It's affecting us. Honest

[alunevans]

dammed if you do dammed if you dont ... if I was working in an organisation like that it would effect me, to have a go at him for saying so is bloody ridiculous

i'm not having a go at him to be fair. i'm saying it'd be more galvanising to have the attitude of "lets take responsibility and on our heads be it".

i really think that getting hung up on the idea that "all this is harming our performance as players" will simply let the kind of player who would rather look for excuses off the hook.

i also feel that whether in football or anything else, you're best putting all your energies into the stuff you can have an influence on. for a professional footballer thats the stuff on the pitch.

i'd rather hear that message. i think psychologically the message that our poor results are due to the off the pitch stuff won't help us get results in our next few games.

i'm sure you can see where i'm coming from.

if i was a senior liverpool player i'd be doing a battle cry now for future games and forcing my team mates to shoulder responsibility rather than giving them excuses to shirk it.

if psychology is a factor in sport then this kind of thing is not unimportant.

[bazza76]

bloody hell i read that yesterday. lazy get

I know mate, but to be honest, I have nothing else to add.

[alunevans]

I know mate, but to be honest, I have nothing else to add.

i know but i couldn't resist

[bazza76]

Except this.
Saying that, I still think Stevie should not be openly admitting to the rest of the dressing room that the speculation is effecting the team performances. He is almost giving the team an excuse for future losses. I am in no way saying that the team will go out to loose or anything like it. But I do think psychologically the players will not be as prepared 100% as they should be if they can use it as an excuse, which has been rubber stamped by their captain. Be it true or not.
You can count on one thing, Rafa will not have been happy about Stevie saying what he did, Rafa is a very psychological manager, and his motivational techniques are amongst the most advanced in football, he is not from the Fergie school of hairdrying his players.

[Nicey]

i'm not having a go at him to be fair. i'm saying it'd be more galvanising to have the attitude of "lets take responsibility and on our heads be it".

i really think that getting hung up on the idea that "all this is harming our performance as players" will simply let the kind of player who would rather look for excuses off the hook.

i also feel that whether in football or anything else, you're best putting all your energies into the stuff you can have an influence on. for a professional footballer thats the stuff on the pitch.

i'd rather hear that message. i think psychologically the message that our poor results are due to the off the pitch stuff won't help us get results in our next few games.

i'm sure you can see where i'm coming from.

if i was a senior liverpool player i'd be doing a battle cry now for future games and forcing my team mates to shoulder responsibility rather than giving them excuses to shirk it.

if psychology is a factor in sport then this kind of thing is not unimportant.

Fair enough but I feel you would be only papering over the cracks. There are major major issues at our club right now and no amount of we are in this together circle up the wagons is going to makes things any better. I do understand what you are saying though

[alunevans]

Fair enough but I feel you would be only papering over the cracks. There are major major issues at our club right now and no amount of we are in this together circle up the wagons is going to makes things any better. I do understand what you are saying though

It wouldn't alter a thing that is outside the players' influence I agree, and it doesn't alter the fact that Rafa's job is twice as hard while this is going on, and it doesn't alter the fact that the current owners really have to move on as a prerequisite to this club ever being healthy again.

So I agree with all that. It'll be even worse though if a significant enough minority of the players (even if subconsciously) feel they are 'allowed' poor performances because it can be blamed on all of that.

Sounds like we're not too far distant to be honest

[alunevans]

Except this.
Saying that, I still think Stevie should not be openly admitting to the rest of the dressing room that the speculation is effecting the team performances. He is almost giving the team an excuse for future losses.

My point exactly. Psychologically it was giving everyone a pass to be off the boil. I know he wouldn't have meant it like that but I think the opposite message is pretty much essential or he could well be delivering a self fulfilling prophecy.

[Shanks65]

Crouch critical of Liverpool form

Liverpool striker Peter Crouch has criticised the club's form after they slipped even further behind in the title race.

The Reds are now 14 points behind Premier League leaders Manchester United after their 2-2 draw with Aston Villa on Monday evening.

He said: "It's not good enough and we've fallen a long way behind.

"We've got good enough talent in the dressing room and we should be doing better than the position we're in."

The club have been rocked in recent weeks with talk of a takeover by Dubai International Capital as well as doubts over their financial security under co-owners Tom Hicks and George Gillett.

But Crouch says that the players have to ignore rumours of the club's future and stick to playing football.

"It's nothing to do with the players," he said.

"We've just got to concentrate on the job on the pitch and we're still positive in the dressing room.

"First and foremost now we have to cement a Champions League spot for next year."

[bazza76]

Well in Crouchy

[Alan Key]

I haven't read the thread as i'm off to work in a second. But can i ask one question (Genuine - I'm rubbish with papers/the press and crap press releases):

Did Gerrard not say about 4 days ago that it wasn't affecting the players, why would it?

Then today done a whole u turn?

[Sangria]

Saying that, I still think Stevie should not be openly admitting to the rest of the dressing room that the speculation is effecting the team performances.

But he isn't admitting it to the dressing room, he said it in an interview. Presumably the dressing room have all been aware of this for some time and Stevie has come out and said it because there is no point in trying to cover up. Maybe he's spent the last few weeks reassuring all the other players that everything's going to be OK, and he thinks the point needs to be made that they are unsettled. As you would expect them to be- it always affects you if your manager is under threat or your workplace is going through a rocky patch. I don't know why some people expect footballers to react differently just because they get paid more than us.

He is almost giving the team an excuse for future losses.

Again, I don't see why the assumption is that if this is affecting the squad it is because they are lazy, rather than because they are worried. Lots of us have commented that Rafa looks stressed and unwell. He is their boss, they have a personal relationship with him and see him every day without the public face. As others have said, they are only human and they must be a tight-knit group- you'd hope so anyway. Seems to me they can't win- if they look unaffected we say they're money-grabbing *******s with no loyalty to the gaffer, and if they show the strain they are lazy, money-grabbing *******s looking for an excuse not to perform. I don't understand why some people assume that players care less than the fans, when their daily lives, family lives, friendships, everything are bound up in the club.

[redlancer]

I haven't read the thread as i'm off to work in a second. But can i ask one question (Genuine - I'm rubbish with papers/the press and crap press releases):

Did Gerrard not say about 4 days ago that it wasn't affecting the players, why would it?

Then today done a whole u turn?

that was Carra?

off course its going to effect the players - it could infact effect them in a good way - depends what the behind the scene is like.

If all the players are 100% behind Rafa then it could help in a good way?

But the subconcious will also allow this as an excuse to not give 100%

In our team how many players are battle hardend league winners? We've been off the pace for a while so subconciously have they conceeded the league and all the off field stuff just cements that thought?

A few of us will have worked for firms that have been taken over, had rummours etc. I take pride in work but when the rummours are going round you do take you foot off the gas, almost waiting for the new owners so your fresh.

Has anyone though some players might no want Rafa there? They may still give 100% in thier eye's but deep down it might be only 90% esp as we're out of the title race.

[alunevans]

Crouch critical of Liverpool form

Liverpool striker Peter Crouch has criticised the club's form after they slipped even further behind in the title race.

The Reds are now 14 points behind Premier League leaders Manchester United after their 2-2 draw with Aston Villa on Monday evening.

He said: "It's not good enough and we've fallen a long way behind.

"We've got good enough talent in the dressing room and we should be doing better than the position we're in."

The club have been rocked in recent weeks with talk of a takeover by Dubai International Capital as well as doubts over their financial security under co-owners Tom Hicks and George Gillett.

But Crouch says that the players have to ignore rumours of the club's future and stick to playing football.

"It's nothing to do with the players," he said.

"We've just got to concentrate on the job on the pitch and we're still positive in the dressing room.

"First and foremost now we have to cement a Champions League spot for next year."

That's more like it lad. Pity you don't get a game.

[alunevans]

Saying that, I still think Stevie should not be openly admitting to the rest of the dressing room that the speculation is effecting the team performances.

But he isn't admitting it to the dressing room, he said it in an interview. Presumably the dressing room have all been aware of this for some time and Stevie has come out and said it because there is no point in trying to cover up. Maybe he's spent the last few weeks reassuring all the other players that everything's going to be OK, and he thinks the point needs to be made that they are unsettled. As you would expect them to be- it always affects you if your manager is under threat or your workplace is going through a rocky patch. I don't know why some people expect footballers to react differently just because they get paid more than us.

He is almost giving the team an excuse for future losses.

Again, I don't see why the assumption is that if this is affecting the squad it is because they are lazy, rather than because they are worried. Lots of us have commented that Rafa looks stressed and unwell. He is their boss, they have a personal relationship with him and see him every day without the public face. As others have said, they are only human and they must be a tight-knit group- you'd hope so anyway. Seems to me they can't win- if they look unaffected we say they're money-grabbing *******s with no loyalty to the gaffer, and if they show the strain they are lazy, money-grabbing *******s looking for an excuse not to perform. I don't understand why some people assume that players care less than the fans, when their daily lives, family lives, friendships, everything are bound up in the club.

There is a third option. Show your loyalty on the pitch by helping the boss out by playing your hearts out in order to get him results. Villa was ok. But too many of the other games were too half hearted in my view. If I wanted to help out my gaffer as a player I'd run through a brick wall for him when he was in trouble.

[Bob]

Alun, you're way wide of the mark here. Look at how much we're talking about this e.g. that monster thread in this room. ****, there's literally an article in the press everyday. You think the players won't be talking about this as opposed to other things such as football/or just banter. It is abundantly clear morale is low and that affects the players training and performance. End of. When you're a company and there's talk from above it affects your working performance, whether you're conscious of it or not.

Have a word. Of course it has an impact.