Rafa - I'm here to stay

[Harv]

I dont begrudge anyone making mistakes, it's human. But continuing to make the SAME mistakes is something i cannot accept. There's little or no sign that Rafa learns from his mistakes, that is the problem.

i'd beg to differ.

[dww]

I see you coming Dave but the way he expresses himself sometimes just cuts dead any attempt at a sensible discussion. I wouldn't have got to him if he attempted to discuss my point of view in an un-childish way.

Just ignore him then or even put him on ignore. The tit for tat posting is ruining discussion on this board and I think we can all agree that stopping it will only be a good thing.

[Shaggy]

The fact Rafa ships out his underperforming signings so swiftly (Morientes, Josemi, Kromkamp...you know who I mean) is about as clear an indication that he "learns from his mistakes" (or at least recognises them) as you could possibly get.

[Guest]

Just ignore him then or even put him on ignore. The tit for tat posting is ruining discussion on this board and I think we can all agree that stopping it will only be a good thing.

I won't put him on ignore mate, I'd rather not be tempted into what happened previously though.

[Guest]

The fact Rafa ships out his underperforming signings so swiftly (Morientes, Josemi, Kromkamp...you know who I mean) is about as clear an indication that he "learns from his mistakes" (or at least recognises them) as you could possibly get.

And after having read Tomkins latest piece I may be tempted to say that Kuyt has improved lately due to being given Rafa's backing. He's not flashy and never will be but he's proving effective and is in patches a goal threat, judging by his shot on the post yesterday.

I'm also sure Rafa will add to wide positions + another striker this summer wiht either one of Voronin and Crouch (prob. Voronin) making way this summer.

[dww]

The fact Rafa ships out his underperforming signings so swiftly (Morientes, Josemi, Kromkamp...you know who I mean) is about as clear an indication that he "learns from his mistakes" (or at least recognises them) as you could possibly get.

To some extent that is fair but I think the point that DJS is trying to make is that Rafa has shown little sign of altering his underlying methods and philosophy re: rotation and tactical alterations despite admitting he finds it harder to use it effectively in the PL.

I'm not sure I totally agree in that we have seen alterations in Rafa's style both tactically over his time with us as well as in terms of staff and player turnover. I think even in the last few games we have seen Rafa adopt a more counter attack orientated style with Babel to the fore which is a significant development IMO.

[carlton]

I dont begrudge anyone making mistakes, it's human. But continuing to make the SAME mistakes is something i cannot accept. There's little or no sign that Rafa learns from his mistakes, that is the problem.

Gee, thats good of you mate. Frankly its statements like the one youve just made that makes having a balanced discussion with you about the Manager nigh on impossible. Nothing he does-except for leaving-will be good enough for you because you dont appear to have an open mind about the situation.

[Craig_H]

The fact Rafa ships out his underperforming signings so swiftly (Morientes, Josemi, Kromkamp...you know who I mean) is about as clear an indication that he "learns from his mistakes" (or at least recognises them) as you could possibly get.

Why does he continue with over-obsessive rotation for rotation's sake, continues changing the formation almost every game and continues adjusting his own team's mentality to account for inferior sides?

[Shaggy]

To some extent that is fair but I think the point that DJS is trying to make is that Rafa has shown little sign of altering his underlying methods and philosophy re: rotation and tactical alterations despite admitting he finds it harder to use it effectively in the PL.

Well to me that is admirable.

Benitez has a clear footballing philosophy - one that has served him well. He has a clear idea and knows exactly what he is doing, unlike his predecessor.

Houllier was a blagger. Primarily a defensive coach who looked to use quick strikers to catch teams on the counter, he (embarrassingly) tried to change his style of play on a whim. He tried an attacking style of play for a short time, until it started backfiring and he hastily reverted to type.

I for one am thankful we have a manager who knows what he's doing and will not be shifted from his football philosophy by a load of know-it-alls in the media and on the internet. Benitez has forgotten in the last five minutes what the rest of us on here, combined, know about football...despite Syd's apparent belief that he is Rinus Michels.

[Guest]

To some extent that is fair but I think the point that DJS is trying to make is that Rafa has shown little sign of altering his underlying methods and philosophy re: rotation and tactical alterations despite admitting he finds it harder to use it effectively in the PL.

I'm not sure I totally agree in that we have seen alterations in Rafa's style both tactically over his time with us as well as in terms of staff and player turnover. I think even in the last few games we have seen Rafa adopt a more counter attack orientated style with Babel to the fore which is a significant development IMO.

I think he learns on the whole mate. He probably is too bothered by stats and the way he analyzes a game of football borders on the too scientific sometimes, but he's got more success than most using these methods, so he must be confident in them.

I'm sure the saga with the americans and the fact we've lost Pako so early into the season did break the harmony within the squad.

Rafa is too smart to make the same mistakes again next season IMO. He'll get it right eventually.

[Craig_H]

Gee, thats good of you mate. Frankly its statements like the one youve just made that makes having a balanced discussion with you about the Manager nigh on impossible. Nothing he does-except for leaving-will be good enough for you because you dont appear to have an open mind about the situation.

On the contrary, if he stops over-obsessing with rotation for rotation's sake, stops changing the formation almost every game, stops being unduly cautious in his approach and stops adjusting his own team's mentality to account for inferior sides, then i've no real problem.

[AFII]

Rafa can't possible know until a few months into a season in which way to use a new player in a new league.

It will take a few months until he can get the best out of him. Babel is a great example and Lucas another.

They are great talents but it will take for them to settle in a new league. Torres is that good that he will settle in any league more or less straight away.

We already have the central midfield, central defense and keeper situation sorted out long term.

We also have one of the best strikers playing for us. It's the wide players that are missing but that's only because Rafa hasn't been able to afford them or been turned down. Alves, Cicinho, Simao, Malouda and Nasri are wide players that he tried to sign. So no one can say that he isn't trying to sort that problem out.

It's better to wait until the player you want or is good enough is available than to sign up a second or third choice player.

[Shaggy]

Why does he continue with over-obsessive rotation for rotation's sake, continues changing the formation almost every game and continues adjusting his own team's mentality to account for inferior sides?

You say it's "rotation for rotation's sake" - he says there's a reason for every change.

I know who has more insight.

And rotation isn't the problem anyway. You've been listening to Richard Keys too much mate.

[Reece]

You say it's "rotation for rotation's sake" - he says there's a reason for every change.

I know who has more insight.

And rotation isn't the problem anyway. You've been listening to Richard Keys too much mate.

The scum made at least 4 changes on saturday, including their 2 cm's (a key area of the pitch), and Rooney and Ronaldo - arguably their best two players this season. So that is like Rafa "rotating" Gerrard and Torres - but I don't see Fergie getting stick for it.....

[Guest]

On the contrary, if he stops over-obsessing with rotation for rotation's sake, stops changing the formation almost every game, stops being unduly cautious in his approach and stops adjusting his own team's mentality to account for inferior sides, then i've no real problem.

That's not why we've been poor. He normally settles for the same side and formation in the run up. Yes, he tinkles a lot at the start of the season simply because each player's fitness is probably not the same, therefore he's trying to use his resources the best he can.

At least give him credit for trying things instead of arguing for the sake of arguing about the so called fact he's got no clue in what he's doing. As if you know more than him. That's pretty stupid if you ask me Syd.