structures beneath the sea of Japan was also announced at the conference. If these prove to be similar to the Yonaguni pyramid they may rewrite the history of early man."..Source UK INFORMER
Sorry Tom that tirade was not directed at you mate, its the sarcy ***** who just have sniggering pot shots like a bunch of schoolyard reatards. Ok so these things fall out of the your fucking bob and jane normall run of the mill east enders wankfeast but it does not mean its not true. Check it out before you start running your mouth of ..
What the feck does Sun activity mean ? Fuck me I can't help you out with that look it up you thick streak of shite
Breath in ... Breath out ..
Peace brothers :handshake:
Oh enlightend us great one. Give me a min though as two pints of lager and a packet of crisps is on.
Brililantly self-righteous! Us common folk clearly live in the shadow of your genius.
For the record, I found the thread very interesting even if I didn't buy in to it completely and was making a serious point about this sort of information being dangerous ammunition to those that wish to continue polluting the earth and using conspiracy material to back up their claim that the true effects of global warming are minimal.
Oh enlightend us great one. Give me a min though as two pints of lager and a packet of crisps is on.
Brililantly self-righteous! Us common folk clearly live in the shadow of your genius.
Yeah nice one mate :handshake:
Kronenburg1892
31-01-07, 12:57 PM
Have you got any more info on that clock?
I've heard about Maui's Tanawa used around 250 BC, but that had no cogs in it.
As for the Baghdad batteries, all that would require to be discovered would be for a servant to pour soured wine into a copper jug whilst stirring with an iron spoon.
As for underwater cities, stuff sinks all the time. Japan's Kansai International Airport is a modern day example, the terminal building needs to be jacked up a few centimetres every year.
This global cyclical 'reset', where 90% of all life is killed off every few thousand years, seems to me to have it's theoretical 'linkage' and roots in 'old testament' indoctrination. Absolutely no archeological data supports such a regular and rapid global extinction. You have more credence with Milankovitch cycles, which show the earth going into ice age every 100,000 years, which is way beyond what these guys are talking about.
captainfog
31-01-07, 01:10 PM
The problem i have with this theory Nicey, is that when the acient south American civilisations dissapeared, Europe appears to have been unnafected
tomasjj
31-01-07, 01:18 PM
Sorry Tom that tirade was not directed at you mate, its the sarcy ***** who just have sniggering pot shots like a bunch of schoolyard reatards. Ok so these things fall out of the your fucking bob and jane normall run of the mill east enders wankfeast but it does not mean its not true. Check it out before you start running your mouth of ..
What the feck does Sun activity mean ? Fuck me I can't help you out with that look it up you thick streak of shite
Breath in ... Breath out ..
Peace brothers :handshake:
Good thing I saw this before emptying both barrels in your direction.
Is this tirade directed at me then?
Cool down mate.
:)
steveheighwayrobbery
31-01-07, 01:41 PM
Lord Coe will be pissed.drunk as a lord?
redheart
31-01-07, 02:20 PM
Sorry Tom that tirade was not directed at you mate, its the sarcy ***** who just have sniggering pot shots like a bunch of schoolyard reatards. Ok so these things fall out of the your fucking bob and jane normall run of the mill east enders wankfeast but it does not mean its not true. Check it out before you start running your mouth of ..
What the feck does Sun activity mean ? Fuck me I can't help you out with that look it up you thick streak of shite
Breath in ... Breath out ..
Peace brothers :handshake:
Typical conspiracy theory nutter. Dreamland...oh dear.....nerdy nerdy..anorak.
As for sun activity. I am sure that there are many different types of activities by the sun. Thus to give such a broad pointless statement is meaningless.
You may as well state that in the last 50 years there has been more activity from the earth than in the previous 1000 years. It is meaningless. What type of activity?
Red Chilli
31-01-07, 02:48 PM
Typical conspiracy theory nutter. Dreamland...oh dear.....nerdy nerdy..anorak.
As for sun activity. I am sure that there are many different types of activities by the sun. Thus to give such a broad pointless statement is meaningless.
You may as well state that in the last 50 years there has been more activity from the earth than in the previous 1000 years. It is meaningless. What type of activity?
He's probably talking about thermo nuclear activity. Just a guess from a layman.
Typical conspiracy theory nutter. Dreamland...oh dear.....nerdy nerdy..anorak.
As for sun activity. I am sure that there are many different types of activities by the sun. Thus to give such a broad pointless statement is meaningless.
You may as well state that in the last 50 years there has been more activity from the earth than in the previous 1000 years. It is meaningless. What type of activity?
Kindly go fuck yourself
Typical conspiracy theory nutter. Dreamland...oh dear.....nerdy nerdy..anorak.
As for sun activity. I am sure that there are many different types of activities by the sun. Thus to give such a broad pointless statement is meaningless.
You may as well state that in the last 50 years there has been more activity from the earth than in the previous 1000 years. It is meaningless. What type of activity?
Taken directly from Nasa Dipshit :whatever:
Dec. 21, 2006: Evidence is mounting: the next solar cycle is going to be a big one.
see captionSolar cycle 24, due to peak in 2010 or 2011 "looks like its going to be one of the most intense cycles since record-keeping began almost 400 years ago," says solar physicist David Hathaway of the Marshall Space Flight Center. He and colleague Robert Wilson presented this conclusion last week at the American Geophysical Union meeting in San Francisco.
Right: An erupting solar prominence photographed by the Solar and Heliospheric Observatory (SOHO). [More]
Their forecast is based on historical records of geomagnetic storms.
Hathaway explains: "When a gust of solar wind hits Earth's magnetic field, the impact causes the magnetic field to shake. If it shakes hard enough, we call it a geomagnetic storm." In the extreme, these storms cause power outages and make compass needles swing in the wrong direction. Auroras are a beautiful side-effect.
Hathaway and Wilson looked at records of geomagnetic activity stretching back almost 150 years and noticed something useful:. "The amount of geomagnetic activity now tells us what the solar cycle is going to be like 6 to 8 years in the future," says Hathaway. A picture is worth a thousand words:
see caption
Above: Peaks in geomagnetic activity (red) foretell solar maxima (black) more than six years in advance. [More]
In the plot, above, black curves are solar cycles; the amplitude is the sunspot number. Red curves are geomagnetic indices, specifically the Inter-hour Variability Index or IHV. "These indices are derived from magnetometer data recorded at two points on opposite sides of Earth: one in England and another in Australia. IHV data have been taken every day since 1868," says Hathaway.
Cross correlating sunspot number vs. IHV, they found that the IHV predicts the amplitude of the solar cycle 6-plus years in advance with a 94% correlation coefficient.
"We don't know why this works," says Hathaway. The underlying physics is a mystery. "But it does work."
see captionAccording to their analysis, the next Solar Maximum should peak around 2010 with a sunspot number of 160 plus or minus 25. This would make it one of the strongest solar cycles of the past fifty years—which is to say, one of the strongest in recorded history.
Left: Hathaway and Wilson's prediction for the amplitude of Solar Cycle 24. [More]
Astronomers have been counting sunspots since the days of Galileo, watching solar activity rise and fall every 11 years. Curiously, four of the five biggest cycles on record have come in the past 50 years. "Cycle 24 should fit right into that pattern," says Hathaway.
These results are just the latest signs pointing to a big Cycle 24. Most compelling of all, believes Hathaway, is the work of Mausumi Dikpati and colleagues at the National Center for Atmospheric Research (NCAR) in Boulder, Colorado. "They have combined observations of the sun’s 'Great Conveyor Belt' with a sophisticated computer model of the sun’s inner dynamo to produce a physics-based prediction of the next solar cycle." In short, it's going to be intense. Details may be found in the Science@NASA story Solar Storm Warning.
Have you got any more info on that clock?
I've heard about Maui's Tanawa used around 250 BC, but that had no cogs in it.
As for the Baghdad batteries, all that would require to be discovered would be for a servant to pour soured wine into a copper jug whilst stirring with an iron spoon.
As for underwater cities, stuff sinks all the time. Japan's Kansai International Airport is a modern day example, the terminal building needs to be jacked up a few centimetres every year.
This global cyclical 'reset', where 90% of all life is killed off every few thousand years, seems to me to have it's theoretical 'linkage' and roots in 'old testament' indoctrination. Absolutely no archeological data supports such a regular and rapid global extinction. You have more credence with Milankovitch cycles, which show the earth going into ice age every 100,000 years, which is way beyond what these guys are talking about.
I'll try and track it down mate, again this piece of information is not conjecture or rumor, said clock is sitting in some museum right now.
:handshake:
Have you got any more info on that clock?
I've heard about Maui's Tanawa used around 250 BC, but that had no cogs in it.
As for the Baghdad batteries, all that would require to be discovered would be for a servant to pour soured wine into a copper jug whilst stirring with an iron spoon.
As for underwater cities, stuff sinks all the time. Japan's Kansai International Airport is a modern day example, the terminal building needs to be jacked up a few centimetres every year.
This global cyclical 'reset', where 90% of all life is killed off every few thousand years, seems to me to have it's theoretical 'linkage' and roots in 'old testament' indoctrination. Absolutely no archeological data supports such a regular and rapid global extinction. You have more credence with Milankovitch cycles, which show the earth going into ice age every 100,000 years, which is way beyond what these guys are talking about.
First Published in Science ... you know the Conspiracy Theory Mag Like that Fringo organization Nasa
Here you go mate I think this is it .. 2000 years old !! :handshake:
In 1901 divers working off the isle of Antikythera found the remains of a clocklike mechanism 2,000 years old. The mechanism now appears to have been a device for calculating the motions of stars and planets
Among the treasures of the Greek National Archaeological Museum in Athens are the remains of the most complex scientific object that has been preserved from antiquity. Corroded and crumbling from 2,000 years under the sea, its dials, gear wheels and inscribed plates present the historian with a tantalizing problem. Because of them we may have to revise many of our estimates of Greek science. By studying them we may find vital clues to the true origins of that high scientific technology which hitherto has seemed peculiar to our modern civilization, setting it apart from all cultures of the past.
From the evidence of the fragments one can get a good idea of the appearance of the original object [see illustration on page 62]. Consisting of a box with dials on the outside and a very complex assembly of gear wheels mounted within, it must have resembled a well- made 18ih-century clock. Doors hinged to the box served to protect the dials, and on all available surfaces of box, doors and dials there were long Greek inscriptions describing the operation and construction of the instrument. At least 20 gear wheels of the mechanism have been preserved, including a very sophisticated assembly of gears that were mounted eccentrically on a turntable and probably functioned as a sort of epicyclic or differential, gear-system.
Nothing like this instrument is preserved elsewhere. Nothing comparable to it is known. from any ancient scientific text or literary allusion. On the contrary, from all that we know of science and technology in the Hellenistic Age we should have felt that such a device could not exist. Some historians have suggested that the Greeks were not interested in experiment because of a contempt-perhaps induced by the existence of the institution of slavery-for manual labor. On the other hand it has long been recognized that in abstract mathematics and in mathematical astronomy they were no beginners but rather "fellows of another college" who reached great heights of sophistication. Many of the Greek scientific devices known to us from written descriptions show much mathematical ingenuity, but in all cases the purely mechanical part of the design seems relatively crude. Gearing was clearly known to the Greeks, but it was used only in relatively simple applications. They employed pairs of gears to change angular speed or mechanical ad- vantage, or to apply power through a right angle, as in the water-driven mill.
Even the most complex mechanical devices described by the ancient writers Hero of Alexandria and Vitruvius contained only simple gearing. For example, the taximeter used by the Greeks to measure the distance travelled by the wheels of a carriage employed only pairs of gears (or gears and worms) to achieve the necessary ratio of movement. It could be argued that if the Greeks knew the principle of gearing, they should have had no difficulty in constructing mechanisms as complex as epicyclic gears. We now know from the fragments in the National Museum that the Greeks did make such mechanisms, but the knowledge is so unexpected that some scholars at first thought that the fragments must belong to some more modern device.
Can we in fact be sure that the device is ancient? If we can, what was its purpose? What can it tell us of the ancient world and of the evolution of modern science?
To authenticate the dating of the fragments We must. tell the story of their discovery, which involves the first (though inadvertent) adventure in underwater archaeology. Just before Easter in 1900 a party of Dodecanese sponge-divers were driven by storm to anchor near the tiny southern Greek island of Antikythera (the accent is on the "kyth," pronounced to rhyme with pith). There, at a depth of some 200 feet, they found the wreck of an ancient ship. With the help of Greek archaeologists the wreck was explored; several fine bronze and marble statues and other objects were recovered. The finds created great excitement, but the difficulties of diving without heavy equipment were immense, and in September, 1901, the "dig' was abandoned. Eight months later Valerios StaÎs, an archaeologist at the National Museum, was examining some calcified lumps of corroded bronze that had been set aside as possible pieces of broken statuary. Suddenly he recognized among them the fragments of a mechanism.
It is now accepted that the wreck occurred during the first century B.C. Gladys Weinberg of Athens has been kind enough to report to me the results of several recent archaeological examinations of the amphorae, pottery and minor objects from the ship. It appears from her report that one might reason-ably date the wreck more closely as 65 B.C. ±15 years. Furthermore, since the identifiable objects come from Rhodes and Cos, it seems that the ship may have. been voyaging from these islands to Rome, perhaps without calling at the Greek mainland.
The fragment that first caught the eye of StaÎs was one of the corroded, inscribed plates that is an integral part of the Antikythera mechanism, as the device later came to be called. StaÎs saw immediately that the inscription was ancient. In the opinion of the epigrapher Benjamin Dean Meritt, the forms of the letters are those of the 'first century B.C.; they could hardly be older than 100 B.C. nor younger than the time of Christ. The dating is supported by the content of the inscriptions. The words used and their astronomical sense are all of this period. For example, the most extensive and complete piece of inscription is part of a parapegma (astronomical calendar) similar to that written by one Geminos, who is thought to have lived in Rhodes about 77 B.C. We may thus be reasonably sure that the mechanism did not find its way into the wreck at some later period. Furthermore, it cannot have been very old when it was taken aboard the ship as booty or merchandise.
As soon as the fragments had been discovered they were examined by every available archaeologist; so began the long and difficult process of identifying the mechanism and determining its function. Some things were clear from the beginning. The unique importance of the object was obvious, and the gearing was impressively complex. From the inscriptions and the dials the mechanism was correctly identified as an astronomical device. The first conjecture was that it was some kind of navigating instrument – perhaps an astrolabe (a sort of circular star-finder map also used for simple observations). Some thought that it might be a small planetarium of the kind that Archirnedes is said to have made. Unfortunately the fragments were covered by a thick curtain of calcified material and corrosion products, and these concealed so much detail that no one could be sure of his conjectures or reconstructions. There was nothing to do but wait for the slow and delicate work of the Museum technicians in cleaning away this curtain. Meantime, as the work proceeded, several scholars published accounts of all that was visible, and through their labors a general picture of the mechanism began to emerge.
On the basis of new photographs made for me by the Museum in 1955 I realized that the work of cleaning had reached a point where it might at last be possible to take the work of identification to a new level. Last summer, wilt the assistance of a grant from the American Philosophical Society, I was able to visit Athens and make a minute examination of the fragments. By good fortune George Stamires, a Greek epigrapher, was there at the same time; he was able to give me invaluable help by deciphering and transcribing much more of the inscriptions than had been read before. We are now in the position of being able to "join" the fragments and to see how they fitted together in the original machine and when they were brought up from the sea [see illustration's on these two pages]. The success of this work has been most significant, for previously it had been supposed that the various dials and plates had been badly squashed together and distorted. It now appears that most of the pieces are very nearly in their original places, and that we have a much larger fraction of the complete device than had been thought. This work also provides a clue to the puzzle of why the fragments lay unrecognized until StaÎs saw them. When they were found, the fragments were probably held together in their original positions by the remains of the wooden frame of the case. In the Museum the waterlogged wood dried and shrivelled. The fragments then fell apart, revealing the interior of the mechanism, with its gears and inscribed plates.
As a result of the new examinations we shall in due course be able to publish a technical account of the fragments and of the construction of the instrument. In the meantime we can tentatively summarize some of these results and show how they help to answer the question. What is it?
There are four ways of getting at the answer First, if we knew the details of the mechanism, we should know what it did. Second, if we could read the dials, we could tell what they showed. Third, if we could understand the inscriptions, they might tell us about the mechanism. Fourth, if we knew of any similar mechanism, analogies might be helpful. All these approaches must be used, for none of them is complete.
The geared wheels within the mechanism were mounted on a bronze plate [third from right on preceding page]. On one side of the plate we can trace all the gear wheels of the assembly and can determine, at least approximately, how many teeth each had and how they meshed together. On the other side we can do nearly as well, but we still lack vital links that would provide a complete picture of the gearing. The general pattern of the mechanism is nonetheless quite clear. An input was provided by an axle that came through the side of the casing and turned a crown-gear wheel. This moved a big, four-spoked driving-wheel that was connected with two trains of gears that respectively led up and down the plate and were connected by axles to gears on the other side of the plate. On that side the gear-trains continued, leading through an epicyclic turntable and coming eventually to a set of shafts that turned the dial pointers. When the input axle was turned, the pointers all moved at various speeds around their dials.
Certain structural features of the mechanism deserve special attention. All the metal parts of the machine seem to have been cut from a single sheet of low-tin bronze about two millimeters thick; no parts were cast or made of another metal. There are indications that the maker may have used a sheet made much earlier–uniform metal plate of good quality was probably rare and expensive. All the gear wheels have been made with teeth of just the same angle (60 degrees) and size, so that any wheel could mesh with any other. There are signs that the machine was repaired at least twice; a spoke of the driving wheel
has been mended, and a broken tooth in a small wheel has been replaced. This indicates that the machine actually worked.
The casing was provided with three dials, one at the front and two at the back. The fragments of all of them are still covered with pieces of the doors of the casing and with other debris. Very little can be read on the dials, but there is hope that they can be cleaned sufficiently to provide information that might be decisive. The front dial is just clean enough to say exactly what it did. It has two scales, one of which is fixed and displays the names of the signs of the zodiac; the other is on a movable slip ring and shows the months of the year. Both scales are carefully marked off in degrees. The front dial fitted exactly over the main driving-wheel, which seems to have turned the pointer by means of an eccentric drum-assembly. Clearly this dial showed the annual motion of the sun in the zodiac. By means of key letters inscribed on the zodiac scale, corresponding to other letters on the parapegma calendar plate, it also showed the main risings and settings of bright stars and constellations throughout the year.
The back dials are more complex and less legible. The lower one had three slip rings; the upper, four. Each had a little subsidiary dial resembling the "seconds" dial of a watch. Each of the large dials is inscribed with lines about every six degrees, and between the lines there are letters and numbers. On the lower dial the letters and numbers seem to record "moon, so many hours; sun, so many hours"; we therefore suggest that this scale indicates the main lunar phenomena of phases and times of rising and setting. On the upper dial the inscriptions are much more crowded and might well present information on the risings and settings, stations and retrogradations of the planets known to the Greeks (Mercury, Venus, Mars, Jupiter and Saturn).
Some of the technical details of the dials are especially interesting. The front dial provides the only known extensive specimen from antiquity of a scientifically graduated instrument. When we measure the accuracy of the graduations under the microscope, we find that their average error over the visible 45 degrees is about a quarter of a degree. The way in which the error varies suggests that the arc was first geometrically divided and then subdivided by eye only. Even more important, this dial may give a means of dating the instrument astronomically. The slip ring is necessary because the old Egyptian calendar, having no leap years, fell into error by 1/4 day every year; the month scale thus had to be adjusted by this amount. As they are preserved the two scales of the dial are out of phase by 13½ degrees. Standard tables show that this amount could only occur in the year 80 B.C. and (because we do not know the month) at all years just 120 years (i.e., 30 days divided by 1/4 day per year) before or after that date. Alternative dates are archaeologically unlikely: 200 B.C. is too early; 40 A.D. is too late. Hence, if the slip ring has not moved from its last position, it was set in. 80 B.C. Furthermore, if we are right in supposing that a fiducial mark near the month scale was put there originally to provide a means of setting that scale in case of accidental movement, we can tell more. This mark is exactly 1/2 degree away from the present position of the scale, and this implies that the mark was made two years before the setting. Thus, although the evidence is by no means conclusive, we are led to suggest that the instrument was made about 82 B.C., used for two years (just long enough for the repairs to have been needed) and then taken onto the ship within the next 30 years.
The fragments show that the original instrument carried at least four large areas of inscription: outside the front door, inside the back door, on the plate between the two back dials and on the parapegma plates near the front dial. As I have noted, there are also inscriptions around all the dials, and furthermore each part and hole would seem to have had identifying letters so that the pieces could be put together in the correct order and position. The main inscriptions are in a sorry state and only short snatches of them can be read. To provide an idea of their condition it need only be said that in some cases a plate has completely disappeared, leaving behind an impression of its letters, standing up in a mirror image, in relief on the soft corrosion products on the plate below. It is remarkable that such inscriptions can be read at all.
But even from the evidence of a few complete words one can get an idea of the subject matter. The sun is mentioned several times, and the planet Venus once; terms are used that refer to the stations and retrogradations of planets; the ecliptic is named. Pointers, apparently those of the dials, are mentioned. A line of one inscription signfficantly records "76 years, 19 years." This refers to the well-known Calippic cycle of 76 years, which is four times the Metonic cycle of 19 years, or 235 synodic (lunar) months. The next line includes the number "223," which refers to the eclipse cycle of 223 lunar months.
Putting together the information gathered so far, it seems reasonable to suppose that the whole purpose of the Antikythera device was to mechanize just this sort of cyclical relation, which was a strong feature of ancient astronomy. Using the cycles that have been mentioned, one could easily design gearing that would operate from one dial having a wheel that revolved annually, and turn by this gearing a series of other wheels which would move pointers indicating the sidereal, synodic and draconitic months. Similar cycles were known for the planetary phenomena; in fact, this type of arithmetical theory is the central theme of Seleucid Babylonian astronomy, which was transmitted to the Hellenistic world in the last few centuries B.C. Such arithmetical schemes are quite distinct from the geometrical theory of circles and epicycles in astronomy, which seems to have been essentially Greek. The two types of theory were unified and brought to their peak in the second century A.D. by Claudius Ptolemy, whose labors marked the triumph of the new mathematical attitude toward geometrical models that still characterizes physics today.
The Antikythera mechanism must therefore be an arithmetical counterpart of the much more familiar geometrical models of the solar system which were known to Plato and Archimedes and evolved into the orrery and the planetarium. The mechanism is like. a great astronomical clock without an escapement, or like a modern analogue computer which uses mechanical parts to save tedious calculation. It is a pity that we have no way of knowing whether the device was turned automatically or by hand. It might have been held in the hand and turned by a wheel at the side so that it would operate as a computer, possibly for astrological use. I feel it is more likely that it was permanently mounted, perhaps set in a statue, and displayed as an exhibition piece. In that case it might well have been turned by the power from a water clock or some other device. Perhaps it is just such a wondrous device that was mounted inside the famous Tower of Winds in Athens. It is certainly very similar to the great astronomical cathedral clocks that were built all over Europe during the Renaissance.
It is to the prehistory of the mechanical I clock that we must look for important analogies the Antikythera mechanism and for an assessment of its significance. Unlike other mechanical devices, the clock did not evolve from the simple to the complex. The oldest clocks of which we are well informed were the most complicated. All the evidence points to the fact that the clock started as an astronomical showpiece that happened also to indicate the time. Gradually the timekeeping functions became more important and the device that showed the marvelous clockwork of the heavens became subsidiary. Behind the astronomical clocks of the 14th century there stretches an unbroken sequence of mechanical models of astronomical theory. At the head of this sequence is the Antikythera mechanism. Following it are instruments and clocklike computers known from Islam, from China and India and from the European Middle Ages. The importance of this line is very great, because it was the tradition of clock- making that preserved most of man's skill in scientific fine mechanics. During the Renaissance the scientific instrument-makers evolved from the clockmakers. Thus the Antikythera mechanism is, in a way, the venerable progenitor of all our present plethora of scientific hardware.
A significant passage in this story has to do with the astronomical computers of Islam. Preserved complete at the Museum of History of Science at Oxford is a 13th-century Islamic geared calendar-computer that has various periods built into it, so that it shows on dials the various cycles of the sun and moon. This design can be traced back, with slightly different periods but a similar arrangement of gears, to a manuscript written by the astronomer al-Biruni about 1000 A.D. Such instruments am much simpler than the Antikythera mechanism, but they show so many points of agreement in technical detail that it seems clear they came from a common tradition. The same 60-degree gear teeth are used; wheels are mounted on square-shanked axles; the geometrical layout of the gear assembly appears comparable. It was just at this time that Islam was drawing on Greek knowledge and rediscovering ancient Greek texts. It seems likely that the Antikythera tradition was part of a large corpus of knowledge that has since been lost to us but was known to the Arabs. It was developed and transmitted by them to medieval Europe, where it .became the foundation for the whole range of subsequent invention in the field of clockwork.
On the one hand the Islamic devices knit the whole story together, and demonstrate that it is through ancestry and not mere coincidence that the Antikythera mechanism resembles a modern clock. On the other hand they show that the Antikythera mechanism was no flash in the pan but was a part of an important current in Hellenistic civilization. History has contrived to keep that current dark to us, and only the accidental underwater preservation of fragments that would otherwise have crumbled to dust has now brought it to light. It is a bit frightening to know that just before the fall of their great civilization the ancient Greeks had come so close to our age, not only in their thought, but also in their scientific technology.
In 1936, while excavating ruins of a 2000-year-old village near Baghdad, workers discovered mysterious small vase. A 6-inch-high pot of bright yellow clay dating back two millennia contained a cylinder of sheet-copper 5 inches by 1.5 inches. The edge of the copper cylinder was soldered with a 60-40 lead-tin alloy comparable to today's solder. The bottom of the cylinder was capped with a crimped-in copper disk and sealed with bitumen or asphalt. Another insulating layer of asphalt sealed the top and also held in place an iron rod suspended into the center of the copper cylinder. The rod showed evidence of having been corroded with an acidic agent.
An Ancient Battery
German archaeologist , Wilhelm Konig, examined the object and came to a surprising conclusion that the clay pot was nothing less than an ancient electric battery.
The ancient battery in the Baghdad Museum
The ancient battery in the Baghdad Museum, as well as those others which were unearthed in Iraq, are all dated from the Parthian occupation between 248 BCE and 226 CE. However, Dr. Konig also found copper vases plated with silver in the Baghdad Museum, excavated from Sumerian sites in southern Iraq, dating back to at least 2500 BCE. When the vases were lightly tapped, a blue patina or film separated from the surface, which is characteristic of silver electroplated onto copper base. It would appear then that the Parthians inherited their batteries from one of the earliest known civilizations.
In 1940, Willard F.M. Gray, an engineer at the General Electric High Volatage Laboratory in Pittsfield, Massachusetts, read of Konig's theory. Using drawings and details supplied by German rocket scientist Willy Ley, Gray made a replica of the battery. Using copper sulfate solution, it generated about half a volt of electricity.
In 1970s, German Egyptologist, Arne Eggebrecht built a replica of the Baghdad battery and filled it with freshly pressed grape juice, as he speculated the
ancients might have done. The replica generated 0.87V. He used current from the battery to electroplate a silver statuette with gold.
This experiment proved that electric batteries were used some 1,800 years before their modern invention by Alessandro Volta in 1799.
It also seems that the use of similar batteries can be safely placed into ancient Egypt, where several objects with traces of electroplated precious metals have been found at different locations. There are several anomalous finds from other regions, which suggests use of electricity on a grander scale.
The Riddle of "Baghdad's batteries"
Arran Frood investigates what could have been the very first batteries and how these important archaeological and technological artefacts are now at risk from the impending war in Iraq.
I don't think anyone can say for sure what they were used for, but they may have been batteries because they do work Dr Marjorie Senechal
War can destroy more than a people, an army or a leader. Culture, tradition and history also lie in the firing line.
Iraq has a rich national heritage. The Garden of Eden and the Tower of Babel are said to have been sited in this ancient land.
In any war, there is a chance that priceless treasures will be lost forever, articles such as the "ancient battery" that resides defenceless in the museum of Baghdad.
For this object suggests that the region, whose civilizations gave us writing and the wheel, may also have invented electric cells - two thousand years before such devices were well known.
Biblical clues
It was in 1938, while working in Khujut Rabu, just outside Baghdad in modern day Iraq, that German archaeologist Wilhelm Konig unearthed a five-inch-long (13 cm) clay jar containing a copper cylinder that encased an iron rod.
THE KEY COMPONENTS
Batteries dated to around 200 BC Could have been used in gilding
The vessel showed signs of corrosion, and early tests revealed that an acidic agent, such as vinegar or wine had been present.
In the early 1900s, many European archaeologists were excavating ancient Mesopotamian sites, looking for evidence of Biblical tales like the Tree of Knowledge and Noah's flood.
Konig did not waste his time finding alternative explanations for his discovery. To him, it had to have been a battery.
Though this was hard to explain, and did not sit comfortably with the religious ideology of the time, he published his conclusions. But soon the world was at war, and his discovery was forgotten.
Scientific awareness
More than 60 years after their discovery, the batteries of Baghdad - as there are perhaps a dozen of them - are shrouded in myth.
"The batteries have always attracted interest as curios," says Dr Paul Craddock, a metallurgy expert of the ancient Near East from the British Museum.
"They are a one-off. As far as we know, nobody else has found anything like these. They are odd things; they are one of life's enigmas."
No two accounts of them are the same. Some say the batteries were excavated, others that Konig found them in the basement of the Baghdad Museum when he took over as director. There is no definite figure on how many have been found, and their age is disputed.
Most sources date the batteries to around 200 BC - in the Parthian era, circa 250 BC to AD 225. Skilled warriors, the Parthians were not noted for their scientific achievements.
"Although this collection of objects is usually dated as Parthian, the grounds for this are unclear," says Dr St John Simpson, also from the department of the ancient Near East at the British Museum.
"The pot itself is Sassanian. This discrepancy presumably lies either in a misidentification of the age of the ceramic vessel, or the site at which they were found."
Underlying principles
In the history of the Middle East, the Sassanian period (circa AD 225 - 640) marks the end of the ancient and the beginning of the more scientific medieval era.
Though most archaeologists agree the devices were batteries, there is much conjecture as to how they could have been discovered, and what they were used for.
How could ancient Persian science have grasped the principles of electricity and arrived at this knowledge?
Perhaps they did not. Many inventions are conceived before the underlying principles are properly understood.
The Chinese invented gunpowder long before the principles of combustion were deduced, and the rediscovery of old herbal medicines is now a common occurrence.
You do not always have to understand why something works - just that it does.
Enough zap
It is certain the Baghdad batteries could conduct an electric current because many replicas have been made, including by students of ancient history under the direction of Dr Marjorie Senechal, professor of the history of science and technology, Smith College, US.
"I don't think anyone can say for sure what they were used for, but they may have been batteries because they do work," she says. Replicas can produce voltages from 0.8 to nearly two volts.
Making an electric current requires two metals with different electro potentials and an ion carrying solution, known as an electrolyte, to ferry the electrons between them.
Connected in series, a set of batteries could theoretically produce a much higher voltage, though no wires have ever been found that would prove this had been the case.
"It's a pity we have not found any wires," says Dr Craddock. "It means our interpretation of them could be completely wrong."
But he is sure the objects are batteries and that there could be more of them to discover. "Other examples may exist that lie in museums elsewhere unrecognised".
He says this is especially possible if any items are missing, as the objects only look like batteries when all the pieces are in place.
Possible uses
Some have suggested the batteries may have been used medicinally.
The ancient Greeks wrote of the pain killing effect of electric fish when applied to the soles of the feet.
The Chinese had developed acupuncture by this time, and still use acupuncture combined with an electric current. This may explain the presence of needle-like objects found with some of the batteries.
But this tiny voltage would surely have been ineffective against real pain, considering the well-recorded use of other painkillers in the ancient world like cannabis, opium and wine.
Other scientists believe the batteries were used for electroplating - transferring a thin layer of metal on to another metal surface - a technique still used today and a common classroom experiment.
This idea is appealing because at its core lies the mother of many inventions: money.
In the making of jewellery, for example, a layer of gold or silver is often applied to enhance its beauty in a process called gilding.
Grape electrolyte
Two main techniques of gilding were used at the time and are still in use today: hammering the precious metal into thin strips using brute force, or mixing it with a mercury base which is then pasted over the article.
These techniques are effective, but wasteful compared with the addition of a small but consistent layer of metal by electro-deposition. The ability to mysteriously electroplate gold or silver on to such objects would not only save precious resources and money, but could also win you important friends at court.
Let's hope the world manages to resolve its present problems so people can go and see them. Dr Paul Craddock
A palace, kingdom, or even the sultan's daughter may have been the reward for such knowledge - and motivation to keep it secret.
Testing this idea in the late seventies, Dr Arne Eggebrecht, then director of Roemer and Pelizaeus Museum in Hildesheim, connected many replica Baghdad batteries together using grape juice as an electrolyte, and claimed to have deposited a thin layer of silver on to another surface, just one ten thousandth of a millimetre thick.
Other researchers though, have disputed these results and have been unable to replicate them.
"There does not exist any written documentation of the experiments which took place here in 1978," says Dr Bettina Schmitz, currently a researcher based at the same Roemer and Pelizaeus Museum.
"The experiments weren't even documented by photos, which really is a pity," she says. "I have searched through the archives of this museum and I talked to everyone involved in 1978 with no results."
Tingling idols
Although a larger voltage can be obtained by connecting more than one battery together, it is the ampage which is the real limiting factor, and many doubt whether a high enough power could ever have been obtained, even from tens of Baghdad batteries.
One serious flaw with the electroplating hypothesis is the lack of items from this place and time that have been treated in this way.
"The examples we see from this region and era are conventional gild plating and mercury gilding," says Dr Craddock. "There's never been any untouchable evidence to support the electroplating theory."
He suggests a cluster of the batteries, connected in parallel, may have been hidden inside a metal statue or idol.
He thinks that anyone touching this statue may have received a tiny but noticeable electric shock, something akin to the static discharge that can infect offices, equipment and children's parties.
"I have always suspected you would get tricks done in the temple," says Dr Craddock. "The statue of a god could be wired up and then the priest would ask you questions.
"If you gave the wrong answer, you'd touch the statue and would get a minor shock along with perhaps a small mysterious blue flash of light. Get the answer right, and the trickster or priest could disconnect the batteries and no shock would arrive - the person would then be convinced of the power of the statue, priest and the religion."
Magical rituals
It is said that to the uninitiated, science cannot be distinguished from magic. "In Egypt we know this sort of thing happened with Hero's engine," Dr Craddock says.
Hero's engine was a primitive steam-driven machine, and like the battery of Baghdad, no one is quite sure what it was used for, but are convinced it could work.
If this idol could be found, it would be strong evidence to support the new theory. With the batteries inside, was this object once revered, like the Oracle of Delphi in Greece, and "charged" with godly powers?
Even if the current were insufficient to provide a genuine shock, it may have felt warm, a bizarre tingle to the touch of the unsuspecting finger.
At the very least, it could have just been the container of these articles, to keep their secret safe.
Perhaps it is too early to say the battery has been convincingly demonstrated to be part of a magical ritual. Further examination, including accurate dating, of the batteries' components are needed to really answer this mystery.
No one knows if such an idol or statue that could have hidden the batteries really exists, but perhaps the opportunity to look is not too far away - if the items survive the looming war in the Middle East.
"These objects belong to the successors of the people who made them," says Dr Craddock. "Let's hope the world manages to resolve its present problems so people can go and see them."
500,000 year old spark plugs ?
While mineral hunting in the mountains of California near Olancha during the winter of 1961, Wallace Lane, Virginia Maxey and Mike Mikesell found a rock, among many others, that they thought was a geode - a good addition for their gem shop. Upon cutting it open, however, Mikesell found an object inside that seemed to be made of white porcelain. In the center was a shaft of shiny metal. Experts estimated that, if this was a geode, it should have taken about 500,000 years for this fossil-encrusted nodule to form, yet the object inside was obviously of sophisticated human manufacture. Further investigation revealed that the porcelain was surround by a hexagonal casing, and an x-ray revealed a tiny spring at one end, like a spark plug. There's a bit of controversy around this artifact, as you can imagine. Some contend that the artifact was not inside a geode at all, but encased in hardened clay. The artifact itself has been identified by experts as a 1920s-era Champion spark plug. Unfortunately, the Coso Artifact has gone missing and cannot be thoroughly examined. Is there a natural explanation for it? Or was it found, as the discoverer claimed, inside a geode? If so, how could a 1920s sparkplug get inside a 500,000-year-old rock?
Humans were not even around 65 million years ago, never mind people who could work metal. So then how does science explain semi-ovoid metallic tubes dug out of 65-million-year-old Cretaceous chalk in France? In 1885, a block of coal was broken open to find a metal cube obviously worked by intelligent hands. In 1912, employees at an electric plant broke apart a large chunk of coal out of which fell an iron pot! A nail was found embedded in a sandstone block from the Mesozoic Era. And there are many, many more such anomalies.
What are we to make of these finds? There are several possibilities:
* Intelligent humans date back much, much further than we realize.
* Other intelligent beings and civilizations existed on earth far beyond our recorded history.
* Our dating methods are completely inaccurate, and that stone, coal and fossils form much more rapidly than we now estimate.
In any case, these examples - and there are many more - should prompt any curious and
This stuff just goes on and on, anomalies everywhere, all real stuff which you can hold in your hand, No fucking conspiracy here. :handshake:
The remains of a huge underwater city off the western coast of India may force historians and archaeologists to radically reconsider their view of ancient human history. It’s believed that the area was submerged when ice caps melted at the end of the last ice age, 9-10,000 years ago.
Marine scientists say archaeological remains discovered 120 feet underwater in the Gulf of Cambay off the western coast of India could be over 9,000 years old. The vast city - which is five miles long and two miles wide - is believed to predate the oldest known remains in the subcontinent by more than 5,000 years.
The site was discovered by chance last year by oceanographers from India’s National Institute of Ocean Technology who were conducting a survey of pollution. Using sidescan sonar - which sends a beam of sound waves down to the bottom of the ocean - they identified huge geometrical structures at a depth of 120 feet. Debris recovered from the site - including construction material, pottery, sections of walls, beads, sculpture and human bones and teeth - has been carbon dated and found to be nearly 9,500 years old.
However, archaeologist Justin Morris from the British Museum says more work will need to be done before the site can be said to belong to a 9,000 year old civilization, since there can be errors in carbon dating. “Culturally speaking, in that part of the world there were no civilizations prior to about 2,500 BC. What’s happening before then mainly consisted of small, village settlements,” he says.
Strong tides make investigations in the Cambay difficult. Marine scientists led by the Madras-based National Institute of Ocean Technology are solving this problem by taking acoustic images off the sea-bed and using dredging equipment to extract artifacts.
The Indian Minister for Ocean Technology, Murli Manohar Joshi, says the images indicate symmetrical man-made structures and also a paleo-river, with banks containing artifacts, such as pottery. Carbon dating on a block of wood brought up from the depths suggests it dates back to 7,595 BC. “We have to find out what happened then ... where and how this civilisation vanished,” he says.
The city is believed to be even older than the ancient Harappan civilisation, which dates back around 4,000 years and is the oldest on the subcontinent. Although Palaeolithic sites dating back around 20,000 years have been found on the coast of India’s western state of Gujarat before, this is the first time that man-made structures as old as 9,500 years have been found deep beneath the ocean surface.
Marine archaeologists have used a technique known as sub- bottom profiling to show that the buildings were built on enormous foundations. Graham Hancock, author of “Fingerprints of the Gods,” says, “The [oceanographers] found that they were dealing with two large blocks of apparently man made structures. Cities on this scale are not known in the archaeological record until roughly 4,500 years ago when the first big cities begin to appear in Mesopotamia. Nothing else on the scale of the underwater cities of Cambay is known. The first cities of the historical period are as far away from these cities as we are today from the pyramids of Egypt.”
Hancock feels this discovery could have a major influence on our view of the ancient world. “There’s a huge chronological problem in this discovery. It means that the whole model of the origins of civilization with which archaeologists have been working will have to be remade from scratch,” he says.
Ben_Itez
31-01-07, 04:30 PM
Cant believe i'd never heard about this 'lost' japanese city.
Typically arrogant yanks and europeans scoffing at it though.....certainly makes you wonder whether there's serious controlling of information we/they receive. It makes sense for the power mongers to make us believe we were the first civilised societies/children of god etc.
If this city is all it's cracked up to be history will have to be rewritten to a certain extent. Fascinating.
Kronenburg1892
31-01-07, 04:45 PM
First Published in Science ... you know the Conspiracy Theory Mag Like that Fringo organization Nasa
Here you go mate I think this is it .. 2000 years old !! :handshake:
In 1901 divers working off the isle of Antikythera found the remains of a clocklike mechanism 2,000 years old. The mechanism now appears to have been a device for calculating the motions of stars and planets.
Ta.
Found a link with pictures
http://www.matrixofcreation.co.uk/ancient-clocks.htm
Thing is tho, astrological calculators have been around for centuries. As your article points out, the theory of calculation was well known at that time. It's an interesting find tho.
But this whole 'global reset' thing, the only connection I'd like to make, rather trying to combine a load of interesting facts into a religous "end of days" scenario, is that you've managed to discover a new set of 'astronomic tools' who've just made a Nostrodamas video for $24.95 from http://www.thehorizonproject.com/
Apparently "An unprecidented convergence of science and Remote Viewing."
*Ahem*
:)
Cant believe i'd never heard about this 'lost' japanese city.
Typically arrogant yanks and europeans scoffing at it though.....certainly makes you wonder whether there's serious controlling of information we/they receive. It makes sense for the power mongers to make us believe we were the first civilised societies/children of god etc.
If this city is all it's cracked up to be history will have to be rewritten to a certain extent. Fascinating.
we'll it's not actually a city it's more like pyramids, but people disagree about weather it is man made or not, i saw a national geographic program about it called 'japans mysterious pyramids' and you see underwater shots of it and it's amazing but as far as being man made, don't know. it is believed to be 10.000 years old way before intelligent life has been known to exist in japan yet alone an island that has never been habited by people in the past. it's freaky but sometimes nature can surprise us with it's own design
Ta.
Found a link with pictures
http://www.matrixofcreation.co.uk/ancient-clocks.htm
Thing is tho, astrological calculators have been around for centuries. As your article points out, the theory of calculation was well known at that time. It's an interesting find tho.
But this whole 'global reset' thing, the only connection I'd like to make, rather trying to combine a load of interesting facts into a religous "end of days" scenario, is that you've managed to discover a new set of 'astronomic tools' who've just made a Nostrodamas video for $24.95 from http://www.thehorizonproject.com/
Apparently "An unprecidented convergence of science and Remote Viewing."
*Ahem*
:)
Mate with regards to ahem Remote Viewing (although granted the horizon project website was highly disappointing) just because its a little outside the Cave don't be too quick to dismiss it.
Scientists at Princeton, Harvard and MIT have repeated consciousness experiments recently. There are random coin dropping machines (I kid you not) anyways they basically drop coins to confirm statistics ie 50 / 50 chance of being heads or tails. When scientist put a person in front of the machine and tell them to make the machine drop heads, the results change by .2 percent, the results are the same over and over again, it the scientists ask the subject to make tails drop the results are flipped. Something is happening and its got to do with consciousness.
These people are just normal student monkeys.
Then there is the Global Consciousness Project which has been developed at Princeton. Now I cant really describe the mechanics of this as it really is too much for my little head but it centers around the collection of random data, which get analyzed and well I don't know exactly how it works but it picks up on consciousness around the world. Sure enough there are spikes before and after events like Princess Di's death, 9/11 etc
http://noosphere.princeton.edu/
The there is the double slit quantum experiment .. Watch this and realize this world is a lot stranger than you think
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q4Oq9nc87QY
The military have always taken remote viewing very seriously
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v2GAYwvDSFg
There is the famous consciousness experiments with water
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hT87cQl6q3M
Our Classical understanding of the Universe and our place in it is antiquated in the extreme but we are on the edge of a paradigm shift, the reality of our existence is so far fetched currently we simply cannot get our head around it. We are on the edge of discovering it but because we are still steeped in 18 century and 19th century physics, 21 st century physics looks like magic to be sneered at. I think it was Einstein could be wrong who said if a technology is sufficiently advanced it would look like magic to the untrained eye, or words to that effect. Open you mind to possibilities, question everything dismiss nothing.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8wLXkK65FII
Apologies for my Outbursts, I have a short fuse, not a complete hippy yet, make mental note must work on Anger issues
One People One Planet One Consciousness :handshake:
Mattshark
01-02-07, 06:09 PM
You do know that the poles switch fairly commonly don't you nicey?
SouthAfricaRed
01-02-07, 06:16 PM
I just hope we'd won Number 19 by then :)
Jaco_Pastorious
01-02-07, 06:18 PM
Enjoyable thread, I do like reading Nicey's posts. Can be very interesting reads. :handshake:
TheStig
01-02-07, 06:18 PM
Mate with regards to ahem Remote Viewing (although granted the horizon project website was highly disappointing) just because its a little outside the Cave don't be too quick to dismiss it.
Scientists at Princeton, Harvard and MIT have repeated consciousness experiments recently. There are random coin dropping machines (I kid you not) anyways they basically drop coins to confirm statistics ie 50 / 50 chance of being heads or tails. When scientist put a person in front of the machine and tell them to make the machine drop heads, the results change by .2 percent, the results are the same over and over again, it the scientists ask the subject to make tails drop the results are flipped. Something is happening and its got to do with consciousness.
These people are just normal student monkeys.
Then there is the Global Consciousness Project which has been developed at Princeton. Now I cant really describe the mechanics of this as it really is too much for my little head but it centers around the collection of random data, which get analyzed and well I don't know exactly how it works but it picks up on consciousness around the world. Sure enough there are spikes before and after events like Princess Di's death, 9/11 etc
http://noosphere.princeton.edu/
The there is the double slit quantum experiment .. Watch this and realize this world is a lot stranger than you think
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q4Oq9nc87QY
The military have always taken remote viewing very seriously
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v2GAYwvDSFg
There is the famous consciousness experiments with water
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hT87cQl6q3M
Our Classical understanding of the Universe and our place in it is antiquated in the extreme but we are on the edge of a paradigm shift, the reality of our existence is so far fetched currently we simply cannot get our head around it. We are on the edge of discovering it but because we are still steeped in 18 century and 19th century physics, 21 st century physics looks like magic to be sneered at. I think it was Einstein could be wrong who said if a technology is sufficiently advanced it would look like magic to the untrained eye, or words to that effect. Open you mind to possibilities, question everything dismiss nothing.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8wLXkK65FII
Apologies for my Outbursts, I have a short fuse, not a complete hippy yet, make mental note must work on Anger issues
One People One Planet One Consciousness :handshake:
Mate this "What the bleep do we know?" film is filled with half truths and stuff that's just plain made up. It's basically a Christian recruitment drive:handshake: .
A small example, in that water clip, apparently the human body is "90% water" the more accepted value is around 70% (check http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Body_water).
Wave particle duality is indeed a very funny thing, and of course it won't be the last "strange" thing we find in science but I'm not going to start basing other "strange" assumptions on the fact that this phenomenon exists.
As for the original post, in particular the path of the solar system's orbit in the Milky Way, I'm not sure that's true at all. The sun is around 8 kilo parsecs from the galactic center (I found this on wikipedia, as well as from my physics notes, so I trust it is reliable!), 1 parsec is 3.26 light years or 3x10^16 m. So that means we're around 26,000ly or 2.4x10^20 m away. Basically we're miles away from the galactic center and there's nothing to suggest we get much closer during our orbit.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Milky_way
I don't doubt that it is high levels of cosmic radiation that have previously wiped out alot of the biological mass on the earth (possibly from a nearby supernova, or maybe even Sun activity), but this to me seems like it's taking it too far.
the comic dust which I mentioned earlier is forced inwards towards us a the speed of light, blowing a 3rd of our atmosphere away immediately upon contact.
"At the speed of light" eh? Please explain further. As for the atmosphere, well if this has happened many times before, how does the atmosphere come back qucikly enough for sustainable life to return to the earth fairly quickly, as is suggested in your main article?
Our solar system is surrounded by a ring of giant snowballs if you like called the Kuplier Belt.
I think you mean the Kuiper Belt ;) .
When our solar system moves through the galactic center the gravity field from the super massive black hole which anchors our Galaxy comes into direct contact or interaction with our Solar system, planets, sun etc.
As for the supermassive black hole, it isn't very active at the moment, I don't think we'd ever get close enough for it to seriously affect us beyond the effect on our orbital path it already has. According to this article (http://www.newscientist.com/article.ns?id=dn3847), you still have to be fairly close to a supermassive black hole anyway.
I like this thread, and the subject matter
But Nicey, why do you have to be such a prick throughout it?? I can't see anybody being particularly damning of the theories or articles you refer to. Nor anybody rubbishing your personal beliefs, so why the vitriol??
SouthAfricaRed
01-02-07, 06:52 PM
Nicey, Have you read any books by Zecharia Sitchin?
He provides an alternative explanation to a lot of the questions you have raised on here
You do know that the poles switch fairly commonly don't you nicey?
Yup but i was aware of that mate but we do not know what this happens, they have been flippin regular as clock work. This theory offers one possible explanation.
I like this thread, and the subject matter
But Nicey, why do you have to be such a prick throughout it?? I can't see anybody being particularly damning of the theories or articles you refer to. Nor anybody rubbishing your personal beliefs, so why the vitriol??
Well mate they caught me on a bad day yesterday, but certain posters just drop by my shall we say alternative discuss topic threads and just leave snide remarks, whilst Redheart, made such worthy additions to the discussion as “this sums up this crap” “Oh sweet lord what nonsense” “This reeks of David Icke” “typical conspiracy theory nutter” “ Nerdy Nerdy” and so on and so fort.
I know the difference between conspiracy theory, pseudo-science and recorded facts. I don’t take kindly to been referred too as a nutter a nerd or some conspiracy theory wack job, hardly glowing complements. If someone does not agree with what I post I am all for having a discussion, but I wont take name calling and ridicule lying down. I don’t want to get into a shit fight over trivialities such being called a Nerd, but I would appreciate it if someone does not have something constructive to ad perhaps they might want to not add anything all. Its fucking rude, its annoying and its not called for if you ask me.
But you know what their countless threads on the internet with people being rude to each other, throwing shit at each other and basically acting like arses. Lets put it to bed. :handshake:
Nicey, I enjoy your posts! Keep 'em going, even if I find some of it hard to believe.
Nicey, Have you read any books by Zecharia Sitchin?
He provides an alternative explanation to a lot of the questions you have raised on here
I have heard of him mate, but as yet not read any of his stuff I know in certain circles its held in high regard. You read any yourself ?
Well mate they caught me on a bad day yesterday, but certain posters just drop by my shall we say alternative discuss topic threads and just leave snide remarks, whilst Redheart, made such worthy additions to the discussion as “this sums up this crap” “Oh sweet lord what nonsense” “This reeks of David Icke” “typical conspiracy theory nutter” “ Nerdy Nerdy” and so on and so fort.
I know the difference between conspiracy theory, pseudo-science and recorded facts. I don’t take kindly to been referred too as a nutter a nerd or some conspiracy theory wack job, hardly glowing complements. If someone does not agree with what I post I am all for having a discussion, but I wont take name calling and ridicule lying down. I don’t want to get into a shit fight over trivialities such being called a Nerd, but I would appreciate it if someone does not have something constructive to ad perhaps they might want to not add anything all. Its fucking rude, its annoying and its not called for if you ask me.
But you know what their countless threads on the internet with people being rude to each other, throwing shit at each other and basically acting like arses. Lets put it to bed. :handshake:
Thats a fair comment chap
Personally, I am not dismissing any of the theories/suggestions made, but by the same degree its a lot to ask someone to buy into something so huge immediately!
What I will say is your posts have made me look into the subject matter in more detail, its all really fascinating! Scarily possible too, if not plausible
Keep it up I say :handshake:
Neil Young
02-02-07, 10:44 AM
Thats a fair comment chap
Personally, I am not dismissing any of the theories/suggestions made, but by the same degree its a lot to ask someone to buy into something so huge immediately!
What I will say is your posts have made me look into the subject matter in more detail, its all really fascinating! Scarily possible too, if not plausible
Keep it up I say :handshake:
Anything that keeps you too busy to cause any more damage in the Middle East - headline from today's Guardian:
Fierce clashes shatter Gaza truce
You should be ashamed of yourself.
slimbimjim
02-02-07, 11:08 AM
Next thing you know we'll be hearing from the creationists that the Earth is only a few thousand years old...
We are on the galactic arm of the Milky Way. If we ever swayed inward to a black hole (which anchors the Milky Way itself) then the gravity of the entire galaxy will be comprimised!
Pseudo Science at it's best!
Anything that keeps you too busy to cause any more damage in the Middle East - headline from today's Guardian:
Fierce clashes shatter Gaza truce
You should be ashamed of yourself.
For crying out loud, if I've told them about spelling once I've told them a thousand times. There are TWO Z's and if anything, it was Sheryl who did the shattering :shake:
SouthAfricaRed
02-02-07, 11:57 AM
I have heard of him mate, but as yet not read any of his stuff I know in certain circles its held in high regard. You read any yourself ?
Yes, I've read most of his Books. Interesting Stuff
Here's his Web Site = Zecharia Sitchin (http://www.sitchin.com/)
Snigger
02-02-07, 01:12 PM
Taken directly from Nasa Dipshit :whatever:
Dec. 21, 2006: Evidence is mounting: the next solar cycle is going to be a big one.
see captionSolar cycle 24, due to peak in 2010 or 2011 "looks like its going to be one of the most intense cycles since record-keeping began almost 400 years ago," says solar physicist David Hathaway of the Marshall Space Flight Center. He and colleague Robert Wilson presented this conclusion last week at the American Geophysical Union meeting in San Francisco.
Right: An erupting solar prominence photographed by the Solar and Heliospheric Observatory (SOHO). [More]
Their forecast is based on historical records of geomagnetic storms.
Hathaway explains: "When a gust of solar wind hits Earth's magnetic field, the impact causes the magnetic field to shake. If it shakes hard enough, we call it a geomagnetic storm." In the extreme, these storms cause power outages and make compass needles swing in the wrong direction. Auroras are a beautiful side-effect.
Hathaway and Wilson looked at records of geomagnetic activity stretching back almost 150 years and noticed something useful:. "The amount of geomagnetic activity now tells us what the solar cycle is going to be like 6 to 8 years in the future," says Hathaway. A picture is worth a thousand words:
see caption
Above: Peaks in geomagnetic activity (red) foretell solar maxima (black) more than six years in advance. [More]
In the plot, above, black curves are solar cycles; the amplitude is the sunspot number. Red curves are geomagnetic indices, specifically the Inter-hour Variability Index or IHV. "These indices are derived from magnetometer data recorded at two points on opposite sides of Earth: one in England and another in Australia. IHV data have been taken every day since 1868," says Hathaway.
Cross correlating sunspot number vs. IHV, they found that the IHV predicts the amplitude of the solar cycle 6-plus years in advance with a 94% correlation coefficient.
"We don't know why this works," says Hathaway. The underlying physics is a mystery. "But it does work."
see captionAccording to their analysis, the next Solar Maximum should peak around 2010 with a sunspot number of 160 plus or minus 25. This would make it one of the strongest solar cycles of the past fifty years—which is to say, one of the strongest in recorded history.
Left: Hathaway and Wilson's prediction for the amplitude of Solar Cycle 24. [More]
Astronomers have been counting sunspots since the days of Galileo, watching solar activity rise and fall every 11 years. Curiously, four of the five biggest cycles on record have come in the past 50 years. "Cycle 24 should fit right into that pattern," says Hathaway.
These results are just the latest signs pointing to a big Cycle 24. Most compelling of all, believes Hathaway, is the work of Mausumi Dikpati and colleagues at the National Center for Atmospheric Research (NCAR) in Boulder, Colorado. "They have combined observations of the sun’s 'Great Conveyor Belt' with a sophisticated computer model of the sun’s inner dynamo to produce a physics-based prediction of the next solar cycle." In short, it's going to be intense. Details may be found in the Science@NASA story Solar Storm Warning.
a spinning compass and power outages is slightly more believable then the end of the human race and a global 200M ocean rise.
It's nice theory, bit like the ones who killed themselves in December 1999 because the world was going to end in 2000.
There is no where near enough evidence to prove sophisticated humans were around then wiped out before. We've found remains of humans descendants and animals from millions of years ago and none of them were wearing a watch or had any car keys on them so I find the neolithic spark plug a little hard to swallow
No mate your wrong on that, this is all facts, hard facts. Nothing to do with Y2K or other daft things. I'll list them for you when I get a moment.
But hey yes I know its a big idea and not a very palatable one at that, I only just heard it last week and it scared the crap out of me because it made such good sense.
Anyways its all just information at the end of the day some of it good some of it not so good, its best to have as much of it as possible i say :handshake:
Snigger
02-02-07, 02:34 PM
No mate your wrong on that, this is all facts, hard facts. Nothing to do with Y2K or other daft things. I'll list them for you when I get a moment.
But hey yes I know its a big idea and not a very palatable one at that, I only just heard it last week and it scared the crap out of me because it made such good sense.
Anyways its all just information at the end of the day some of it good some of it not so good, its best to have as much of it as possible i say :handshake:
so when do you start work on your underground bunker? ??It's not facts, it's theory - nobody knows what wiped out previous civilisations, the dinosaurs or any of that shit - the fact that there is some cosmic dust in core ice samples could be due to a large meteorite colission at some point in the planets past. How can anyone say that factually solar winds and cosmic dust blew away 2/3 of the earths atmosphere thousands of years ago. If this is all factual why isn't the biggest news story ever?
I won't be losing any sleep, there are solar cycles - some are bigger than others but they happen all the time. There are also weather patterns and we are in the middle of one.
El Nino, a climate pattern that can wreak havoc around the world, will stay at least until spring 2007.
El Nino is an abnormal warming of waters in the equatorial Pacific Ocean which causes wild swings in weather from Asia to South America — causing searing drought in some and rampant flooding in others.
Typical El Nino conditions were predicted to happen this winter.
This would include warmer-than-average temperatures in some parts of the Northern hemisphere, wetter-than-average conditions over portions of equitorial areas, and drier-than-average conditions in various other regions.
Although this years El Nino was predicted to and is having a profound effect on world weather it is not expected to be as devistating as in 97 - 98.
Sorry mate you are incorrect and I will show you when I have time. If I had a dollar every time El Nino has been rolled out to explain weather anomalies recently I'd be able to buy you all starbucks
Oh yeah and they are FACTS, like I said I'll list them for you when I get a moment
Snigger
02-02-07, 02:55 PM
please provide evidence rather than facts - the spoutings of some half baked tree hugging scientists doesn't constitute fact.
Neil Young
02-02-07, 02:58 PM
Oh yeah and they are FACTS, like I said I'll list them for you when I get a moment
Good, I'm looking forward to it.
By the way, if, for example, you are planning to list occurrences of dead birds that have fallen out of the sky in different parts of the world recently would you also make sure to include all the occurrences when birds didn't fall out of the sky because they weren't dead and all the different places that happened (or didn't happen, if you see what I mean)?
My point, of course, is be careful not to be biased in your selection of 'facts' when pushing forward your argument. I'm sure you're well aware of the danger of course mate.
:handshake:
please provide evidence rather than facts - the spoutings of some half baked tree hugging scientists doesn't constitute fact.
Careful! You don't agree with every "fact" that you are being given the fortune of receiving and will rightly be labelled a commoner or a fuck wit.
Snigger
02-02-07, 03:49 PM
A fact is not a fact until proven. There is way to much unknown in the science of space and the universe and the history of our planet for much of this crap about the end of life happening in 5 years time. People often confuse theory and conjecture with fact. Understand space? We can't even get to the bottom of the deepest ocean.
Hollowman
02-02-07, 03:52 PM
No mate, you're wrong. Seriously. I'll prove it later. If I have time.
Good, I'm looking forward to it.
By the way, if, for example, you are planning to list occurrences of dead birds that have fallen out of the sky in different parts of the world recently would you also make sure to include all the occurrences when birds didn't fall out of the sky because they weren't dead and all the different places that happened (or didn't happen, if you see what I mean)?
My point, of course, is be careful not to be biased in your selection of 'facts' when pushing forward your argument. I'm sure you're well aware of the danger of course mate.
:handshake:
Na this mate is serious stuff, the bird thing is plain weird and a little worrying, could be linked to this and most likely is but that is still very much in the "weird and wonderful category"
Snigger
02-02-07, 03:56 PM
lol
Careful! You don't agree with every "fact" that you are being given the fortune of receiving and will rightly be labelled a commoner or a fuck wit.
Whatever, you know what I don't have time for this bollox, show me where I called anyone a commoner or a fuck with for that matter. Think you should get that chip looked at, could be malignant.
I just put some interesting info up and am getting a gut full of grief. This thread and others have quickly become not fun at all.
Laters Bitches its been emotional :handshake:
*I mean bitches in the good way of course
Snigger
02-02-07, 04:15 PM
Whatever, you know what I don't have time for this bollox, show me where I called anyone a commoner or a fuck with for that matter. Think you should get that chip looked at, could be malignant.
I just put some interesting info up and am getting a gut full of grief. This thread and others have quickly become not fun at all.
Laters Bitches its been emotional :handshake:
*I mean bitches in the good way of course
Talking about the end of the human race in 5 years is time is what you consider to be fun?
Mattshark
02-02-07, 08:55 PM
Yup but i was aware of that mate but we do not know what this happens, they have been flippin regular as clock work. This theory offers one possible explanation.
It is not a theory mate, a theory requires a large amount of scientific evidence peer reviewed and published in a journal and to have numerous other reports saying the same thing within the 95% confidence factor (the original hypothesis is 95% likely to happen). Then it may become a theory, untill then it is an idea. However I have seen no papers on this and they are the only good way to source infomation on scientific manner because the show all the work used to reach the conclusion and show how that it can be repeated and checked and are peer reviewed to ensure credability.
Kronenburg1892
02-02-07, 09:09 PM
Apologies for my Outbursts, I have a short fuse, not a complete hippy yet, make mental note must work on Anger issues
No worries, never took it personal.
As far as I'm concerned, I've enjoyed reading your links, and don't disagree with most of it.
But when you put up sandwich board proclaimations to the end of the world, I'd expect to get some flack.
Anyway, take it easy chap. More important things to worry about, like midday tomorrow.
Nice one fella, yeah I know, in fact I’d be the same and your right to proclaim the end the world is coming and then to be arsey when people suggest you may be slightly mad is a litte … 7.30 am over here right now, can’t find a word which suitably sums up how stupid that is.
Anyways toys are back in the pram again this morning and looking forward to decapitating the blue shite today !!
Red_Polo
02-02-07, 11:49 PM
No mate, you're wrong. Seriously. I'll prove it later. If I have time.
:D
Red_Polo
02-02-07, 11:52 PM
Seriously Nicey, you wonder why people laugh, but the title of the thread is, 'This is how the world will end.' The first sentence of your initial post is then 'this made my blood run cold', and the final sentence of it is 'we are all fucked'. What the hell do you expect?
Shut up you ..
Amyways what are you doing up at this wee hour
Mattshark
03-02-07, 12:42 AM
Shut up you ..
Amyways what are you doing up at this wee hour
Polo never sleeps, surely you know this by now! What are you doing up so early, now there is a real question!
Strange when I have to work I cant get out of bed but at the weekend I wake up at the crack of dawn, I think somewhere deep down inside me thinks there will be deadly childrens television on and I dont want to miss a single minute of it! then I realize, nicey your thirty fucking two
Mattshark
03-02-07, 01:01 AM
Strange when I have to work I cant get out of bed but at the weekend I wake up at the crack of dawn, I think somewhere deep down inside me thinks there will be deadly childrens television on and I dont want to miss a single minute of it! then I realize, nicey your thirty fucking two
So you just want to watch transformers then :p :cool:
Red_Polo
03-02-07, 01:26 AM
Shut up you ..
Amyways what are you doing up at this wee hour
:D
Just got back from the pub a while ago, I'm actually gonna try to get to sleep really early tonight, gotta wake up at 6 to get the train up for the match and am not up for another all-nighter ahead of the journey. I'm so excited though!! :woot:
RedProf
03-02-07, 01:27 AM
Strange when I have to work I cant get out of bed but at the weekend I wake up at the crack of dawn, I think somewhere deep down inside me thinks there will be deadly childrens television on and I dont want to miss a single minute of it! then I realize, nicey your thirty fucking two
Nicey - I'd also like to know how your belief in the Horizon Project prediction fits in with your support of LFC? Like - can you believe the Reds will be no more? That heros like Stevie G and Rafa will be reduced to a pile of smoking ashes in only a few years time!? And whether we'll get no. 19 in time. And whether the take over bothers you as does it really matter who it is as long as they can provide funds to get 19 in the next 3 years or so!? :cool: Just a tongue in cheek thing really, but still be interesting to know how this has impacted upon your support for the boys.
Mate the only thing I am worried about these days is this ...
There better be Poker on the other side otherwise I am not going :handshake:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D4bRnuWIIaw
SouthAfricaRed
03-02-07, 01:52 AM
IMO the fascination with 2012 is the following.
Now that the hype surrounding the Millenium has subsided, people are looking at the next critical date.
The Current Mayan calender is set to run out at Winter Solstice of 2012. (December 21 2012) Mayan Calender (http://www.crawford2000.co.uk/maya.htm)
There is little doubt that the current civilization has affected nature more than any other in recorded History.
There is more than enough evidence to confirm Events in the past that Nearly wiped out all Life and definately any form of Civilization. (Including a World wide Flood as recent as 10000 BC)
Will the above two Facts combine to end our Current Civilization. It's possible, but nobody can really be sure when and how it will happen.
The most important Fact is that our Polution is making our Earth a more Hostile environment to Survive in. Unless something changes drastically, Life as we know it today will change drastically in the Very Near Future. Maybe in our Lifetime, but definately in that of our Children.
Mattshark
03-02-07, 01:55 AM
IMO the fascination with 2012 is the following.
Now that the hype surrounding the Millenium has subsided, people are looking at the next critical date.
The Current Mayan calender is set to run out at Winter Solstice of 2012. (December 21 2012) Mayan Calender (http://www.crawford2000.co.uk/maya.htm)
There is little doubt that the current civilization has affected nature more than any other in recorded History.
There is more than enough evidence to confirm Events in the past that Nearly wiped out all Life and definately any form of Civilization. (Including a World wide Flood as recent as 10000 BC)
Will the above two Facts combine to end our Current Civilization. It's possible, but nobody can really be sure when and how it will happen.
The most important Fact is that our Polution is making our Earth a more Hostile environment to Survive in. Unless something changes drastically, Life as we know it today will change drastically in the Very Near Future. Maybe in our Lifetime, but definately in that of our Children.
Any links to a worldwide flood? because I'd dispute a world wide flood completely.
Red_Polo
03-02-07, 01:57 AM
Tha end of the Mayan calendar cycle is said to signify a world-changing event rather than the actual end of the world. Of course, world changing events happen every year so the conspiracy theorists will be proven right regardless. Only the seriously fucked up nutjobs who think it means the end of the world will look like cretinous wanks.
Mattshark
03-02-07, 01:59 AM
Tha end of the Mayan calendar cycle is said to signify a world-changing event rather than the actual end of the world. Of course, world changing events happen every year so the conspiracy theorists will be proven right regardless. Only the seriously fucked up nutjobs who think it means the end of the world will look like cretinous wanks.
Lol, its not as if the Mayans can exactly update it either is it?
Ben_Itez
03-02-07, 02:14 AM
The most important Fact is that our Polution is making our Earth a more Hostile environment to Survive in. Unless something changes drastically, Life as we know it today will change drastically in the Very Near Future. Maybe in our Lifetime, but definately in that of our Children.
:handshake:
Tha end of the Mayan calendar cycle is said to signify a world-changing event rather than the actual end of the world. Of course, world changing events happen every year so the conspiracy theorists will be proven right regardless. Only the seriously fucked up nutjobs who think it means the end of the world will look like cretinous wanks.
Lol say it as you see it Brother :haha: :handshake:
On the Mayan Calender nobody is sure what it preciously signifies, one thing they are all in agreement is if marks a dramatic change. Some say a change in consciousness, some say an evolutionary jump start, some say our creators will return to check in on their little experiments, some say we will realize our divine potential. One thing is for sure, the Mayan Calendar is the more accurate calendar every created and calendars are quite simply not supposed to end.
A calendar is deceptive, calendars are far more important than people realize, the calendar is central to civilizations consciousness, everything you have ever done is attached to a calendar, everything you ever will do is attached to a calender, your very existence and demise is recored on a calendar. Something we take for granted, The Gregorian calendar is a means to keep people from thinking about or seeing the bigger picture if you ask me. Many many millions of people were slaughtered so we could enjoy the 3rd of febuary 2007 or to give its real date 3rd of February 2007 year of our Lord..
I cannot recommend you watch this talk more highly its on the Mayan Calendar .. Now what you make of it is up to you but at the very least its incredibly interesting :handshake:
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-6681910439634411366&q=The+mayan+calendar&hl=en
Mattshark
03-02-07, 03:02 AM
Lol say it as you see it Brother :haha: :handshake:
On the Mayan Calender nobody is sure what it preciously signifies, one thing they are all in agreement is if marks a dramatic change. Some say a change in consciousness, some say an evolutionary jump start, some say our creators will return to check in on their little experiments, some say we will realize our divine potential. One thing is for sure, the Mayan Calendar is the more accurate calendar every created and calendars are quite simply not supposed to end.
A calendar is deceptive, calendars are far more important than people realize, the calendar is central to civilizations consciousness, everything you have ever done is attached to a calendar, everything you ever will do is attached to a calender, your very existence and demise is recored on a calendar. Something we take for granted, The Gregorian calendar is a means to keep people from thinking about or seeing the bigger picture if you ask me. Many many millions of people were slaughtered so we could enjoy the 3rd of febuary 2007 or to give its real date 3rd of February 2007 year of our Lord..
I cannot recommend you watch this talk more highly its on the Mayan Calendar .. Now what you make of it is up to you but at the very least its incredibly interesting :handshake:
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-6681910439634411366&q=The+mayan+calendar&hl=en
I really don't think it will make any difference at all actually. It has to end cos the Mayans have all gone and are not clearly just not around to get a new one.
Which reminds me, I need a new calander, or did the world end when my last one finished?
I really don't think it will make any difference at all actually. It has to end cos the Mayans have all gone and are not clearly just not around to get a new one.
Which reminds me, I need a new calander, or did the world end when my last one finished?
:haha:
Snigger
03-02-07, 08:36 AM
Shut up you ..
Amyways what are you doing up at this wee hour
waiting for those facts.
waiting for those facts.
please provide evidence rather than facts - the spoutings of some half baked tree hugging scientists doesn't constitute fact.
Evidence rather than them stupid factoids ehh
Mate I am not going to waste my time researching gathering information just for you to turn your nose up at it. Do what you will with this information, if you choose to look into it further excellent if you decide its a load of horse manure marvelous buts its not my job to convince you otherwise nor do I have the inclination for such a thankless job :handshake:
Red Chilli
03-02-07, 10:38 AM
Lol say it as you see it Brother :haha: :handshake:
On the Mayan Calender nobody is sure what it preciously signifies, one thing they are all in agreement is if marks a dramatic change. Some say a change in consciousness, some say an evolutionary jump start, some say our creators will return to check in on their little experiments, some say we will realize our divine potential. One thing is for sure, the Mayan Calendar is the more accurate calendar every created and calendars are quite simply not supposed to end.
A calendar is deceptive, calendars are far more important than people realize, the calendar is central to civilizations consciousness, everything you have ever done is attached to a calendar, everything you ever will do is attached to a calender, your very existence and demise is recored on a calendar. Something we take for granted, The Gregorian calendar is a means to keep people from thinking about or seeing the bigger picture if you ask me. Many many millions of people were slaughtered so we could enjoy the 3rd of febuary 2007 or to give its real date 3rd of February 2007 year of our Lord..
I cannot recommend you watch this talk more highly its on the Mayan Calendar .. Now what you make of it is up to you but at the very least its incredibly interesting :handshake:
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-6681910439634411366&q=The+mayan+calendar&hl=en
Jeebus!
I've listened to 15 minutes so far and he hasn't told me SHIT.
15 minutes of repeating the word consciousness :shake:
Jeebus!
I've listened to 15 minutes so far and he hasn't told me SHIT.
15 minutes of repeating the word consciousness :shake:
Its definitely hippy territory matey, one of those things, its either your bag or its not ... Its 6 fucking hours long Shep
Red Chilli
03-02-07, 10:48 AM
Its definitely hippy territory matey, one of those things, its either your bag or its not ... Its 6 fucking hours long Shep
Bollocks to that then, I'm starting to lose consciousness :haha:
Snigger
03-02-07, 12:35 PM
please provide evidence rather than facts - the spoutings of some half baked tree hugging scientists doesn't constitute fact.
Evidence rather than them stupid factoids ehh
Mate I am not going to waste my time researching gathering information just for you to turn your nose up at it. Do what you will with this information, if you choose to look into it further excellent if you decide its a load of horse manure marvelous buts its not my job to convince you otherwise nor do I have the inclination for such a thankless job :handshake:
You are the one who said you would provide them, but I totally understand if you can't find any.
Neil Young
03-02-07, 02:58 PM
Who cares? We're all going to die of bird flu anyway.
:crackoff:
You are the one who said you would provide them, but I totally understand if you can't find any.
Yeah .. you are :crackoff: mate
Snigger
03-02-07, 07:10 PM
Yeah .. you are :crackoff: mate
:eyebrow: :eyebrow: :eyebrow: :eyebrow:
:eyebrow: :eyebrow: :eyebrow: :eyebrow:
Two more and you couldn't post. :eyebrow:
Neil Young
03-02-07, 10:16 PM
:eyebrow: :eyebrow: :eyebrow: :eyebrow:
Two more and you couldn't post. :eyebrow:
One more and you couldn't post. :eyebrow:
Abdul Alhazred
04-02-07, 07:23 PM
A calendar is deceptive, calendars are far more important than people realize, the calendar is central to civilizations consciousness, everything you have ever done is attached to a calendar, everything you ever will do is attached to a calender, your very existence and demise is recored on a calendar.
Amen to that.
Saint Bob had this to say on the matter:
http://www.kelsung.com/calendar/RAW.htm
in particular
I find the Mayan calendar even more perplexing, but keep it on my letters because I like the names of the days: Crocodile, Night, Snake, Deer, Jade, Monkey, Reed, Eagle, Thought, Storm, Wind, Net, Death, Rabbit, Dog, Tooth, Jaguar, Wax, Knife, Hunter. Sort of sounds like my last acid trip.
This year counts as 5106 of this cycle, but numerous cycles roll on and on and do not necessarily end in 2012 Gregorian, whatever you may have heard; that may just mark the opening of another mega-cycle.
Hail Bob!
If i go out into my garden and spray a full can of hairspray in the air every day for a year,will Ebbw Vale become warmer :handshake:
Jaco_Pastorious
04-02-07, 10:54 PM
If i go out into my garden and spray a full can of hairspray in the air every day for a year,will Ebbw Vale become warmer :handshake:
It might smell better. :crackoff:
Watch the first part of this movie ... the sea floor is not supposed to extremely change temperature like this, let alone change at all for that matter.
Watch
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ImHjLl7pnos
Snigger
09-02-07, 01:27 PM
Watch the first part of this movie ... the sea floor is not supposed to extremely change temperature like this, let alone change at all for that matter.
Watch
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ImHjLl7pnos
The map says Sea surface, which changes constantly.
Its temperature is not supposed to change like that, its highly anomalous and something which has oceanographers perplexed.
Red Chilli
09-02-07, 03:52 PM
Watch the first part of this movie ... the sea floor is not supposed to extremely change temperature like this, let alone change at all for that matter.
Watch
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ImHjLl7pnos
Shit, wish I'd read the bit "watch the first part of this movie".
I watched it all, the second part gives you an insight of the mind of the person who made it :rash:
yeah its a bit hippy mate, he has won some film awards apparently .. not my cuppa
tomasjj
09-02-07, 10:05 PM
Actually, I am more concerned about WHEN it ends as there is not much I can do about how it ends when it ends... :D
Kronenburg1892
09-02-07, 10:57 PM
Actually, I am more concerned about WHEN it ends as there is not much I can do about how it ends when it ends... :D
Yes you can. Demand more transparency in our politicians and government accounting, by encouraging people to stand up for eco policies.
This is probably the best time for anyone in a career in politics to make a name for themselves.
It's all a matter of people getting angry about something.
This whole carbon trading thing smells like a scam, it's too complicated for average Joe to understand. A bit like Enron trading in projected power!!!! (Wankers)
Abdul Alhazred
11-02-07, 06:08 PM
This website is always worth a chuckle
http://www.exitmundi.nl/exitmundi.htm
Snigger
11-02-07, 07:47 PM
Its temperature is not supposed to change like that, its highly anomalous and something which has oceanographers perplexed.
The surface temp changes all the time and there are anomalies every year, especially within the saline conveyor belts such as the gulf stream.
Ketario
12-02-07, 11:46 AM
The surface temp changes all the time and there are anomalies every year, especially within the saline conveyor belts such as the gulf stream.
The threat level at Google is raised to Defcon 2
Mattshark
12-02-07, 04:58 PM
The surface temp changes all the time and there are anomalies every year, especially within the saline conveyor belts such as the gulf stream.
Exactly, it is only when you go below the thermocline does the temperature stabilise above the temperatures are subject to change from weather and currents.
Youtube is not a good source of scientific infomation Nicey, you'd be better looking at scientific papers from acreditted journals, even just the abstracts will give you a good insight.
Ok ok I will get some scientific published info for you. I mentioned the ocean floor anomalies because I have listened to several talks by Oceanographers whole have recorded this.
I dont go scoring youtube for info and think oh thats amazing, I have usually read about it first or listened to a lecture or talk by a leading academic in that field.
I am finding it very difficult to track down any data that is accessible on this subject, I had a look for it before to no avail. I have come across a view articles published in Nature and Science which basically supports my claim that the seabed is temperature is rising at an alarming rate. Now if it was due to global warming you could rationailze this as just another torn in the whole global warming issue, but the rub is that the seafloor falls outside the region of global warming from Greenhouse gases. Anyways I will continue to search, needless to say people to track these changes for a living state that the temperature of the sea floor right now is not as it should be, just like global warming this is not cylical, its off the chart.
.................................................. .................................................. ..
This is all I can find for now... took me fecking ages
.................................................. .................................................. ..
Researchers at the Georgia Institute of Technology have released a study supporting the findings of several studies last year linking an increase in the strength of hurricanes around the world to unprecedented global increases in sea surface temperature.
The new study strengthens the link between the increase in hurricane intensity and the increase in tropical sea surface temperature. It found that while factors such as wind shear do affect the intensity of individual storms or storm seasons, they don't account for the global 35-year increase in the number of the most intense hurricanes.
Last summer, the journals Nature and Science published studies claiming to show a very strong link between rising tropical sea surface temperatures and an increase in the strength of hurricanes. The Nature study, by Kerry Emanuel at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology, concluded that cyclonic storms in the North Atlantic and North Pacific oceanic basins were increasing in strength and duration. That increase, Emanuel concluded, was due to increasing sea surface temperatures caused, in part, by global warming.
A month later, the journal Science published research linking an increase in sea surface temperatures over the past 35 years to a near doubling in the number of the strongest hurricanes, those labeled Category 4 or 5. The study, authored by Peter Webster, Judith Curry and Hai-Ru Chang at Georgia Tech and Greg Holland at the National Center for Atmospheric Research, examined hurricanes in all oceanic basins that play host to cyclonic storms around the world.
This latest study sought to determine whether factors other than sea surface temperatures could be significantly contributing to this 35-year trend. Georgia Tech researchers Carlos Hoyos and Paula Agudelo, along with Curry and Webster examined three factors: vertical wind shear (changes in wind speed and direction with height); humidity in the lower atmosphere; and zonal stretching deformation, which is the tendency of the winds to rotate in a cyclonic direction.
"If you examine the intensification of a single storm, or even the statistics on intensification for a particular season, factors like wind shear can play an important role," said Curry, professor and chair of the School of Earth and Atmospheric Sciences at Georgia Tech. "However, there is no global trend in wind shear or the other factors over the 35-year period."
Curry said they did see a small but significant trend in increasing wind shear strength in the North Atlantic, but that the sea surface temperatures were the dominant influence on the increase in both global hurricane intensity as well as the intensity of the North Atlantic hurricanes.
"With this new paper, we firm up the link between the increase in sea surface temperatures and hurricane intensity, which has been a key issue in the debate about whether global warming is causing an increase in hurricane intensity," said Curry
ineednewfootwear
12-02-07, 06:15 PM
that's funny stuff ... but nowhere near provable.
(the whole thing, not the previous post as it went up while i created this one)
the mayan civilization died out because of a peasant revolt in their main city, teotihuacán which was targeted at the upper classes. that's why the cities remains are still to be found and the whole thing wasn't wiped out in some cataclismic event. the remaining cities could continued for another hundred years but could not survive without replacing tribute from teotihuacán and it's trade routes. it in the end, the large cities were abandoned and people returned to the small villages concept.
as for what's happening now, it's all our fault. since the industrial revolution we've polluted the earth with little or no regard for consequences. we are a parasite that's sucking every last bit of life from the earth and destroying it's symbiosis. eventually the earth will correct itself through whatever means it can. this is a living planet after all!
that's funny stuff ... but nowhere near provable.
(the whole thing, not the previous post as it went up while i created this one)
the mayan civilization died out because of a peasant revolt in their main city, teotihuacán which was targeted at the upper classes. that's why the cities remains are still to be found and the whole thing wasn't wiped out in some cataclismic event. the remaining cities could continued for another hundred years but could not survive without replacing tribute from teotihuacán and it's trade routes. it in the end, the large cities were abandoned and people returned to the small villages concept.
as for what's happening now, it's all our fault. since the industrial revolution we've polluted the earth with little or no regard for consequences. we are a parasite that's sucking every last bit of life from the earth and destroying it's symbiosis. eventually the earth will correct itself through whatever means it can. this is a living planet after all!
We live in a spiral galaxy, that is provable. We do revolve around the galactic center in an elliptical orbit, that is provable. We have a super massive black hole at the center of our galaxy, that is provable. What is not provable though is what happens when we move through the busy, gravity drenched galaxtic center. It has long been suggested that when this cylical event happens objects witin the Kuplier belt, become unstable and rain in on the inner solar system bombarding the inner rocky planets and in turn causing mass extinctions.
Also provable is the fact that our magnetic poles flip regularly well I say regularly in the cosmic sense. We have records of this through rock samples and as far as I am aware the scientific community still does not know why this happens. Off the top of my head, forgive any inaccuracies but we get our electromagnetic field from our planets spinning core, its completely plausible that a galactic level strength gravity field could upset said core and cause our magnetic fields to flip or act funny.
The basis of this idea/ theory is very very solid science. As for the Mayans they only fit into the story because they had a profound understanding of our galaxy and measured time very differently to us, we measure time essentially by tracking our planets orbit around the sun, the Mayans went a little bit future than that and tracked the galactic center and our solar systems journey around it, taking into account the precisional wobble of the planet which happens every 25,000 odd years .. amazing they could pick up on something so incredibly small.
It is my understanding that around 850 A.D. The Mayan suddenly and mysteriously abandoned their cities. There are many theories on why they did this but as yet nothing conclusive. I am also led to believe that there civilization's descended into bloody chaos when there God or Gods the same one who gave all there incredibly advanced technologies and knowledge , abandoned there flock so to speak, sparking unimaginable amounts of human sacrifices in order to appease the gods the return. There is also prertty solid evidence to suggest that disease in the crops and the population wiped them out.
I think the disappearance of the Mayan is not really what is so amazing about that particular part of ancient history, it was there understanding of the cosmos, natural cycles and their calendar which is still more accurate than the one we use today.
The Mayan's demise is very much open for debate, I am not very well read on that aspect of their culture, all the interesting stuff happened before that.
Incidentally the Mayan Gods are very similar to other "gods" which popped by the Sumerian's, the aztecs etc ..
Anyways its all good :handshake:
ineednewfootwear
12-02-07, 06:55 PM
Anyways its all good :handshake:
i picked up on the mayans because it's something i've studied. i wasn't using it to discredit the entire thread. but you knew that.
:handshake:
one question i do have though, you posted the previous article from the georgia institute but at no point did it mention how the sea bed is influencing the weather changes. it's widely known that the increase in tropical sea surface temps has contributed to hurricane intensity, and that's really all that previous article says. unless i'm missing something?
:confused:
Neil Young
12-02-07, 07:24 PM
The Earth moves throuigh the galactic centre? How can it? It's on the edge, isn't it?
Mattshark
12-02-07, 07:36 PM
We live in a spiral galaxy, that is provable. We do revolve around the galactic center in an elliptical orbit, that is provable. We have a super massive black hole at the center of our galaxy, that is provable. What is not provable though is what happens when we move through the busy, gravity drenched galaxtic center. It has long been suggested that when this cylical event happens objects witin the Kuplier belt, become unstable and rain in on the inner solar system bombarding the inner rocky planets and in turn causing mass extinctions.
Most of that is hypothetical
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=12384690&dopt=Citation
Neil Young
12-02-07, 07:42 PM
Max-Planck-Institut fur extraterrestrische Physik, Giessenbachstrasse, 85748 Garching, Germany. rainer@mpe.mpg.de
Many galaxies are thought to have supermassive black holes at their centres-more than a million times the mass of the Sun. Measurements of stellar velocities and the discovery of variable X-ray emission have provided strong evidence in favour of such a black hole at the centre of the Milky Way, but have hitherto been unable to rule out conclusively the presence of alternative concentrations of mass. Here we report ten years of high-resolution astrometric imaging that allows us to trace two-thirds of the orbit of the star currently closest to the compact radio source (and massive black-hole candidate) Sagittarius A*. The observations, which include both pericentre and apocentre passages, show that the star is on a bound, highly elliptical keplerian orbit around Sgr A*, with an orbital period of 15.2 years and a pericentre distance of only 17 light hours. The orbit with the best fit to the observations requires a central point mass of (3.7 +/- 1.5) x 10(6) solar masses (M(*)). The data no longer allow for a central mass composed of a dense cluster of dark stellar objects or a ball of massive, degenerate fermions.
I think I was at university with a load of massive, degenerate fermions.
Mattshark
12-02-07, 07:53 PM
I think I was at university with a load of massive, degenerate fermions.
lol :haha:
Kronenburg1892
12-02-07, 11:23 PM
We live in a spiral galaxy, that is provable. We do revolve around the galactic center in an elliptical orbit, that is provable. We have a super massive black hole at the center of our galaxy, that is provable. What is not provable though is what happens when we move through the busy, gravity drenched galaxtic center. It has long been suggested that when this cylical event happens objects witin the Kuplier belt, become unstable and rain in on the inner solar system bombarding the inner rocky planets and in turn causing mass extinctions.
The sun goes no-where near the centre of our galaxy!!
We are about 26,000 light years away from it's centre!!!
These guys reackon our solar system is travelling at Warp 13!!!
Even if the Earth is on a tight eliptical orbit (no where near what these idiots are suggesting), it takes 225-250 million years for one circuit. So the Earth will at best be at it's closest to the galactic centre every 125 million years. Not 2,000.
Just to put that in context, we've currently travelled 0.0008 of an orbit since the beginning of man.
Have you bought the DVD yet? :haha:
i picked up on the mayans because it's something i've studied. i wasn't using it to discredit the entire thread. but you knew that.
:handshake:
one question i do have though, you posted the previous article from the Georgia institute but at no point did it mention how the sea bed is influencing the weather changes. it's widely known that the increase in tropical sea surface temps has contributed to hurricane intensity, and that's really all that previous article says. unless i'm missing something?
:confused:
Yeah mate sorry, I am finding it really difficult to find any scientific papers or even articles on this subject, but honestly I have heard a number of oceanographers mention the recent rises as in the last 5 or so years has well outside the normal band of fluxuation. They do not have a reason for this and it falls outside of the effect range of global warming. I suggest perhaps pole shifts and heating up of our ocean surface may be linked. We are well overdue a pole flip and already there are anomolous regions off the coast of South Africa were north is south and visa versa. Which may indicate a pre cursor for a full blown pole switch. Models suggest that the earths magnetic sphere is like one of those lava lamps, you know with red and blue fluid, if ytou shake it up, pockets of blue show in the red just before the entire red section flips to the blue. That was bad English but I hope you get the idea. :handshake:
The sun goes no-where near the centre of our galaxy!!
We are about 26,000 light years away from it's centre!!!
These guys reackon our solar system is travelling at Warp 13!!!
Even if the Earth is on a tight eliptical orbit (no where near what these idiots are suggesting), it takes 225-250 million years for one circuit. So the Earth will at best be at it's closest to the galactic centre every 125 million years. Not 2,000.
Just to put that in context, we've currently travelled 0.0008 of an orbit since the beginning of man.
Have you bought the DVD yet? :haha:
With all due respect these guys are not idiots. Perhaps I should be more specific. We are located on one of other regions of a spiral arm of a spiral galaxy. We are indeed far far away for the actual center of our galaxy and thank fuck we will never get too close to it. We do travel up through and then down through the galactic center plane. I am sorry for not stating the obvious I have been taking about this subject for so long and have always heard it referred to as the galactic center as its painfully obvious we dont travel through the actual center.
Now when I say ellitpitcal I mean this, if you can imagine that our galaxy is like a giant fly saucer shape, at the center were it is budging is the actual galactic center we new stars are been made at an amazing rate, a vertible star factory. Now as you rightly point out we are much much further away, making a guess I would say perhaps 2/3rds the distance out on one of the arms. We orbit the center in a circular orbit but we do so at a slight angle. Meaning once every every 13,000 years or so we travel through the much more dense galactic plain and even now also a plain which contains a very strong gravity field from the Super Massive black hole. I hope that explains it more clearly. Sorry my bad :handshake:
Most of that is hypothetical
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=12384690&dopt=Citation
Matt, most of it is not hypothetical, I am guessing you probably know that also. Black holes are an incredibly knew concept in Physics. People assume they have been around for ever but thats not the case at all. Not so long ago they were the realms of purely science fiction and to even mention there potential existence would be professional suicide for a cosmologist. Due to the excellent work of Hawkings and other leading scientists, black holes are no longer just on chalk boards hidden in some complex mathematical formula they are in the observable universe. Observed by a numer of ways, off the top of my head Lensing being one, it the fact that there strong gravitational fields act like a magnifying lense, making stars temperarly seem much brigher for a instant when observing them, indications to scientists that there well may be a black hole in that region of space. Also particle jets which can been seen across the universe, but anyways I digress. Now if Blackholes are new, Supermassive black holes are literally fresh of the press.
Sure you are going to find it difficult to get a definitive statement on this subject. But most leading cosmologist now beleive that there is a super massive black hole at the center of our galaxy and at the center of most galaxys.
What happens when we go through the galactic plain is hypothetical but it does correlate nicely with mass extinctions and massive earth changing events as a matter of record.
:handshake:
Perhaps the Norwegians have the heads up on what is going on :jaw:
Norway to House Seeds in Doomsday Vault
By Doug Mellgren
Associated Press
posted: 19 June 2006
12:18 am ET
OSLO, Norway (AP)—It sounds like something from a science fiction film—a doomsday vault carved into a frozen mountainside on a secluded Arctic island ready to serve as a Noah's Ark for seeds in case of a global catastrophe.
But Norway's ambitious project is on its way to becoming reality Monday when construction begins on the Svalbard Global Seed Vault, designed to house as many as 3 million of the world's crop seeds.
Prime ministers of Norway, Sweden, Denmark, Finland and Iceland were to attend the cornerstone ceremony on Monday morning near the town of Longyearbyen in Norway's remote Svalbard Islands, roughly 620 miles from the North Pole.
Norway's Agriculture Minister Terje Riis-Johansen has called the vault a "Noah's Ark on Svalbard.''
Its purpose is to ensure the survival of crop diversity in the event of plant epidemics, nuclear war, natural disasters or climate change, and to offer the world a chance to restart growth of food crops that may have been wiped out.
The seeds, packaged in foil, would be stored at such cold temperatures that they could last hundreds, even thousands, of years, according to the independent Global Crop Diversity Trust. The trust, founded in 2004, has also worked on the project and will help run the vault, which is scheduled to open and start accepting seeds from around the world in September 2007.
Oil-rich Norway first proposed the idea a year ago, drawing wide international interest, Riis-Johansen said.
The Svalbard Archipelago, 300 miles north of the mainland, was selected because it is located far from many threats and has a consistently cold climate.
Those factors will help protect the seeds and safeguard their genetic makeup, Norway's Foreign Ministry said. The vault will have thick concrete walls, and even if all cooling systems fail, the temperature in the frozen mountain will never rise above freezing due to permafrost, it said.
While the facility will be fenced in and guarded, Svalbard's free-roaming polar bears, known for their ferocity, could also act as natural guardians, according to the Global Diversity Trust.
The Nordic nation is footing the bill, amounting to about $4.8 million for infrastructure costs.
"This facility will provide a practical means to re-establish crops obliterated by major disasters,'' Cary Fowler, the trust's executive secretary, said in a statement, adding that crop diversity is also threatened by "accidents, mismanagement and shortsighted budget cuts.''
Already, some 1,400 seed banks around the world, most of them national, hold samples of their host country's crops.
But these banks are vulnerable to shutdowns, natural disasters, war and lack of funds, said Riis-Johansen.
Storing duplicate seeds in the Svalbard vault is meant to offer a fail-safe system for the planet.
The idea of a global seed bank has been around since the early 1980s, but unresolved issues, such as ownership rights to genetic material, stalled it until the U.N. Food and Agriculture Organization adopted the International Treaty on Plant Genetic Resources for Food and Agriculture in 2001.
While Norway will own the vault facility, countries contributing seeds will own the material they deposit—much as with a bank safe deposit box. The Global Crop Diversity Trust will help developing countries pay the cost of preparing and sending seeds.
Mattshark
13-02-07, 05:40 AM
Matt, most of it is not hypothetical, I am guessing you probably know that also. Black holes are an incredibly knew concept in Physics. People assume they have been around for ever but thats not the case at all. Not so long ago they were the realms of purely science fiction and to even mention there potential existence would be professional suicide for a cosmologist. Due to the excellent work of Hawkings and other leading scientists, black holes are no longer just on chalk boards hidden in some complex mathematical formula they are in the observable universe. Observed by a numer of ways, off the top of my head Lensing being one, it the fact that there strong gravitational fields act like a magnifying lense, making stars temperarly seem much brigher for a instant when observing them, indications to scientists that there well may be a black hole in that region of space. Also particle jets which can been seen across the universe, but anyways I digress. Now if Blackholes are new, Supermassive black holes are literally fresh of the press.
Sure you are going to find it difficult to get a definitive statement on this subject. But most leading cosmologist now beleive that there is a super massive black hole at the center of our galaxy and at the center of most galaxys.
What happens when we go through the galactic plain is hypothetical but it does correlate nicely with mass extinctions and massive earth changing events as a matter of record.
:handshake:
I know what is believed I was just pointing out that such things are actually not proven though.
It correlates to an extent, but the original post misses is incorrect on the position of the Solar System, we are in an outer arm of the galaxy. The Mayan Calander reference is just a measurement of the movement of Venus, its just the restarting of the cycle, that is all.
I know what is believed I was just pointing out that such things are actually not proven though.
It correlates to an extent, but the original post misses is incorrect on the position of the Solar System, we are in an outer arm of the galaxy. The Mayan Calander reference is just a measurement of the movement of Venus, its just the restarting of the cycle, that is all.
Sure, I get ya.
In cosmology its very difficult prove anything beyond doubt and in fact science regardless of field of study very rarely closed the book or makes bold statements of fact, unlike my ill advised Thread Titles. There is no extent to it mate, our solar system travels around the galaxy on a elliptical orbit, its almost certain that there is a super massive black hole at the center of our galaxy anchoring everything and when we travel through the galactic plain, bad things happen. No hokus pokus or airy fairy crap, science.
One of the major reasons we can no prove the exsistence of Super Massive Black holes is because we have to look inward towards the center of the Galaxy to see it, the deeper into the galaxy you go the busier it becomes, since all out accepted knoweldge is based on observation, like Hawkings black holes they were not real till we seen them, its very hard to "see" these things as we are literally faced with a wall of Brilliant Light which is kind of like the Wizard of Oz, velvet curtain. We can't see them at the moment but we know they are there as we see its effects. These things are so huge and powerful that not only do they keep the entire galaxy held together its force expands far far outside of the galaxies real estate. This force is at its stongest at the central plain.
The Mayan calendar date of Dec 21 2012 is kind of like a cosmic perfect storm, not only will we be smack bang in the middle of the cosmic plain, all of the planets line up perfectly to the sun and the Sun Solar Cycle will be at its highest ever recorded. So we could have Kuplier Belt objects raining in on us, if the a solar flare comes in our direction, because of the planetary alignment and the gravitational sling shot effect we could get a radiation blast straight in the face, and many many other not so palatable things could quite easily occure. Honestly mate I will be geniuenly surprised if 2012 pass's by with out major incident and hopefully we will all be around Dec 22 so I can tell you all Haha Mother Fuckers ! I told you so ... :haha: :handshake:
Sorry to expand on the not being able to see the Super massive black holes just in case there is confusion. That wall of Brilliant White light is stars being formed. Its like I put you in a Dark room, sit you down, put a flood Light in your face and ask you to take a reading test. Cosmologists are working on how to get around this show stopper but so far its proven difficult, all a matter of spectrography and I am sure they will crack it soon.
Also are you implying that Mayan Calender just tracks the movement of Venus ? if so that not that case and calendars are not supposed to end.
Mattshark
13-02-07, 11:11 AM
Also are you implying that Mayan Calender just tracks the movement of Venus ? if so that not that case and calendars are not supposed to end.
It doesn't actually end, it resets.
Kronenburg1892
14-02-07, 12:46 PM
Now when I say ellitpitcal I mean this, if you can imagine that our galaxy is like a giant fly saucer shape, at the center were it is budging is the actual galactic center we new stars are been made at an amazing rate, a vertible star factory. Now as you rightly point out we are much much further away, making a guess I would say perhaps 2/3rds the distance out on one of the arms. We orbit the center in a circular orbit but we do so at a slight angle. Meaning once every every 13,000 years or so we travel through the much more dense galactic plain and even now also a plain which contains a very strong gravity field from the Super Massive black hole. I hope that explains it more clearly. Sorry my bad :handshake:
Ok, I get that now, but we oscilate in that plane every 52 million years and centre line passages through the denser mass areas of the arm of orion occur every 26 million years. (Which is a totally seperate theory of mass extinctions).
Have you got any credible links to this 13,000 year oscillation?
let me get back to you mate.
Kronenburg1892
14-02-07, 01:05 PM
It doesn't take 26,000 years to orbit the galactic centre, it takes 225-250 million years for one circuit.
Yeah sorry mate, what with it being Valentines Day and everything I am a little tied up.. will get back to you tomorrow morning
Abdul Alhazred
14-02-07, 09:28 PM
Have you got any credible links to this 13,000 year oscillation?
In anticipation, could I just add the following :
WARNING: TINFOIL HAT ZONE
Kronenburg1892
14-02-07, 09:52 PM
I don't really have problems with tin hats, you often find interesting connections to things, I'm pretty much sure this one has no credability though.
Although the use of the number "13,000" does have common links in our solar system, which is sort of interesting.
Anyway Mr.Nice, enjoy your evenning.
I don't really have problems with tin hats, you often find interesting connections to things, I'm pretty much sure this one has no credability though.
Although the use of the number "13,000" does have common links in our solar system, which is sort of interesting.
Anyway Mr.Nice, enjoy your evenning.
Sorry mate I think I got my numbers mixed up. confusing your statement that we are 26,000 light years from the center .. I think I shot from the hip and halfed it to 13,000. The basic idea remains the same, although I am sure the number 13,000 is important ..
In anticipation, could I just add the following :
WARNING: TINFOIL HAT ZONE
My dear friend if shit was wit you would be badly constipated:handshake:
I don't really have problems with tin hats, you often find interesting connections to things, I'm pretty much sure this one has no credability though.
Although the use of the number "13,000" does have common links in our solar system, which is sort of interesting.
Anyway Mr.Nice, enjoy your evenning.
This idea is completely credible I assure you.
Alas its Information, make of it what you will, I am getting a little tired of going back and forth. The thread and the information was posted in good faith. Do I know how the world will end ? of course not. Do I believe this, at some level I do but rationality (which is not always a good thing) overrides my thought process and screams Naaay. All I will say for me personally, this theory checks a lot of boxs across a range of areas. As someone who know a little about cosmology it makes sense. Werther it is real or not, I cannot say, nor can anyone really when it comes to cosmic events.
I listened to the talk given by this guy and I was blown away.Tge next morning I posted this thread. Since then If I be honest I have been less than impressed with the production of the DVD or there website (I have seen previews) but the information and ideas remain the same.
I come across interesting information and theories all of the time. When I post this stuff on here, I do so because I look upon KT'rs now Est1892'rs as my extended red mates and tell them about this shit just like I do my friends when we are having a pint. Because its interesting stuff, it may not be right all of the time but the more information people are aware of the better equipped they are to make up their own minds.
Anyways you think this shit is crazy wait till I fire up a thread on HAARP :rash:
My dear friend if shit was wit you would be badly constipated:handshake:
FLMAO. Thats brilliant.
Red_Polo
15-02-07, 09:49 AM
Although I think he means if wit were shit... :D
Im wondering whether Noam Chomsky wants his joke book back
Abdul Alhazred
15-02-07, 08:06 PM
Im wondering whether Noam Chomsky wants his joke book back
:haha:
kiss me you fool
Nicey - nothing wrong with the tinfoil hat zone, I spend many happy hours there myself.
:handshake:
:haha:
kiss me you fool
Nicey - nothing wrong with the tinfoil hat zone, I spend many happy hours there myself.
:handshake:
Dont mind me mate, I'm a narky sod .. too many expressos
:handshake:
Well I like your posts, keep em up :handshake:
Mattshark
16-02-07, 03:17 PM
Dont mind me mate, I'm a narky sod .. too many expressos
:handshake:
I personally prefer espresso :p
Mattshark
16-02-07, 03:55 PM
Fuck off you
:haha:
:cry:
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