Question for those who dont want rafa gone...

[Craig_H]

And I still agree The question still stands, for a wider audience than you and I, are you willing to accept those shortcomings if it will win us the EPL?

I think lots of people would say no and that's their right. I also think, however, that a fair portion of them would either forget their misgivings, or cast them aside, at the sight of Stevie holding up the Premier League trophy.

[Red Chilli]

Long thread......init?

[El Jefecito]

I think lots of people would say no and that's their right. I also think, however, that a fair portion of them would either forget their misgivings, or cast them aside, at the sight of Stevie holding up the Premier League trophy.

Well everyone else, That's the question would you support JM given the objections DJS has identified if he brought us he EPL?

I would.

BTW I believe that Rafa will bring us the EPL anyway

[Craig_H]

Well everyone else, That's the question would you support JM given the objections DJS has identified if he brought us he EPL?

I would.

BTW I believe that Rafa will bring us the EPL anyway

People wont believe me, because of this bizarre alleged 'agenda' but for me, that'd be the best outcome possible. My first choice thing i want, is for Rafa to turn everything around and win the title...and stay for many years, creating a dynasty. I want that more than anything else. And i wish i could believe it'll happen, i really do. But i just cant see it. I dont CHOOSE to not have belief in it, it's just how i feel and i cant help it.

[Red Chilli]

If people want Rafa to turn it around it's going to take a minimum of another 3 years IMO. The progress we're making under him is one step forwards one and a half steps back IMO.

No point in giving him 12 months, it's not enough

[Red_hot]

Long thread......init?

Init just! :yawns:

It's the same ol, same ol every week. It's depressing.

I don't want Rafa to go!

[Red Chilli]

Init just! :yawns:

It's the same ol, same ol every week. It's depressing.

I don't want Rafa to go!

It's inevitable, I fear. It's a results business. It'll be a sad sad day, but it's coming.

[El Jefecito]

If people want Rafa to turn it around it's going to take a minimum of another 3 years IMO. The progress we're making under him is one step forwards one and a half steps back IMO.

No point in giving him 12 months, it's not enough

Agree, but we need to relax the constraints that he has been working under. He has had to settle on the far more risky second best transfer options. It's not a great suprise that these second options e.g. Kuyt, Pennant, et al have failed to perform. Would we be the same today if we had got Alves / Simao? I don't think so!

[Red Chilli]

Agree, but we need to relax the constraints that he has been working under. He has had to settle on the far more risky second best transfer options. It's not a great suprise that these second options e.g. Kuyt, Pennant, et al have failed to perform. Would we be the same today if we had got Alves / Simao? I don't think so!

You have to remember that Alves/Simao would only get 20 or so league games a season under Rafa.
I think this is part of the reason why so many of his signings fail to settle, they simply don't play regularly enough, it's all stop-start.

[El Jefecito]

People wont believe me, because of this bizarre alleged 'agenda' but for me, that'd be the best outcome possible. My first choice thing i want, is for Rafa to turn everything around and win the title...and stay for many years, creating a dynasty. I want that more than anything else. And i wish i could believe it'll happen, i really do. But i just cant see it. I dont CHOOSE to not have belief in it, it's just how i feel and i cant help it.

BUt look back at the list of reasons why we are underperforming and only a few of them are due to Rafa.

IMO the only thing that Rafa is responsible for is the whole rotation thing. There are two options, improve the squad so that we have the quality players that can make this work, OR, rotate less. I think this would make more difference than anything else. If Rafa started doing this it would make me think a) he understands where he is falling down, b) that he is prepared to do something about it, and, c) that he will be in a better position to win the EPL.

No?

[Craig_H]

If people want Rafa to turn it around it's going to take a minimum of another 3 years IMO. The progress we're making under him is one step forwards one and a half steps back IMO.

No point in giving him 12 months, it's not enough

My only issue with that is you're talking about 7 years. He took over the 4th best side in the land. Four years later, and we're struggling to even finish 4th. I fail to see how he's going to bridge a similar size gap in 3 years, that he's failed to bridge in four.

[Red Chilli]

My only issue with that is you're talking about 7 years. He took over the 4th best side in the land. Four years later, and we're struggling to even finish 4th. I fail to see how he's going to bridge a similar size gap in 3 years, that he's failed to bridge in four.

I agree, 1 year, 3 years, 20 years, he's not going to win the Premier league

[El Jefecito]

My only issue with that is you're talking about 7 years. He took over the 4th best side in the land. Four years later, and we're struggling to even finish 4th. I fail to see how he's going to bridge a similar size gap in 3 years, that he's failed to bridge in four.

You have to admit though that the top 3 have improved exponentially due to either a) the amount of money they have spent, or b) the fact that they are now reaping the benefit of investments in youth that they made 5-7 years ago.

We are behind the 8 ball. Rafas investment in youth will not be realized for at least 2 more years. At that time it would be fair to compare against the top 3.

[Dhav]

My only issue with that is you're talking about 7 years. He took over the 4th best side in the land. Four years later, and we're struggling to even finish 4th. I fail to see how he's going to bridge a similar size gap in 3 years, that he's failed to bridge in four.

Well Wenger and Fergie have had years on him, and Chelsea have had unlimited funds for a quick fix. Plus Fergie's funds have hardly been insignificant. Plus we were miles behind all 3 when he took over.

[Dhav]

You have to admit though that the top 3 have improved exponentially due to either a) the amount of money they have spent, or b) the fact that they are now reaping the benefit of investments in youth that they made 5-7 years ago.

We are behind the 8 ball. Rafas investment in youth will not be realized for at least 2 more years. At that time it would be fair to compare against the top 3.

Put it better than i could.