AFC Liverpool Grassroots - Initial Proposal

[Red_hot]

Until all the fans make a stand together nothing will change. While we all still keep paying for tickets/sky/setanta then it will carry on. **** as it is.

[alunevans]

Coops,

Leave him to it mate. If that's what he think does his opinion even matter. Thanks for the support though.

I'm sick of arguing with people on here now who will accept anything they do to us, and when anyone tries to do something that will try to ensure we still have a game of football that has some soul then they insult them.

They're irrelevant now. Just as the Premier League competition will be in 2010.

As for Manc clone retards, I have nothing but admiration for the people at FC United. To create an entire football club from nothing and make it work, and get 5,000 people in every week to watch them is an astonishing achievement.

They'll be in the football league soon in my view. They have control of their club. They have partisan reasons for supporting them. And they get a football that is honest and true.

I think we're capable of doing the same, whether or not we continue supporting the original LFC or not (though bear in mind many of us can't afford to!)

[The Glove]

Surely it's better to support an existing local club?

I already do

Unless you are suggesting Everton?

[alunevans]

Until all the fans make a stand together nothing will change. While we all still keep paying for tickets/sky/setanta then it will carry on. **** as it is.

That may be true, but what if a huge proportion of us want the option of an additional pro LFC club that is run by us and which has elements of the game that we grew up with and loved. When there was a link between the club and the fans. When the football mattered rather than just money.

Top flight football does not meet this need anymore. So even if you keep drinking from that particular chalice, there's still a huge swathe of people who would have certain emotional buttons pressed by this.

Even if everyone keeps with their season tickets and their Sky, this is a grassroots club that can coexist and do well. It would provide a place for Liverpool supporters like my nephews to feel involved in the game again. It would provide a gathering place for LFC fans of like mind. And it would be a place where football was pure and run and owned by the people who support it.

I NEED that, but I won't find it at LFC, and I won't find it at Marine or South Liverpool either because I have no reason to support them. The only team I'd support is AFC Liverpool Grassroots and I'd want us to turn them into a football league club in my lifetime.

I know that other people need these emotional buttons pressing too. After all, isn't that what its all about when it comes down to it?

[Rich]

Perhaps this isn't the best place to post this but as much as I admire Alun's passion and love for LFC and footy in general, I just don't agree with the idea of setting up another club called AFC Liverpool Grassroots (or whatever its final name would be)

Any new institution created WONT be LFC nor will it be affiliated with LFC - so surely the existing structure of football clubs on Merseyside needn't be altered to allow Scousers and people close by to pick another Liverpool-based team to follow - most non-league clubs are dying on their arses through lack of cash, why not put the money into one of these? It's local, it's Liverpool, and it's real football - exactly what you're after, surely?

[Shaggy]

Marine.

[Rich]

That may be true, but what if a huge proportion of us want the option of an additional pro LFC club that is run by us and which has elements of the game that we grew up with and loved. When there was a link between the club and the fans. When the football mattered rather than just money.

Top flight football does not meet this need anymore. So even if you keep drinking from that particular chalice, there's still a huge swathe of people who would have certain emotional buttons pressed by this.

Even if everyone keeps with their season tickets and their Sky, this is a grassroots club that can coexist and do well. It would provide a place for Liverpool supporters like my nephews to feel involved in the game again. It would provide a gathering place for LFC fans of like mind. And it would be a place where football was pure and run and owned by the people who support it.

I NEED that, but I won't find it at LFC, and I won't find it at Marine or South Liverpool either because I have no reason to support them. The only team I'd support is AFC Liverpool Grassroots and I'd want us to turn them into a football league club in my lifetime.

I know that other people need these emotional buttons pressing too. After all, isn't that what its all about when it comes down to it?

I'd love to know why you have no reason to support South Liverpool, yet would support AFC Liverpool Grassroots? I know logic and reason don't go hand in hand with passions and football, but I'm curious....

[PTP]

Coops,

Leave him to it mate. If that's what he think does his opinion even matter. Thanks for the support though.

I'm sick of arguing with people on here now who will accept anything they do to us, and when anyone tries to do something that will try to ensure we still have a game of football that has some soul then they insult them.

They're irrelevant now. Just as the Premier League competition will be in 2010.

As for Manc clone retards, I have nothing but admiration for the people at FC United. To create an entire football club from nothing and make it work, and get 5,000 people in every week to watch them is an astonishing achievement.

They'll be in the football league soon in my view. They have control of their club. They have partisan reasons for supporting them. And they get a football that is honest and true.

I think we're capable of doing the same, whether or not we continue supporting the original LFC or not (though bear in mind many of us can't afford to!)

i see where you are coming from - as much as we have a big rivalry for the mancs - as i said in the thread about overseas matches - top flight football as a sport is dying - i bet those involved in FC United have great pride in what they have achieved and great satisfaction to a be a part off. - As much as we all love/support our own clubs - at the end of the day it is football that brings it all together. If i didn't support liverpool i'd still be playing/watching/loving football cause ulitmately imo it is the greatest game in the world,

ages ages ago i went on a random pisstake rant and predicted the future of football in a thread on here - it was over a year ago and went largely unnoticed but with what is happening at the moment it keeps popping into my mind again - although i went ott and tongue in cheek with the rant, the basics of it are very relevant. I will try and find it, but basically it ended up that the premier league went world wide and fans rebeled by created a "fans premier league" consisteng of FC United AFC Liverpool etc etc

[PTP]

very good points caco

Alun - as everyone is debating it in here I will make this the debate on your proposal and see what we can do re a thread soley for people who are interested in gettung involved and have skills/advice/experience to offer

[alunevans]

Perhaps this isn't the best place to post this but as much as I admire Alun's passion and love for LFC and footy in general, I just don't agree with the idea of setting up another club called AFC Liverpool Grassroots (or whatever its final name would be)

Any new institution created WONT be LFC nor will it be affiliated with LFC - so surely the existing structure of football clubs on Merseyside needn't be altered to allow Scousers and people close by to pick another Liverpool-based team to follow - most non-league clubs are dying on their arses through lack of cash, why not put the money into one of these? It's local, it's Liverpool, and it's real football - exactly what you're after, surely?

I understand where you're coming from completely. But partisanship cannot be manufactured. I mean, I kinda like Rugby League when I'm sat there and it comes on telly and I've sod all else to do. And I suppose St Helens isn't that far away. But I'll never get INTO rugby league because when Wigan beat St Helens I'm not really arsed. One cannot manufacture partisanship.

If I had any partisan reason for supporting Marine or S Liverpool or Prescot Cables then I'd go there and all my buttons would be pressed, but I don't. And nor do many other people whose focus has always been LFC.

I'm pretty certain that the majority of people who support the new AFC Liverpool Grassroots would not be people who currently follow non league football. In that sense, it would breathe some life into the non league by adding 5,000 new followers of the league each week. I think that would help non league.

Besides, I don't believe that non league is where such a club would remain or be its natural home. I'd expect it to be a semi pro club with an agenda to get into the lower reaches of the football league. Or at the very least the higher reaches of the non league system. But who knows.

I understand your sentiments. I think they're compatible with mine. If I had the partisan support for Marine or whoever life would be easier because I wouldn't have to be asking people if they'd help me set up a new football club from scratch. But i don't and it can't be manufactured

[Rich]

Thinking about it - I reckon if you had a strong backing and great ideas and approached the owners of South Liverpool FC they'd be more than happy to discuss and implement changes.

Money still talks at that low level.

[Rich]

I understand where you're coming from completely. But partisanship cannot be manufactured. I mean, I kinda like Rugby League when I'm sat there and it comes on telly and I've sod all else to do. And I suppose St Helens isn't that far away. But I'll never get INTO rugby league because when Wigan beat St Helens I'm not really arsed. One cannot manufacture partisanship.

If I had any partisan reason for supporting Marine or S Liverpool or Prescot Cables then I'd go there and all my buttons would be pressed, but I don't. And nor do many other people whose focus has always been LFC.

I'm pretty certain that the majority of people who support the new AFC Liverpool Grassroots would not be people who currently follow non league football. In that sense, it would breathe some life into the non league by adding 5,000 new followers of the league each week. I think that would help non league.

Besides, I don't believe that non league is where such a club would remain or be its natural home. I'd expect it to be a semi pro club with an agenda to get into the lower reaches of the football league. Or at the very least the higher reaches of the non league system. But who knows.

I understand your sentiments. I think they're compatible with mine. If I had the partisan support for Marine or whoever life would be easier because I wouldn't have to be asking people if they'd help me set up a new football club from scratch. But i don't and it can't be manufactured

That is fair enough - and we'll get into circular arguments soon () so I'll leave it but in my eyes an AFC Liverpool Grassroots WOULDN'T be LFC, therefore if I can tranfer my passion from LFC to another footballing entity (citing passion, Liverpool-based, and grassroots as key motivators) I think these could/would be found at existing non-league clubs.

[alunevans]

I'd love to know why you have no reason to support South Liverpool, yet would support AFC Liverpool Grassroots? I know logic and reason don't go hand in hand with passions and football, but I'm curious....

Just I have no connection with them mate. Its the LFC link (and I know it'd only be a link) that would give me a sense of belonging and partisanship. That is, this is the grassroots team for and owned by Liverpool fans.

Marine is just some club. I'd love to be able to go and support them and care, but I wouldn't. I don't have any link to them at all. And you can't manufacture passion can you.

When FC United started up, Leigh RMI asked them to buy them out because Leigh were in problems etc. FC United thought it over and declined yet have friendlies with them pre season to generate cash for Leigh etc.

Maybe one of the current clubs would seek a partnership in the same way and then I'd have reason to support them, but I'm sure if I was an Evertonian Marine fan that'd be no different to what we're going through.

I think a separate club makes sense. If any of you have a partisan sense of support a local non league team already then I urge you to go more regularly as it will be good for your soul.

But what about the rest of us like me who don't have it and can't manufacture it? We need something we feel a sense of belonging to, and a grassroots LFC run by and for Liverpool fans is the only thing that I can think of that would do it for me.

[alunevans]

ages ages ago i went on a random pisstake rant and predicted the future of football in a thread on here - it was over a year ago and went largely unnoticed but with what is happening at the moment it keeps popping into my mind again - although i went ott and tongue in cheek with the rant, the basics of it are very relevant. I will try and find it, but basically it ended up that the premier league went world wide and fans rebeled by created a "fans premier league" consisteng of FC United AFC Liverpool etc etc

i think thats very plausible actually

[Rich]

Just I have no connection with them mate. Its the LFC link (and I know it'd only be a link) that would give me a sense of belonging and partisanship. That is, this is the grassroots team for and owned by Liverpool fans.

Marine is just some club. I'd love to be able to go and support them and care, but I wouldn't. I don't have any link to them at all. And you can't manufacture passion can you.

When FC United started up, Leigh RMI asked them to buy them out because Leigh were in problems etc. FC United thought it over and declined yet have friendlies with them pre season to generate cash for Leigh etc.

Maybe one of the current clubs would seek a partnership in the same way and then I'd have reason to support them, but I'm sure if I was an Evertonian Marine fan that'd be no different to what we're going through.

I think a separate club makes sense. If any of you have a partisan sense of support a local non league team already then I urge you to go more regularly as it will be good for your soul.

But what about the rest of us like me who don't have it and can't manufacture it? We need something we feel a sense of belonging to, and a grassroots LFC run by and for Liverpool fans is the only thing that I can think of that would do it for me.

Ok - no problem - I hope your idea gets off the ground.