View Full Version : How many genuinely World Class English players have there been since.................
the start of the Premier League some 15 years ago?
Off the top of my head I would say:
Gazza (while it lasted :sigh: )
Paul Scholes (I hate to say this from 1998 to around 2002 he's been world class IMO)
Sol Camplbell (not very good on the ball but a fcuking rock from 1998 to around 2004)
David Seaman (I'd say 1992 to 1998, then it was downhill from there)
Robbie Fowler (before the injuries :sigh: )
That's it for me, so why no Gerrard and Owen you say?
Sometimes I think Gerrard is world class and sometimes I don't, I'm just undecided.
Owen is too one dimesional for my blood.
JohnnyLambert
27-03-07, 08:53 AM
Wouldnt agree with Sol Campbell and Gazza had his best days before the start of the prem!!
Got to add Alan Shearer to that - Absoloute class and Beckham - Nobody touched him 1998-2002!
I woul definately add Gerrard and Owen to the list if you including Scholes/Seaman!!
After the champions league and FA Cup finals what other player could do what Stevie did and as for Owen on top of his game consistently for 4/5 years 98 onwards!!
Steve McManaman defo! Was brilliant in the Premiership and La Liga. And he won the Champs League too. You must consider him World Class! :handshake:
And don't you forget Alan Shearer!
Gary Lineker.
Peter Beardsley IMO.
The_weatherman
27-03-07, 09:49 AM
So an english team would look like what?
Seaman
G. Neville - Campbell - Terry - ?
Beckham - Gerrard - Scholes - ?
Shearer - Fowler
Have to put Terry there and I think Shearer and Fowler could do a good job (in their prime), but what about the left side?
JohnnyLambert
27-03-07, 09:56 AM
So an english team would look like what?
Seaman
G. Neville - Campbell - Terry - ?
Beckham - Gerrard - Scholes - ?
Shearer - Fowler
Have to put Terry there and I think Shearer and Fowler could do a good job (in their prime), but what about the left side?
McManaman was great at club level!!
Left back is a bit of a shortage - Le Saux was no way world class, ashley Cole isn't either so that leaves....Tony Dorigo or Michael Gray :haha:
Joe Le Toff
27-03-07, 10:15 AM
Scholes - Wonderful player, regardless of who he plays for.
Shearer - Average at everything to do with centre-forward play, which is why he was so good, no weakness
Gerrard
Beckham
A couple of years ago Ashley Cole was in my opinion the best LB in the world. He seems to have gone backwards though.
Robbie, Owen, Scholes, G.Neville, Terry, Beckham, Shearer, Gerrard, McManaman and Adams.
The_weatherman
27-03-07, 10:28 AM
Robbie, Owen, Scholes, G.Neville, Terry, Beckham, Shearer, Gerrard, McManaman and Adams.
You still havenīt solved my LB dilemma :shake: And Iīm having difficulty calling McManaman a world class player, he was very very good but did he score enough?
Wouldnt agree with Sol Campbell and Gazza had his best days before the start of the prem!!
Got to add Alan Shearer to that - Absoloute class and Beckham - Nobody touched him 1998-2002!
I woul definately add Gerrard and Owen to the list if you including Scholes/Seaman!!
After the champions league and FA Cup finals what other player could do what Stevie did and as for Owen on top of his game consistently for 4/5 years 98 onwards!!
OK, fair points but who has performed better and more consistently for England from 1998 to 2004 than Sol Campbell, he was also a one man band at Spurs for many years.
Shearer, OK maybe.
Beckham no way...............very good at two things, great work rate doesn't equal world class IMO
Seaman was world class in his prime IMO
I think Scholes is quality
I also take your point about Gazza
Gerrard, not sure if he's there mentally
I don't rate players liek Owen as world class, I must admit this is more of a personal taste thing.......
Gary Lineker.
Peter Beardsley IMO.
Lineker = NO
Beardsely = YES, but were'nt his best days in the 80s though?
So an english team would look like what?
Seaman
G. Neville - Campbell - Terry - ?
Beckham - Gerrard - Scholes - ?
Shearer - Fowler
Have to put Terry there and I think Shearer and Fowler could do a good job (in their prime), but what about the left side?
Take out Neville, Terry, Beckham and I can live with the rest.
A couple of years ago Ashley Cole was in my opinion the best LB in the world. He seems to have gone backwards though.
I agree :handshake:
Dalglish
27-03-07, 11:42 AM
frank lampard :handshake:
The_weatherman
27-03-07, 11:44 AM
Take out Neville, Terry, Beckham and I can live with the rest.
Really? I think Beckham was world class but on second thought Iīll drop Neville on your request but I feel Terry is also world class, if heīs not then who is?
The_weatherman
27-03-07, 11:45 AM
frank lampard :handshake:
Iīve tried to get him labeled as WC before but Iīm repeatedly shot to bits - you are entering dangerous territory :handshake:
Dalglish
27-03-07, 11:49 AM
Iīve tried to get him labeled as WC before but Iīm repeatedly shot to bits - you are entering dangerous territory :handshake:
I'm also Scottish :cool:
Really? I think Beckham was world class but on second thought Iīll drop Neville on your request but I feel Terry is also world class, if heīs not then who is?
For an attacking player Beckham is way too limited for my blood. Terry is a great 'second' defender and he should give half of his pay check to Makalele and about 25% to Essien.
Iīve tried to get him labeled as WC before but Iīm repeatedly shot to bits - you are entering dangerous territory :handshake:
Lampard = another attacking English player who is not the full package, very good at certain things...........
JohnnyLambert
27-03-07, 12:08 PM
Whatever you say Beckham was unbelievable in scums treble winning seson and thereafter for around 2 years!! How many games were won by his cross, Free Kick or defence splitting pass!
I agree not an all round fantastic plyer with every attribute like Zidane but what he did assist wise and Free kicks there was nobody better!!
The_weatherman
27-03-07, 12:51 PM
But how many world class players are good at everything? Ronnie isnīt good at everything and him and Lampard have similar(ish) stats regarding goals and assists last couple of seasons. So Ronnie is not world class then? There are not many players that can fill as many postitions as Gerrard and they donīt have to IMO.
Regarding Terry, swap him with someone else and Chelsea are weaker. He is formidable in the air and has great position, name me another world class CB if Terry isnīt one.
tomasjj
27-03-07, 01:34 PM
Not Lineker?
He was a top player for years.
JohnnyLambert
27-03-07, 01:35 PM
Bobby Moore
But how many world class players are good at everything? Ronnie isnīt good at everything and him and Lampard have similar(ish) stats regarding goals and assists last couple of seasons. So Ronnie is not world class then? There are not many players that can fill as many postitions as Gerrard and they donīt have to IMO.
Regarding Terry, swap him with someone else and Chelsea are weaker. He is formidable in the air and has great position, name me another world class CB if Terry isnīt one.
For what it's worth I almost entirely agree with you. However I think that this blanket definition of world class makes it hard to differentiated between two groups of great player:
1/ Those like Ronaldinho who is an out and out great player, any team would be better with him in than out. He obviously can't do everything but who cares as he can single handedly win/turn games.
2/ Those like Lampard who are the best at a very narrow limited role. When you play a genuine holding player Lampard is expceptional at moving the ball from deep to an attacking position while also offering a goal threat himself. In different midfield setups to the one in which he thrives at Chelsea I suspect he would be a much lesser player. However possibly the only player who could do what he does better is Scholes.
Whatever you say Beckham was unbelievable in scums treble winning seson and thereafter for around 2 years!! How many games were won by his cross, Free Kick or defence splitting pass!
I agree not an all round fantastic plyer with every attribute like Zidane but what he did assist wise and Free kicks there was nobody better!!
Your post just mae mypoint for me. Free kick and crosses and if a plyerr is not as well rounded as Zidane then lower the standard to make up the numbers. As for the SCUM treble year and 2 years after, are yo really saying Beckham was more important to those teams that Keane, Giggs. Scholes, Cole, Staam, Schmeicel.................. I say HELL NO.
But how many world class players are good at everything? Ronnie isnīt good at everything and him and Lampard have similar(ish) stats regarding goals and assists last couple of seasons. So Ronnie is not world class then? There are not many players that can fill as many postitions as Gerrard and they donīt have to IMO.
Regarding Terry, swap him with someone else and Chelsea are weaker. He is formidable in the air and has great position, name me another world class CB if Terry isnīt one.
As for Ronnie see dww post.
Terry, I'd rather ha Nesta
Not Lineker?
He was a top player for years.
Compare him to Trzeguet, stats are very similar. Is Ttrez world class in your opinioon
JohnnyLambert
27-03-07, 02:39 PM
Your post just mae mypoint for me. Free kick and crosses and if a plyerr is not as well rounded as Zidane then lower the standard to make up the numbers. As for the SCUM treble year and 2 years after, are yo really saying Beckham was more important to those teams that Keane, Giggs. Scholes, Cole, Staam, Schmeicel.................. I say HELL NO.
Just as important as Giggs, Keane and Schmeicel but far mor than fukn Andy Cole. I dont seem to remember Scholes being an absoloute world beater either.
Undoubtedly a match winner at the top of his game and virtually ubtouchable!!
JohnnyLambert
27-03-07, 02:41 PM
Compare him to Trzeguet, stats are very similar. Is Ttrez world class in your opinioon
Trezeguet won a golden boot has he??
Fuck dont even compare David Trezeguet to Gary Lineker!!
The_weatherman
27-03-07, 02:48 PM
As for Ronnie see dww post.
Terry, I'd rather ha Nesta
Iīm not sure Nesta would be much better than Terry, still IMO and thatīs all it is, my opinion, Terry and Lampard can be classed as world class. Lampard is no all-rounder, I am aware of that but look at what he does for Chelsea.
frank lampard :handshake:
:haha:
He's no Scott Brown.
Definite world class (i.e done it for a number of years at the top level - club and country and probably classed as top one or two in their position)
Shearer - 92-200 probably the best CF in the league an top 3 in the world (complete)
Scholes - 97 onwards he has been peerless
Gascoigne - early-mid 90's he was sensational
Neville (G.) - In the top 3 right backs in the worl for over a decade
Beckham - 97-02 The perfect team player. 10 goals a year, more assists and phenomenal work rate. Best in the world at his job.
Gerrard - See above and say 00-onwards
No-one else.
Dalglish
27-03-07, 03:13 PM
:haha:
He's no Scott Brown.
I know who I'd rather have in my team
JohnnyLambert
27-03-07, 03:26 PM
I know who I'd rather have in my team
Wes Brown?
wavydavy
27-03-07, 03:37 PM
Robbie. That's it!!
tomasjj
27-03-07, 04:50 PM
Compare him to Trzeguet, stats are very similar. Is Ttrez world class in your opinioon
They both do their assigned task - score goals.
That is a difficult art.
If you want to look past that, saying that they don't have enough skills, sure, go ahead.
I think Lineker was a world class striker.
CharlieMansonsSquint
27-03-07, 06:43 PM
Ryan Giggs
Thierry Henry
Dennis Bergkamp
Robbie Fowler
Alan Shearer
Michael Owen
Peter Schmeichel
Roy Keane
Ryan Giggs
Thierry Henry
Dennis Bergkamp
Robbie Fowler
Alan Shearer
Michael Owen
Peter Schmeichel
Roy Keane
So Robbie Fowler and Michael Owen then?
Agree :handshake:
tomasjj
27-03-07, 07:06 PM
Ryan Giggs
Thierry Henry
Dennis Bergkamp
Robbie Fowler
Alan Shearer
Michael Owen
Peter Schmeichel
Roy Keane
Good list.
Zola perhaps?
Cantona was good too, but a twat.
Gary Neville could ever be called World Class unless we're talking about Mars.
Defenders - Sol, Terry, Adams, Rio, Carra
Midfield - Gerrard, Giggs, Scholes, Beckham, McManaman
Strikers - Owen, Shearer, Rooney
Rush, Barnes, Beardsley were past their best for the premiership, but clearly world-class.
I can't count Fowler as he didn't prove it for England. :jaw:
I think Ruud van Nistelrooy deserves a mention, seeing as Zola, Bergkamp etc. have been bought into it.
I think Ruud van Nistelrooy deserves a mention, seeing as Zola, Bergkamp etc. have been bought into it.
as does viera and klinnsman
thesilverfoxlfc
27-03-07, 10:18 PM
A.Cole is world Class IMO
thesilverfoxlfc
27-03-07, 10:21 PM
Fowler for me never made it to the World Class level the lad couldnt get an England Start. He was excellent for us before his injuries and will be a Liverpool Icon and legend for years to come
CharlieMansonsSquint
27-03-07, 10:26 PM
Good list.
Zola perhaps?
Cantona was good too, but a twat.
Good shouts. Deserve to be on that list.
JohnnyLambert
27-03-07, 10:47 PM
as does viera and klinnsman
I think Ruud van Nistelrooy deserves a mention, seeing as Zola, Bergkamp etc. have been bought into it.
Good list.
Zola perhaps?
Cantona was good too, but a twat.
Good shouts. Deserve to be on that list.
This thread is for world class English players:)
tomasjj
28-03-07, 08:56 AM
This thread is for world class English players:)
We are all one big family, dude... :cool:
JohnnyLambert
28-03-07, 09:27 AM
I know mate and i'd glady name 10 foreign world class players that have graced the prem!!
simey85
28-03-07, 11:05 AM
i would say fowler was approaching world class though injury stopped him reaching it. owen imo is defintiley a world class performer!
Red_Polo
28-03-07, 01:29 PM
If people are saying Sol Campbell then surely Tony Adams has to be there or thereabouts too?
Gary Neville? FLMAO! If you asked top managers across Europe for their team of the last 15 years, would he make anybody's but Ferguson's? I doubt it. He's been a very reliable player for the Mancs but never in a million years has he been one of those fullbacks that stands out as a truly class player. The value he represents for a team could be matched by plenty of other players, he's not part of an elite group of world class players ffs. Honestly :shake:
simey85
28-03-07, 01:45 PM
Gary Neville? FLMAO! If you asked top managers across Europe for their team of the last 15 years, would he make anybody's but Ferguson's? I doubt it. He's been a very reliable player for the Mancs but never in a million years has he been one of those fullbacks that stands out as a truly class player. The value he represents for a team could be matched by plenty of other players, he's not part of an elite group of world class players ffs. Honestly :shake:
agreed undoubtedly a very good player that has been reliable for utd, a complete tosser with it but surely cafu and zambrotta, thuram, torecelli would have been the top right backs in the game in recent years?
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