View Full Version : Saint Mike is back.
OWEN'S ON WAY
By Simon Bird 11/04/2007
MICHAEL OWEN put 10 months of injury hell behind him by making a goalscoring return for Newcastle in a practice match yesterday.
The England striker played 70 minutes against a makeshift team from Scottish Division One side Gretna - and scored early on in the 4-1 win.
Owen, in line for place on the bench at Portsmouth on Saturday, made a huge step towards being fit for the last five league games and England's Euro 2008 clash with Estonia in June.
His first start is likely to be against Chelsea a week on Saturday at St James' Park but he is also now in line to come to Steve McClaren's rescue.
Owen, 27, has had an operation to repair his cruciate ligament and cartilage after he was injured playing against Sweden in the World Cup.
CLICKY - The Mirror (http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/tm_headline=owen%2Ds-on-way--%26method=full%26objectid=18887309%26siteid=89520-name_page.html)
Owen makes "brilliant" Newcastle comeback
tribalfooball.com - April 10, 2007
Newcastle United striker Michael Owen made a playing comeback in a closed-doors friendly against Gretna last night.
The Newcastle and England forward played for 75 minutes and is now set for a return against champions Chelsea in 10 days' time.
Owen scored and created a goal for fellow returning forward Shola Ameobi, who has been out since last year after undergoing hip surgery.
Newcastle sealed off their Little Benton training ground to deny any photographs to be taken of Owen on the day, having denied on Monday that the 26-year-old was set for his biggest step yet towards a return to the Premiership.
But in game of three half-an-hour thirds, Owen completed all but 15 minutes in a 4-1 victory that saw Glenn Roeder also give outings to Titus Bramble, Albert Luque and Charles N'Zogbia.
Gretna full back Gavin Skelton said: "If that's what he's like after nine months out of the game, I'd hate to play against a full fit Michael Owen.
"The goal was the hallmark of a great striker. It was just a half-chance really from the edge of the box but in a flash he'd buried it in the bottom corner of the net with a right foot shot.
"He didn't smash it, it was just very clinical, brilliantly placed. He looked very sharp throughout and while I can't recall him having any more chances, his link up play was excellent.
"I didn't notice him heavy breathing either. Stamina-wise, you wouldn't have thought this was his comeback game. Obviously, he's not going to be match fit but to me, he looks ready for the Premiership.
"We're not a bad side in our own right but he's the best we've played against. I'm glad I don't come across forwards of his calibre every week."
I hope he has a lovely long career of winning fuck all in geordie land
Craig_H
11-04-07, 08:23 AM
I really dont understand all the bitterness and resentment shown towards one of our leading goalscorers of all time...
Rush never had this when he went to Juve... :shake:
And before anyone says "But he came back", Owen WOULD'VE come back if we'd agreed a fee with Madrid - we didnt. Not his fault.
"I would like to say a special thank you for being given the opportunity to play for the best team in the world."
Craig_H
11-04-07, 08:34 AM
"I would like to say a special thank you for being given the opportunity to play for the best team in the world."
I'm assuming that's his quote about Madrid, is it?
Who WOULDNT say the right things in certain situations? I think it's naive to expect anything different. Whatever anyone might say, the statistics say Madrid are the biggest/most successful club in the world.
Whilst most blokes are in the NSFW knocking one out, AFII is doing so whilst viewing this thread :(
cannotmakeit
11-04-07, 08:49 AM
oh Owen again.........
Whilst most blokes are in the NSFW knocking one out, AFII is doing so whilst viewing this thread :(
http://smileys.sur-la-toile.com/repository/Divers/0179.gif
Liverpool
11-04-07, 11:32 AM
I really dont understand all the bitterness and resentment shown towards one of our leading goalscorers of all time...
Rush never had this when he went to Juve... :shake:
And before anyone says "But he came back", Owen WOULD'VE come back if we'd agreed a fee with Madrid - we didnt. Not his fault.
The way he left saying I'll sign soon and ran his contract down and he could have told madrid he's only leaving for Liverpool
Jack D Rips
11-04-07, 11:36 AM
The way he left saying I'll sign soon and ran his contract down and he could have told madrid he's only leaving for Liverpool
Thats the very reason. Rush didnt do that
Craig_H
11-04-07, 11:52 AM
The way he left saying I'll sign soon and ran his contract down and he could have told madrid he's only leaving for Liverpool
He never categorically said he would sign...
anfieldanfield
11-04-07, 12:06 PM
I really dont understand all the bitterness and resentment shown towards one of our leading goalscorers of all time...
Rush never had this when he went to Juve... :shake:
And before anyone says "But he came back", Owen WOULD'VE come back if we'd agreed a fee with Madrid - we didnt. Not his fault.
If Owen had really wanted to come back he should have told Madrid "It's Liverpool or I stay - I am not going to Newcastle".
I respect Owen for the goals he scored for us, but I dont want him back and couldn't care less what happens to him from now on.
Craig_H
11-04-07, 12:13 PM
I think it's naive to suggest that Owen should've risked jeopordising his own career and the World Cup, on the chance that Madrid would've played ball - because they probably wouldnt have.
I think it's naive to suggest that Owen should've risked jeopordising his own career and the World Cup, on the chance that Madrid would've played ball - because they probably wouldnt have.
His own career or his England career?
Craig_H
11-04-07, 12:18 PM
His own career or his England career?
I dont make a major distinction between the two.
No one knows if Madrid would have agreed to sell him to us if Owen had turned down Newcastle.
The only really interesting point is that Rafa wanted to sign him after that happened. He got injured and that ended our interest.
I don't think Rafa would have been interested at all if Owen had a choice when he left Real but as I said, I don't know the facts so it's all about what I believe happened.
Craig_H
11-04-07, 01:04 PM
When we signed Morientes, it was 6 months later than we'd wanted to. We wanted him the previous summer but we didnt agree the fee. Morientes stood his ground and stamped his feet - and ended up staying at Madrid til the January, not playing much and generally going downhill.
Owen would've seen this. So the notion that Madrid would've backed down, if Owen had stamped his feet, is hardly what i'd call solid.
Jack D Rips
11-04-07, 01:24 PM
When we signed Morientes, it was 6 months later than we'd wanted to. We wanted him the previous summer but we didnt agree the fee. Morientes stood his ground and stamped his feet - and ended up staying at Madrid til the January, not playing much and generally going downhill.
Owen would've seen this. So the notion that Madrid would've backed down, if Owen had stamped his feet, is hardly what i'd call solid.
Do you not think that if Owen had signalled his "Real" intent earlier that we might have got Morientes when we wanted him?. Maybe I'm wrong but that is my view.
Mumsafan
11-04-07, 01:37 PM
I couldn't give a shit about Michael Owen, quite frankly.
When we signed Morientes, it was 6 months later than we'd wanted to. We wanted him the previous summer but we didnt agree the fee. Morientes stood his ground and stamped his feet - and ended up staying at Madrid til the January, not playing much and generally going downhill.
Owen would've seen this. So the notion that Madrid would've backed down, if Owen had stamped his feet, is hardly what i'd call solid.
What, and had to wait all of 4 months to leave? God, Sven might have even withdrawn him from the England squad by then :rash:
Michael Owen was a shithouse and has paid for it, end of.
cannotmakeit
11-04-07, 03:13 PM
I couldn't give a shit about Michael Owen, quite frankly.
:handshake:
cannotmakeit
11-04-07, 03:14 PM
What, and had to wait all of 4 months to leave? God, Sven might have even withdrawn him from the England squad by then :rash:
Michael Owen was a shithouse and has paid for it, end of.
Sven drop Owen??? He knows he was untouchable along with Beckham.
Meursault
11-04-07, 03:16 PM
I can't believe he is back earlier than 'Ary. :(
Sven drop Owen??? He knows he was untouchable along with Beckham.
That's what I was getting at, hence the: :rash:
:handshake:
"I would like to say a special thank you for being given the opportunity to play for the best team in the world."The Very next year,Liverpool won the CHAMPIONS LEAGUE.
WAS HE SICK OR WHAT? EJITT
Hope he enjoys the superior wages he made at REAL MADRID.
:haha: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha:
I'm assuming that's his quote about Madrid, is it?
Who WOULDNT say the right things in certain situations? I think it's naive to expect anything different. Whatever anyone might say, the statistics say Madrid are the biggest/most successful club in the world.
Who`s being naive?
Craig_H
12-04-07, 02:04 AM
Who`s being naive?
Anyone who doesnt expect players to come out with statements like that.
Craig_H
12-04-07, 02:05 AM
What, and had to wait all of 4 months to leave? God, Sven might have even withdrawn him from the England squad by then :rash:
Michael Owen was a shithouse and has paid for it, end of.
How would he have left in 4 months time?
If you're talking about July or August, 4 months later would've been November or December. The window is closed then.
If you're talking about January, 4 months later is May. The window is closed then.
I'm not altogether sure what you're on about really.
If Owen had really wanted to come back he should have told Madrid "It's Liverpool or I stay - I am not going to Newcastle".
I respect Owen for the goals he scored for us, but I dont want him back and couldn't care less what happens to him from now on.
:handshake:
He was fuckin overpriced too, the Barcodes got bent over.
And as Quincy points out, we won the CL the season he left :haha: :crackoff:
Ron_Mexico
12-04-07, 02:36 AM
I couldn't give a shit about Michael Owen, quite frankly.
:handshake:
he was always in it for himself. he didn't, doesn't, and never will give two shits about Liverpool
he's the barcodes' midget now anyway
cannotmakeit
12-04-07, 03:17 AM
we win the FA cup as well in his 1st year at Newcastle.
2nd year there and we win the european cup? :finger:
They won't get European football next season, can they win the Inter-toto cup again?:whatever:
saint mike is back, you have to be shitting me? i really don't give a shit about him anymore, am not against him but ain't for him either. but clearly he lost his name tag the minute he traded in his shirt...
SouthAfricaRed
12-04-07, 07:25 AM
I couldn't give a shit about Michael Owen, quite frankly.
Mum Knows Best :rock:
I only started this thread so it won't be another 100 threads about him and I did it in this forum because he is a Newcastle player :handshake:
Newcastle boss Roeder delighted with Owen comeback
tribalfooball.com - April 11, 2007
Newcastle United boss Glenn Roeder was delighted to see Michael Owen make a successful comeback against Gretna on Tuesday.
He told the Evening Chronicle: "Michael played for 70 minutes in an 11 against 11 match with Gretna, which really equates to no more than a training session.
"As a result, in terms of returning to the Premiership he is really still a million miles away.
"But having said this, both myself and the medical staff were very happy and pleased at what we saw yesterday, as obviously Michael is getting closer to a comeback.
"And the same applies to Shola Ameobi, who has done tremendously well to get in the position he is in at the moment after his hip operation.
"Both of them will be extremely tired today, and now it is just a case of waiting and seeing how things turn out."
Whilst most blokes are in the NSFW knocking one out, AFII is doing so whilst viewing this thread :(
gay gay gay
Me or AF? :D
well, i'm convinced he has naked pictures of michael owen on his bedroom wall
but if you want to be gay too :handshake:
Maestro
12-04-07, 09:33 AM
I really dont understand all the bitterness and resentment shown towards one of our leading goalscorers of all time...
Rush never had this when he went to Juve... :shake:
And before anyone says "But he came back", Owen WOULD'VE come back if we'd agreed a fee with Madrid - we didnt. Not his fault.
I'm assuming that's his quote about Madrid, is it?
Who WOULDNT say the right things in certain situations? I think it's naive to expect anything different. Whatever anyone might say, the statistics say Madrid are the biggest/most successful club in the world.
I think it's naive not to expect other supporters to show bitterness and resentment about the way he left Liverpool, and then subsequently did not return.
It doesn't mean you have to agree with it, but surely it's understandable?
tomasjj
12-04-07, 09:34 AM
Tough luck eh, AFII?
:crackoff: :crackoff:
Crocked again is he?
Whats it now?
tomasjj
12-04-07, 09:39 AM
Crocked again is he?
Whats it now?
Broken dreams... :crackoff:
Where did you see that ? :haha: Twas a long time since I have registered an interest with this player. I'm shocked that there are still some posters who swear by him again. :D
some still believe in him.
I though am not one of them.
Maestro
12-04-07, 09:53 AM
Where did you see that?
Where did you see that?
I think he swapped Rocket for Michael Owen.
Tough luck eh, AFII?
:crackoff: :crackoff:
Can a Mod move this to the Saint Mike is back thread please :handshake:
I created that one so it wouldn't be a lot of other Owen threads :rolleyes:
Broken dreams... :crackoff:
:haha:
tomasjj
12-04-07, 09:59 AM
Where did you see that?
Get with the program, mate.:)
I don't like the way he left but it's down to our board to sell a player if he doesn't sign a new deal.
Rafa is a lot more intelligent than Houllier so he understand easy things like that. He looked at the situation and decided to sell him something that Houllier didn't do.
I have said that all the time. Both Owen and our board could have done their work better than they did. Owen should have signed a new deal and our board should have sold him a year earlier if he had refused to sign.
Owen used our weak board but that isn't to difficult. Our board at that time wasn't exactly any good, just look at the Macca situation for example.
If a board do what they should do then the Owen situation would never happen.
If he comes back then it will be because Rafa want him back and that he believes Owen would make our team better.
I don't think Rafa will sign him because he can't afford to take a risk with a player that have been out injured 16 months.
Craig_H
12-04-07, 10:21 AM
I think it's naive not to expect other supporters to show bitterness and resentment about the way he left Liverpool, and then subsequently did not return.
It doesn't mean you have to agree with it, but surely it's understandable?
Honestly? Yes, it's understandable that some supporters would be like this.
I do, however, find it very immature and petty, to be brutally honest.
They in turn dont have to agree with me on this, obviously.
Maestro
12-04-07, 11:01 AM
Rush never had this when he went to Juve... :shake:
That was a completely different footballing era.
Rush left Liverpool in 1987 to go to Juve - a few years before the advent of the Premiership and the megabucks that accompanied it.
In those days, footballers had to get real jobs once their career finished, because the money they made from football would not sustain them for the rest of their lives. Rushy was given an opportunity to earn some cash to provide for his family. Comparing his transfer to Owen's to Madrid is folly.
Honestly? Yes, it's understandable that some supporters would be like this.
I do, however, find it very immature and petty, to be brutally honest.
They in turn dont have to agree with me on this, obviously.
Why is it immature and petty?
The beef people have with Michael Owen is that he was deceitful and disloyal.
What is immature or petty in wanting the players who represent your club (many people's heroes) to be honest and loyal?
Supporters want to identify with the players and many cannot identify Owen. Therein lies the rub.
I don't like the way he left but it's down to our board to sell a player if he doesn't sign a new deal.
Rafa is a lot more intelligent than Houllier so he understand easy things like that. He looked at the situation and decided to sell him something that Houllier didn't do.
I have said that all the time. Both Owen and our board could have done their work better than they did. Owen should have signed a new deal and our board should have sold him a year earlier if he had refused to sign.
Owen used our weak board but that isn't to difficult. Our board at that time wasn't exactly any good, just look at the Macca situation for example.
If a board do what they should do then the Owen situation would never happen.
If he comes back then it will be because Rafa want him back and that he believes Owen would make our team better.
I don't think Rafa will sign him because he can't afford to take a risk with a player that have been out injured 16 months.
the board made the decision, maybe if rafa had begged them to change their minds they might have. but parry came out and said that the club would never make the same mistake they did about macca, if a player doesn't want to sing a deal with 2 years left of his contract they will be sold. i realize that he was sold with only one year left of his contract, that was du to the fact of him having assured people that he would, we won't make the same mistake again...
Craig_H
12-04-07, 11:12 AM
That was a completely different footballing era.
Rush left Liverpool in 1987 to go to Juve - a few years before the advent of the Premiership and the megabucks that accompanied it.
In those days, footballers had to get real jobs once their career finished, because the money they made from football would not sustain them for the rest of their lives. Rushy was given an opportunity to earn some cash to provide for his family. Comparing his transfer to Owen's to Madrid is folly.
Why is it immature and petty?
The beef people have with Michael Owen is that he was deceitful and disloyal.
What is immature or petty in wanting the players who represent your club (many people's heroes) to be honest and loyal?
Supporters want to identify with the players and many cannot identify Owen. Therein lies the rub.
The expressions 'thats football' and 'get over it' come to mind...
Loyalty in football is the rarest of commodities in this day and age, sadly.
The expressions 'thats football' and 'get over it' come to mind...
Loyalty in football is the rarest of commodities in this day and age, sadly.
when somebody says that he loves you and that he won't leave you only to do exactly the opposite. i have no problem with people leaving the club, it was the manner that he did it. i thank him for what he did for us but he has no place in my heart, lost all respect for him and don't give a fuck what happens to him good or bad.
Craig_H
12-04-07, 11:28 AM
when somebody says that he loves you and that he won't leave you only to do exactly the opposite. i have no problem with people leaving the club, it was the manner that he did it. i thank him for what he did for us but he has no place in my heart, lost all respect for him and don't give a fuck what happens to him good or bad.
Point being, he never categorically stated that he wouldnt leave...
Still seems lost on a few people, that one...
Point being, he never categorically stated that he wouldnt leave...
Still seems lost on a few people, that one...
for two years he said that he was going to sign the contract, that to me is telling people he would stay.
he had his chance to play for Liverpool, he was even lucky enough to be given a second chance, now he's at Newcastle. i hope he's happy with himself :handshake:
Red_Polo
12-04-07, 11:52 AM
Point being, he never categorically stated that he wouldnt leave...
Still seems lost on a few people, that one...
He intimated he would be signing it, constantly made out it was just a question of having a few more meetings and then it would be signed. The goalposts were moved by him all the fucking time. He said he'd never play for another English club. He fucking lied.
He fucking lied.
and now he's playing for Newcastle :haha:
Red_Polo
12-04-07, 12:02 PM
and now he's playing for Newcastle :haha:
On the other hand we're probably just being naive :crackoff:
and now he's playing for Newcastle :haha:
he aint exactly playing, if you know what i mean :D
Maestro
12-04-07, 12:14 PM
The expressions 'thats football' and 'get over it' come to mind...
Using clichés like that could easily be labelled 'petty and immature' - the phrase you yourself used a while ago.
Loyalty in football is the rarest of commodities in this day and age, sadly.
That may well be, but it does explain people's bitterness and resentment towards him, which you said at the start of the thread you didn't understand. Do you understand it now? Do you also accept that the case you gave of Ian Rush's transfer is not comparable?
He intimated he would be signing it, constantly made out it was just a question of having a few more meetings and then it would be signed. The goalposts were moved by him all the fucking time. He said he'd never play for another English club. He fucking lied.
:handshake:
Neil Young
12-04-07, 12:28 PM
He said he wouldn't leave on a free. He didn't.
I'd be really interested to see a quote from a credible source where he said he wouldn't be leaving.
The Kop (LFC v Barcodes) season 2005/6)
"What a waste of talent"
says it all really
He said he wouldn't leave on a free. He didn't.
I'd be really interested to see a quote from a credible source where he said he wouldn't be leaving.
we got 8 mill for him thats a mill more than we paid for bells. he fucked us aroun and we lost millions in the process...
we all remember the quotes where he constantly said that he would sign the new deal...
Neil Young
12-04-07, 12:56 PM
we got 8 mill for him thats a mill more than we paid for bells. he fucked us aroun and we lost millions in the process...
we all remember the quotes where he constantly said that he would sign the new deal...
Show me one where he unequivocally said he would sign a new deal that meant he wouldn't leave.
It was obvious what he was doing. If you couldn't see it then that's no reason to hold it against him now. If the board couldn't see he was leaving his options open then you should blame them for not selling a year earlier.
I understand people felt let down but I think there's no point being too emotional about all this.
Mumsafan
12-04-07, 12:57 PM
There's a prize for anyone who can tell me how many times this topic has been discussed on LFC fan sites. :D
Clue: It is somewhere over 2 million.
Neil Young
12-04-07, 12:58 PM
There's a prize for anyone who can tell me how many times this topic has been discussed on LFC fan sites. :D
Clue: It is somewhere over 2 million.
Is it about 8 million? That would be appropriate.
and a prize for which jackass keeps starting most of the threads?
I know that it's not much difference but he said that he was close to sign a new deal not that he would sign it.
We don't know what happened in the meetings between the Owen camp and our board when they discussed the contract. Maybe everything was sorted out, maybe it was still some details that they had not agreed, who knows?
Rafa decided to sell him so he could get the money he needed to sign Alonso and then a year later tried to sign Owen and wanted to sign him last summer but his foot and knee injuries ended that deal.
I don't think Rafa would sign a player that messed the club around in a way that some people say that he has done.
Until we know all the facts then our board and Owen is to blame for the way he left and no one is to blame when he signed for Newcastle IMO because no one knows 100% what happened that time and if he could have signed for us if he had turned down Newcastle.
It's up to Rafa and Owen if he signs for us again. I would be happy if he did that but the team comes first and if Rafa decides that another striker is better for the team then I would be even more happy because that would make LFC stronger than a LFC team with Owen would be.
and a prize for which jackass keeps starting most of the threads?
Who is that?
desertscouser
12-04-07, 01:07 PM
we got 8 mill for him thats a mill more than we paid for bells. he fucked us aroun and we lost millions in the process...
we all remember the quotes where he constantly said that he would sign the new deal...
Spot on Diego.
Owen led us a merry dance and unfortunately GH and Parry fell for it, which ended up costing us millions.
But in the end it's he who has suffered, hardly playing any games over the last 3 years while having to watch us lift the FA Cup as well as the Champion's League trophy.
desertscouser
12-04-07, 01:11 PM
I know that it's not much difference but he said that he was close to sign a new deal not that he would sign it.
We don't know what happened in the meetings between the Owen camp and our board when they discussed the contract. Maybe everything was sorted out, maybe it was still some details that they had not agreed, who knows?
Rafa decided to sell him so he could get the money he needed to sign Alonso and then a year later tried to sign Owen and wanted to sign him last summer but his foot and knee injuries ended that deal.
I don't think Rafa would sign a player that messed the club around in a way that some people say that he has done.
Until we know all the facts then our board and Owen is to blame for the way he left and no one is to blame when he signed for Newcastle IMO because no one knows 100% what happened that time and if he could have signed for us if he had turned down Newcastle.
It's up to Rafa and Owen if he signs for us again. I would be happy if he did that but the team comes first and if Rafa decides that another striker is better for the team then I would be even more happy because that would make LFC stronger than a LFC team with Owen would be.
AF, you're deluded when it comes to Owen. He shat on us, plain and simple and now he's getting his just deserts. No Champion's League medal and washed up at a joke club like Newcastle.
DeeGame
12-04-07, 01:11 PM
He is leaving Newcastle this summer :source:
desertscouser
12-04-07, 01:13 PM
He is leaving Newcastle this summer :source:
Really? Where's he going?
DeeGame
12-04-07, 01:15 PM
Really? Where's he going?
Dunno just know he has been told he will be sold this summer.
He is leaving Newcastle this summer :source:
Really? Where's he going?
To Wembley and play for England.
:handshake:
AF, you're deluded when it comes to Owen. He shat on us, plain and simple and now he's getting his just deserts. No Champion's League medal and washed up at a joke club like Newcastle.
I agree with you, not about the deluded thing :haha: but he got what he deserved. He should have signed a new deal then Rafa wouldn't have been forced to make a quick decision and we would have got more money if he had left.
:handshake:
point is i never want him near this club again, i would be pissed of if we wasted money on him. he had his chance and he blew it. of course i would support him in the shirt as i always do, but trying to respect him as well thats a whole different matter...
How would he have left in 4 months time?
If you're talking about July or August, 4 months later would've been November or December. The window is closed then.
If you're talking about January, 4 months later is May. The window is closed then.
I'm not altogether sure what you're on about really.
Strike that then, 4 months 4 days :rolleyes: Start of La Liga season til January.
You were making reference to Owen worrying about his situation resembling that of Morientes, but Owen was in a far more favourable position. His place in the England team was cemented, particularly with Sven as manager, he could have easily taken 4 months (4 days :bird: ) to wait to join Liverpool and I think the argument that he was concerned about being left to rot at Madrid is testament to how much of a shithouse he actually was.
Not that I could give a shit, the only person who has lost out is him.
Craig_H
12-04-07, 03:16 PM
:handshake:
We see things differently, never mind.
Craig_H
12-04-07, 03:16 PM
He said he wouldn't leave on a free. He didn't.
I'd be really interested to see a quote from a credible source where he said he wouldn't be leaving.
Exactly.
desertscouser
12-04-07, 03:42 PM
Dunno just know he has been told he will be sold this summer.
Sauce?
DeeGame
12-04-07, 04:08 PM
Sauce?
Newcastle shareholder
Newcastle shareholder
what flavour is he?
Maestro
12-04-07, 04:12 PM
what flavour is he?
It's a brown sauce - bland and pretty fatty :handshake:
Newcastle shareholder
Dunk?
Monkeywool
12-04-07, 11:50 PM
I miss St Mike
I couldn't give a shit about Michael Owen, quite frankly.
:handshake:
I miss St Mike
And he misses us,:haha: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha:
Monkeywool
13-04-07, 01:34 AM
And he misses us,:haha: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha:
:haha:
I wondered this before, and I have asked a few friends a fair few times but none of us can come up with a good answer. Who ever has left Liverpool after establishing themselves and gone on to have a great career, establishing themselves with a great club and winning loads.
McManaman is what my friend argues, but I don't agree, he was not really a regular at Madrid, so he didn't establish himself, and he didn't get a renewed contract.
Can't think of anyone who has left us and gone on to greater things, Owen should have known this....
Ron_Mexico
13-04-07, 03:26 AM
McManaman is what my friend argues, but I don't agree, he was not really a regular at Madrid, so he didn't establish himself, and he didn't get a renewed contract.
sorry but that's wrong, macca was a key part of the first team in his first season or so at madrid. he was a casualty of the galactico policy after that. nothing to do with ability, all to do with marketing. makelele was another victim. two chamions league medals, and a couple la liga titles- i think that is pretty successful
wildman
13-04-07, 07:59 AM
Owen would've seen this. So the notion that Madrid would've backed down, if Owen had stamped his feet, is hardly what i'd call solid.[/QUOTE]
Player power always wins in the end
Craig_H
13-04-07, 08:32 AM
Player power always wins in the end
Like it did for Morientes?
marcus50bucks
13-04-07, 08:43 AM
Exactly.
What do you mean exactly? Hand on heart do you really believe Owen didn't mislead the fans? Ok, he didn't categorically say he would sign a new contract but he was clearly intimating this would be the case.
How many times did we all see Owen on sky news stating contract talks were going well, even to the point where he confirmed he is as close as ever to signing a new contract? For me as a liverpool fan, I took that as a clear indication he wanted to stay. However behind closed doors, I firmly believe Owen was keeping his options open. I also believe he was shifting the goalposts.
DJS, I really cannot understand how you amongst others can defend the way Owen treated us. :handshake:
marcus50bucks
13-04-07, 08:45 AM
Exactly.
What do you mean exactly? Hand on heart do you really believe Owen didn't mislead the fans? Ok, he didn't categorically say he would sign a new contract but he was clearly intimating this would be the case.
How many times did we all see Owen on sky news stating contract talks were going well, even to the point where he confirmed he is as close as ever to signing a new contract? For me as a liverpool fan, I took that as a clear indication he wanted to stay. However behind closed doors I firmly believe Owen was keeping his options open. I also believe he was shifting the goal posts.
DJS, I really cannot undertsand how you amongst others can defend the way Owen treated us. :handshake:
I don't defend the way he left us but I would welcome him back because it would be on Rafas terms if he comes back and that he believes that Owen would make the team better.
marcus50bucks
13-04-07, 08:52 AM
I don't defend the way he left us but I would welcome him back because it would be on Rafas terms if he comes back and that he believes that Owen would make the team better.
AFII, we have been through this so many times on koptalk, you then continue it on this site. What's the point? Owen is not and imo will never get another chance to return to Liverpool. :handshake:
Craig_H
13-04-07, 08:59 AM
What do you mean exactly? Hand on heart do you really believe Owen didn't mislead the fans? Ok, he didn't categorically say he would sign a new contract but he was clearly intimating this would be the case.
How many times did we all see Owen on sky news stating contract talks were going well, even to the point where he confirmed he is as close as ever to signing a new contract? For me as a liverpool fan, I took that as a clear indication he wanted to stay. However behind closed doors I firmly believe Owen was keeping his options open. I also believe he was shifting the goal posts.
DJS, I really cannot undertsand how you amongst others can defend the way Owen treated us. :handshake:
He 'treated' us just like footballers treat most things. He said what he said, either because it was true at the time and circumstances changed, or because he wanted to be misleading. I dont know for sure which it was.
But the point is, that happens in football, and i can accept that. It was 3 years ago and i'm well over it. I dont hold any kind of grudge or anything.
As for the prospect of him coming back, i dont think about things like that with emotions. Business is business and if Owen returning to LFC is best for the club, then i'd want it to happen. We're not doing him any favours, he'd be back to score goals for US, and he would do.
Craig_H
13-04-07, 09:00 AM
AFII, we have been through this so many times on koptalk, you then continue it on this site. What's the point? Owen is not and imo will never get another chance to return to Liverpool. :handshake:
As you say though, that's in your opinion. You may be right or not.
But it's discuss-able surely?
marcus50bucks
13-04-07, 09:07 AM
As you say though, that's in your opinion. You may be right or not.
But it's discuss-able surely?
How many times are you going to discuss the same topic? He is not even a liverpool player anymore. It's been done to death yet people love to start these threads. I haven't commented on an Owen thread for a while now but just wanted to make a couple of points. :handshake:
How many times are you going to discuss the same topic? He is not even a liverpool player anymore. It's been done to death yet people love to these threads. I haven't commented on an Owen thread for a while now but just wanted to make a couple of points. :handshake:
And excellent points they were :handshake:
marcus50bucks
13-04-07, 09:10 AM
And excellent points they were :handshake:
:handshake:
Neil Young
13-04-07, 09:11 AM
What do you mean exactly? Hand on heart do you really believe Owen didn't mislead the fans? Ok, he didn't categorically say he would sign a new contract but he was clearly intimating this would be the case.
How many times did we all see Owen on sky news stating contract talks were going well, even to the point where he confirmed he is as close as ever to signing a new contract? For me as a liverpool fan, I took that as a clear indication he wanted to stay. However behind closed doors I firmly believe Owen was keeping his options open. I also believe he was shifting the goal posts.
DJS, I really cannot undertsand how you amongst others can defend the way Owen treated us. :handshake:
As one of those you might be referring to, let me answer that. The comment I've highlighted is where the problem is. As a Liverpool fan it was obvious to me at the time that Owen was keeping his options open and he wasn't necessarily going to stay. If I may say so, your desire for him stay made you interpret his words optimistically. Them when it didn't turn out as you wanted, you naturally felt he'd let you down.
He never lied. If he misled people it's because they wanted themselves to be misled. He's a professional. If he had signed a longer contract then it's perfectly possible Madrid wouldn't have signed him or at least the terms would have been less generous for him. Why should he go out of his way to earn less money or constrain his career just so the multimillion pound business that is Liverpool FC could get more money for him? As it is the club made a profit on him anyway.
If you could negotiate a lower price when buying a replica shirt from the club shop would you do it? If so there is no moral difference between that and what Owen did.
I can't believe this thread is still going. I haven't read it all, but I bet it is just the same arguments by the same people over and over again.
Maestro
13-04-07, 09:15 AM
Bump
tomasjj
13-04-07, 09:17 AM
Football is all about emotion, even if the business element is strong.
:handshake:
marcus50bucks
13-04-07, 09:19 AM
He 'treated' us just like footballers treat most things. He said what he said, either because it was true at the time and circumstances changed, or because he wanted to be misleading. I dont know for sure which it was.
But the point is, that happens in football, and i can accept that. It was 3 years ago and i'm well over it. I dont hold any kind of grudge or anything.
As for the prospect of him coming back, i dont think about things like that with emotions. Business is business and if Owen returning to LFC is best for the club, then i'd want it to happen. We're not doing him any favours, he'd be back to score goals for US, and he would do.
So you are basically saying no blame goes to Owen at all for the way he left us? For me both Owen and the board have to take some responsibiliy for the way this contract saga was handled.
Anyway each to their own, I am not going to force you to admit Owen has to take some blame. If you don't see, you don't see it. Each to their own. :handshake:
Maestro
13-04-07, 09:19 AM
Football is all about emotion, even if the business element is strong.
:handshake:
If you play around with the word order there, we could have a yoda saying:
"Football about emotion it is, even if business element strong it be"
http://completerunning.com/wp-content/uploads/2006/11/yoda.gif
:respect:
Monkeywool
13-04-07, 09:21 AM
sorry but that's wrong, macca was a key part of the first team in his first season or so at madrid. he was a casualty of the galactico policy after that. nothing to do with ability, all to do with marketing. makelele was another victim. two chamions league medals, and a couple la liga titles- i think that is pretty successful
Hmmmm but only a season or two then being frozen out and being flogged to city? Don't know if that is a glittering career, sure he won medals in the two years he played, then he was discarded
Monkeywool
13-04-07, 09:25 AM
So you are basically saying no blame goes to Owen at all for the way he left us? For me both Owen and the board have to take some responsibiliy for the way this contract saga was handled.
Anyway each to their own, I am not going to force you to admit Owen has to take some blame. If you don't see, you don't see it. Each to their own. :handshake:
Thing is he never lied, I never heard him once say he was staying and he could have been signing a contract the day after Madrid's bid for all you know. After the board screwed up with McManaman I don't think they wanted to make the same mistake, especially as Benitez wanted funds for Alonso so they took it straight away just in case the contract wouldn't get signed. I think Owen was genuinely gutted he left.
marcus50bucks
13-04-07, 09:27 AM
Thing is he never lied, I never heard him once say he was staying and he could have been signing a contract the day after Madrid's bid for all you know. After the board screwed up with McManaman I don't think they wanted to make the same mistake, especially as Benitez wanted funds for Alonso so they took it straight away just in case the contract wouldn't get signed. I think Owen was genuinely gutted he left.
:whatever:
Get yourself off to work fella. Remember to book those days off I told you about. :handshake:
Neil Young
13-04-07, 09:28 AM
Football is all about emotion, even if the business element is strong.
:handshake:
Is that a Hicks/Gillett quote?
Monkeywool
13-04-07, 09:29 AM
:whatever:
Get yourself off to work fella. Remember to book those days off I told you about. :handshake:
The joys of a friday...
tomasjj
13-04-07, 09:30 AM
Is that a Hicks/Gillett quote?
Maybe...
They have a good PR advisor you know:source:
Neil Young
13-04-07, 09:30 AM
Maybe...
They have a good PR advisor you know:source:
Who?
tomasjj
13-04-07, 09:35 AM
:sigh:
Have another coffee, Neil.
Neil Young
13-04-07, 09:36 AM
:sigh:
Have another coffee, Neil.
I haven't had one yet. What is going way over my head?
Neil Young
13-04-07, 09:55 AM
OK, tomas, I've had a coffee now. I really don't understand. Do I need to be concerned?
tomasjj
13-04-07, 10:02 AM
Only if you are over 45.
:shakyshakey:
Neil Young
13-04-07, 10:03 AM
Only if you are over 45.
:shakyshakey:
I don't remember. Am I?
:crackoff:
Maestro
13-04-07, 10:06 AM
Confusion affecting Neil it is.
http://completerunning.com/wp-conten...06/11/yoda.gif
Neil Young
13-04-07, 10:17 AM
Not helped by your Yoda impressions it is.
If you play around with the word order there, we could have a yoda saying:
"Football about emotion it is, even if business element strong it be"
http://completerunning.com/wp-content/uploads/2006/11/yoda.gif
:respect:
:haha:
Craig_H
13-04-07, 10:54 AM
How many times are you going to discuss the same topic? He is not even a liverpool player anymore. It's been done to death yet people love to start these threads. I haven't commented on an Owen thread for a while now but just wanted to make a couple of points. :handshake:
I can understand that people may be bored with the topic, but it always baffles me that people cant just ignore these topics if they're bored by them, and just let others who ARE wanting to discuss, do so...
Thing is he never lied, I never heard him once say he was staying and he could have been signing a contract the day after Madrid's bid for all you know. After the board screwed up with McManaman I don't think they wanted to make the same mistake, especially as Benitez wanted funds for Alonso so they took it straight away just in case the contract wouldn't get signed. I think Owen was genuinely gutted he left.
Bullshit... he lead us on for two years, contract was always around the corner, it's wasn't untill the his last season that i figured out he was playing games, but it started before that. only a few meetings away, no problem with the contract, don't worry. thats just lying in my books, i won't have this technical bullshit about he never said he wasn't going to leave. he jerked us around, fucked us about, and people still want him back. well not me not ever...
sorry but that's wrong, macca was a key part of the first team in his first season or so at madrid. he was a casualty of the galactico policy after that. nothing to do with ability, all to do with marketing. makelele was another victim. two chamions league medals, and a couple la liga titles- i think that is pretty successful
makalele was hardly a victim. one of the most essential members of the squad played almost every game. and if it hadn't been for chelski promising him millions he probably would have been happy on the salary he was on...
Red_Polo
13-04-07, 11:05 AM
He never lied. If he misled people it's because they wanted themselves to be misled.
Deliberately misleading people IS lying though, and that's what he did.
makalele was hardly a victim. one of the most essential members of the squad played almost every game. and if it hadn't been for chelski promising him millions he probably would have been happy on the salary he was on...
He wasn't selling enough shirts so he didn't get a good enough new deal.
It had nothing to do with Chelsea. If Real had offered him a good deal then he would have stayed.
:handshake:
marcus50bucks
13-04-07, 11:12 AM
I can understand that people may be bored with the topic, but it always baffles me that people cant just ignore these topics if they're bored by them, and just let others who ARE wanting to discuss, do so...
Remove the word "people" and input "Marcus50bucks". :rolleyes: :handshake:
He wasn't selling enough shirts so he didn't get a good enough new deal.
It had nothing to do with Chelsea. If Real had offered him a good deal then he would have stayed.
:handshake:
if chelsea hadn't gone after him he never would have left
It was actually all his agents fault for going away on a 6 month holiday at a bad time.:eyebrow:
He wasn't selling enough shirts so he didn't get a good enough new deal.
It had nothing to do with Chelsea. If Real had offered him a good deal then he would have stayed.
:handshake:
if chelsea hadn't gone after him he never would have left
Real offered him £30k/week. That is a shit deal if you compere it to the other star players at Real. He is or was the best holding midfielder in the world so I can understand that he was :rant: and left Real.
He would have left for another club than Chelsea if they hadn't been interested IMO. He was fed up and wanted out from Real.
It was actually all his agents fault for going away on a 6 month holiday at a bad time.:eyebrow:
http://www.maisoneo.com/images/products/sagem/phonefax39tds_b.jpg
Real offered him £30k/week. That is a shit deal if you compere it to the other star players at Real. He is or was the best holding midfielder in the world so I can understand that he was :rant: and left Real.
He would have left for another club than Chelsea if they hadn't been interested IMO. He was fed up and wanted out from Real.
thought he was offered 60 whilst the others were offered 100
Neil Young
13-04-07, 12:04 PM
Deliberately misleading people IS lying though, and that's what he did.
How come I saw through it? I really can't help thinking that people saw what they wanted in what he said. He didn't mislead people - he said he wouldn't leave on a free and he didn't, he said there was no problem with the contract and there wasn't, he said he wouldn't go to another English club and he went to a Spanish one. If you read that as meaning he would stay at Liverpool you misled yourself.
There is a difference between lying and not telling the whole truth.
Maestro
13-04-07, 01:50 PM
How come I saw through it?
Maybe the force with you stong it is?
http://completerunning.com/wp-conten...06/11/yoda.gif
http://www.maisoneo.com/images/products/sagem/phonefax39tds_b.jpg
Bloody hell, with an agent like that he was screwed from the start.
Red_Polo
13-04-07, 04:13 PM
How come I saw through it? I really can't help thinking that people saw what they wanted in what he said. He didn't mislead people - he said he wouldn't leave on a free and he didn't, he said there was no problem with the contract and there wasn't, he said he wouldn't go to another English club and he went to a Spanish one. If you read that as meaning he would stay at Liverpool you misled yourself.
There is a difference between lying and not telling the whole truth.
But whether or not someone sees through it is irrelevant to whether they are lying or not. Saying people misled themselves sounds a little like people banning themselves. :D
Lying might not be black and white, some lies are obviously worse than others. But saying something not because you know it to be true but because you know it will mislead people in a way that suits your personal interests is quite obviously lying, to me. Not only were his statements lies, but they were lies which he knew went against the club's best interests. If this was about a politician misleading people in a similar way I suspect you might feel differently.
Ron_Mexico
13-04-07, 04:29 PM
Hmmmm but only a season or two then being frozen out and being flogged to city? Don't know if that is a glittering career, sure he won medals in the two years he played, then he was discarded
you clearly didn't pay any attention to my post. he was frozen out along with other top players like makelele due to the new galactico policy. while he was in the team he was brilliant. as i said, 4 major honors in 4 odd years at the club, is not bad at all. the basis of your argument was that no liverpool player has left and gone on to win anything. i get the feeling you wont agree anyway, so i'm not going to waste anymore time on this
Monkeywool
13-04-07, 06:39 PM
Wasn't an argument, more a musing, about who has had a good career after they left. McManaman won some trophies in the small time he played, but he was supposed to be in the prime of his career, instead he was playing second fiddle to Figo....
Neil Young
13-04-07, 07:42 PM
But whether or not someone sees through it is irrelevant to whether they are lying or not. Saying people misled themselves sounds a little like people banning themselves. :D
:haha:
In a way. Of course I phrased it a little provocatively but it wasn't a lie. I repeat, for the thrid time on this thread, show me a statement he made which completely conflicted with what happened when he left for Real Madrid.
Until someone can dig it up then I think you're relying on your memories of what you think happened and how you understood what he said.
But whether or not someone sees through it is irrelevant to whether they are lying or not. Saying people misled themselves sounds a little like people banning themselves. :D
Lying might not be black and white, some lies are obviously worse than others. But saying something not because you know it to be true but because you know it will mislead people in a way that suits your personal interests is quite obviously lying, to me. Not only were his statements lies, but they were lies which he knew went against the club's best interests. If this was about a politician misleading people in a similar way I suspect you might feel differently.
Actually I get a lot more irate about politicians who lie (e.g. the war against Iraq) than politicians who don't tell the whole truth. In politics you know the big sin is getting caught lying - it is the one thing they are not supposed to do.
The phrase "personal interests" is important - a politician is supposed to be a representative of the people, Michael Owen is really only beholden to himself. As fans we might wish that to be different but we're not professionals, we're enthusiasts. We're all relieved that Rafa is a professional. If sound, cold, calculated career management didn't come into his thinking he'd probably be off in the summer to - oh the irony - Real Madrid.
We don't seem to mind when Liverpool is the beneficiary. Funny that.
animal magic
13-04-07, 07:49 PM
people he has gone let it go :rolleyes:
Ron_Mexico
13-04-07, 07:51 PM
Wasn't an argument, more a musing, about who has had a good career after they left. McManaman won some trophies in the small time he played, but he was supposed to be in the prime of his career, instead he was playing second fiddle to Figo....
but who wouldn't be playing second fiddle to Figo considering the circumstances...Figo prized away from Barca, one of the best players in the world at the time, of course he was going to get a game ahead of Macca
lfc4ever
13-04-07, 08:20 PM
people he has gone let it go :rolleyes:
He has?? Where to? :source: <spies>
Red_Polo
13-04-07, 08:37 PM
show me a statement he made which completely conflicted with what happened when he left for Real Madrid.
Until someone can dig it up then I think you're relying on your memories of what you think happened and how you understood what he said.
The whole crux of my argument though, is that he doesn't have to have said 'I will sign a new contract' for him to have lied. Deliberately misleading and deceiving people is lying, and that's what he did over the course of a couple of years.
First he wanted to wait until his SFX contract ran out so a different agent/agency could handle negotiations, then he signed with them again anyway. His agent went on holiday, he wanted to know who the new manager was, he wanted to make sure Gerrard didn't leave.....for every reason not to sign that went away, he came up with another reason. The truth was he didn't think the club was heading in the right direction and he thought he was better off somewhere else, he just wouldn't admit it - not to us, and perhaps not to himself, up to the point where Rafa simply had to tell him to go. But it was ok, he told the fans, he would never be able to handle playing for another English club...
The phrase "personal interests" is important - a politician is supposed to be a representative of the people, Michael Owen is really only beholden to himself. As fans we might wish that to be different but we're not professionals, we're enthusiasts. We're all relieved that Rafa is a professional. If sound, cold, calculated career management didn't come into his thinking he'd probably be off in the summer to - oh the irony - Real Madrid.
We don't seem to mind when Liverpool is the beneficiary. Funny that.
None of that suggests that he didn't lie to the club and the fans though does it? He did. How he's judged for it is another matter altogether.
Apologies for the horrendous colour :haha:
Dalglish
13-04-07, 09:41 PM
4 pages for a Newcastle player? I look forward to the Scott Parker thread
lfc4ever
13-04-07, 10:44 PM
Ambition with the barcodes, classy, not everyone with ambition goes there so I applaud him for that, yup, ambitious on a hefty earner sweetener always wins it for me too <checks England position is safe (winks)>, yeh, ok, let's do it.
Dalglish
13-04-07, 10:46 PM
Edited.
Why so AF? It was an impassioned post
:handshake: 4 pages for a Newcastle player? I look forward to the Scott Parker thread
You what???Damien Duff is next for an honourary Thread.:rash: :handshake:
tomasjj
14-04-07, 12:43 AM
Owen = ****
:shakey:
Pleasqw close this thread.
:D
Neil Young
14-04-07, 08:29 AM
Apologies for the horrendous colour :haha:
I agree he could have been more open. I still think that's different from lying.
I really don't think he owed the club anything more - he's effectively a business and so (mainly) is the club. Of course we don't see it that way but when it comes to contract negotiations that's how most would play it.
This dodgy colour thing could catch on. :D
Why so AF? It was an impassioned post
Because I'm tired discussing him and that post would have been discussed :haha:
It was a good post :)
The main points for those who missed it.
I think most of us are :rant: of Owen because they know that he is a world class player, at least he was before his injuries, and knows that we would not have a striker problem if he had stayed.
Owen left because the club was going in the wrong direction and his ambition was to become the best player in the world and you can't be that in a club with more or less no money and a manager like Houllier.
No one could know how a new spanish manager would do. It almost ended in disaster but ended in #5.
Gerrard would have left IMO if we had not won #5 because he must think about his career first and it would have been the wrong decision to stay in a club going in the wrong direction, UEFA Cup football and no money. Without #5 we would have been skint.
Rafa would leave if the club can't match his ambition, that's the same reason as Owen.
Carra is Carra and he would stay even if we played conference football but the rest of the squad would leave if the club doesn't match their ambition IMO.
A career is only 10-15 years so a player will have to think about himself first. A four or five year deal is a very big part of a career.
If you don't love the club with your whole heart would you then leave if the most famous club want you?
It's all about ambition.
If we want to keep and sign the best players then we must match their ambition.
Eto'o and Villa would never be interested to join us if didn't play in the CL every season. LFC is a big and famous club but the best players will not sign for us because of our history, they will sign for us if we match their ambition.
Roeder will leave decision to Owen
Newcastle manager Glenn Roeder has promised to let Michael Owen decide when the time is right for him to return from his knee injury.
Roeder watched the 27-year-old England international score in a behind-closed-doors friendly against Gretna on Tuesday after 10 months out recovering from a ruptured anterior cruciate ligament.
However, Roeder will not include either Owen or fellow striker Shola Ameobi, who scored in the same game following his return from hip surgery, in his squad for Saturday's trip to Portsmouth.
Owen had targeted next Sunday's visit of champions Chelsea to St James' Park for his comeback, but Roeder has insisted he will not dictate the timing, leaving that decision to the man who knows best.
He said: "Michael is a very sensible, serious person who would not rush himself back.
"If I asked him to play and he felt he was not ready, he would tell me.
"Michael will know when he is ready to play, like Shola. Whether that is this season or not, we will have to wait and see.
"But the practice game this week was a big, big step forward because the next morning both were feeling really fine with no problems."
Owen collapsed seconds into England's World Cup finals clash with Sweden in June, robbing both his country and his club of their most potent weapon.
Newcastle have been engaged since in a battle for compensation for the loss of their £17million frontman.
However, the former Real Madrid star is delighted to have taken a major stride towards resuming his career.
He said: "I felt really sharp, but to be honest, I always felt I would be.
"It was great to be out there and good to score, although I suppose it was not what people would call a typical Michael Owen goal.
"I have been though a lot with Shola Ameobi in recent months and it was super to see him score as well on Tuesday.
"Now I cannot wait to start scoring goals again for Newcastle."
CLICKY - Teamtalk (http://www.teamtalk.com/football/story/0,16368,1780_2059545,00.html)
mikegbelieve
14-04-07, 02:25 PM
yes i have returned :)
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