Hicks Speaks - Sun 26.

[dww]

Look Speedy if it was a joke that was taken badly then fair enough but just apologise for any upset caused and then leave it.

Everyone else I think enough of this thread has been taken up with reference to the old one and if it continues I will delete the posts.

[Biff]

I've got a question on this that someone on here might be able to answer.

Surely a loan of this size would normally be taken out over the course of say...25 years? Why is this refinancing package being taken out for 18 months? There is absolutely no way we can afford to pay that back in that time. More to the point, having seen our finances the bank surely know this so why would they lend such a huge amount of money over such a short period?

This is a huge mess.

There is a very big difference between the risk factors for a commercial loan and a standard residential mortgage. I could try to explain it all but I can't be arsed....just accept it as fact....

[kurtangle01]

By the way....this thread is the best entertainment I've had all weekend....please keep it up!

So what happens in 18 months then? We refinance with even bigger loans?

[Alpha]

Where did I say I support Hicks, you have NO idea if I support him or not.

My position is simple people are running around talking a load of crap, it's affecting the club, we need this crap to die down so we can concentrate on playing and winning football games.

There's a bunch of hysterical naysayers on here spouting as facts stuff they do not know to be true (some facts not all). This is NOT helping us.

I didn't claim that you support Hicks.

But by attempting to gag his opposition, you might as well be. Nobody talks more crap than Hicks and unfortunately, as long as he continues to do so, a voice needs to be heard to challenge his PR.

We do need this crap to die down so we can concentrate on the football but we can't allow apathy to set it. That is exactly what he wants.

[Sarb]

In 18 months it's time to re-finance again then Moores and Parry will be gone. By that time the club will be loaded with more debt and SpeedyG will still be sticking up for the Yanks and telling us all to concentrate on the team and not what's going on in the Boardroom

...or at this rate he'll still be trying to act smart

[reddragon]

I didn't claim that you support Hicks.

But by attempting to gag his opposition, you might as well be. Nobody talks more crap than Hicks and unfortunately, as long as he continues to do so, a voice needs to be heard to challenge his PR.

We do need this crap to die down so we can concentrate on the football but we can't allow apathy to set it. That is exactly what he wants.

[Sarb]

I didn't claim that you support Hicks.

But by attempting to gag his opposition, you might as well be. Nobody talks more crap than Hicks and unfortunately, as long as he continues to do so, a voice needs to be heard to challenge his PR.

We do need this crap to die down so we can concentrate on the football but we can't allow apathy to set it. That is exactly what he wants.

[Biff]

So what happens in 18 months then? We refinance with even bigger loans?

depends.....but not beyond the realms of possibility

[kurtangle01]

depends.....but not beyond the realms of possibility

GREAT!!!!

[Danish_Pastry]

By the way - abt. the discussion of how the last 55 m£ were financed from personal letters from the two G&H - said by Nick Harris in The Independent (http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/f...-774334.html):

At the time of the takeover, Liverpool had debts of £60m, some of that relating to the takeover itself. Hicks' and Gillett's refinancing involves transferring that, plus the £185m of debt they used to buy Liverpool, into a new £245m bundle owed to the Royal Bank of Scotland and Wachovia Bank via their Kop investment vehicle.

On top of that, Liverpool will have £105m of new debt – guaranteed against its assets – to start work on the stadium, and for working capital. Total: £350m debt, and Liverpool in hock to a greater extent than ever. Parry can take credit for persuading the Americans to shovel a chunk of the liabilities into a subsidiary pot. They wanted all £350m directly on Liverpool's books.

But the reddest of herrings is that Hicks and Gillett are providing "owner cash, letters of credit and personal guarantees" against £225m of the £245m bundle. What does that actually mean? It means Hicks and Gillett are personally responsible for that cash, and will be keener than ever to skim any Liverpool profits to repay it. It does not mean they will stump up so much as a fiver of their hard-earned to buy any players or masonry.

Herein lies the risk, to the owners and the club. Liverpool are not cash cows on the scale of Manchester United or Arsenal. Their most profitable season was 2004-05, with pre-tax profits of £9.46m. The next year they lost £5m on a turnover of £119m. Interest payments alone on £350m of debt will be around £25m a year before capital repayments start. And that is before around £250m more is borrowed to pay for the new stadium, although that loan, in fairness, should fund itself via naming rights, sponsorship and ticket sales.

[Dhav]

Just listened and you are very right. I kind of expected it though - it is something that everyone thinks is a good thing. He is trying to get people back on side and I don't think there is anything wrong with that.

Having said that he should have been honest about the debt repayments. To be honest while emotive I think people would come round to it if it were proven that it made no great difference to our plans re. players etc.

I don't think the interview will have changed anyones mind on this subject (as this thread largely proves).

I'm still dubious but a fence sitter, most people think G&H are cunts. He has the right idea in the interview though - prove his worth in actions not words if in indeed he can.

Unlike everyone else I thought he sounded quite genuine about Rafa. Might just be that his pay off would be too big though

Using the stadium as a means of winning over the fans is an approach Gillett has used as well, it seems to be some kind of concerted strategy.

I don't see how the debt repayments won't affect transfer spending budgets further down the line, especially as they seem to be taking out bigger loans to cover short-term spending plans. Perhaps this is why he's avoiding the question.

I also think Rafa's pay-off is a major headache for them. The working relationship between Rafa and the yanks has broken down and is probably irreparable. i think ever since they have been trying to move him towards the edge of the cliff and hoped that he would jump. Game of brinkmanship me thinks. In spite of what he says, I am sure nothing has changed and they still want him gone.

BTW, G & H are cunts

[Biff]

GREAT!!!!

Most commercial lending is done on the basis of what returns are expected for the term of the loan agreement itself. They will invariably consititute current earnings from businesses already owned but also the potential earnings to be generated from the business venture for which Hicks/Gillett require finance.

The banks would need to be thoroughly convinced (particularly in todays unstable financial climate) that the club will generate sufficient income to service the debt AND that in the event that this cannot be done there are sufficient assets in place to recover their capital outlay....

Essentially....in 18mths time we're ****ed!

[kurtangle01]

Most commercial lending is done on the basis of what returns are expected for the term of the loan agreement itself. They will invariably consititute current earnings from businesses already owned but also the potential earnings to be generated from the business venture for which Hicks/Gillett require finance.

The banks would need to be thoroughly convinced (particularly in todays unstable financial climate) that the club will generate sufficient income to service the debt AND that in the event that this cannot be done there are sufficient assets in place to recover their capital outlay....
Essentially....in 18mths time we're ****ed!

So in other words what you're saying is that should we be unable to pay the debt off in 18 months time, which there's no way we could, the banks would look to sell off the sufficient assets, I.E. players, to get their money?

If that's the case then this deal is just sheer lunacy. Absolute madness.

[El Jefecito]

I didn't claim that you support Hicks.

But by attempting to gag his opposition, you might as well be. Nobody talks more crap than Hicks and unfortunately, as long as he continues to do so, a voice needs to be heard to challenge his PR.

We do need this crap to die down so we can concentrate on the football but we can't allow apathy to set it. That is exactly what he wants.

Hmmmm, I attempted to gag no-one, others are trying to gag me. Insulting me etc etc.

I've just asked people to justify what they are stating as facts.

You have a problem with that?

[tomasjj]

Hmmmm, I attempted to gag no-one, others are trying to gag me. Insulting me etc etc.

I've just asked people to justify what they are stating as facts.

You have a problem with that?

Facts are quite hard to come by in these matters, mate.
We will just have to assume a lot, based on what we have seen the owners do and say so far.