Voronin - 'Britain's a cultural backwater'

[DannyMan2006]

the article is clearly twisted but his points are spot on. the nhs is **** and germany's public services and quality of life is much better.

I've lived in both and we're a long way behind. Public health, transport network/affordability, community services in general, clean streets, crime. we're a long way off them unfortunately. could yo usee england hosting a world cup as well organised as 2006? never.

Bollocks.

Euro '96 was spot on. And some of the FA's initiatives are regarded the world over, be it eradicating hoolaganism to a low level to the kick out racism campaign.

[barnes10]

whoa easy dannyman. ;-)

what i was talking about was things like the fan parks and great transport around the place. I was in cologne and it was just so bleedin easy and well organised. no intimidating police presence anywhere a beer was sold. it was a brilliantly organised publicly enjoyable spectacle. we couldnt do that because of the very hooliganism element you describe. in fact weren't there huge kick offs and violence in canary wharf during the 06 world cup! sure england had decent stadiums but thats co-incidence no? we didnt build any or provide funding for any with euro 96 in mind like germany did for the world cup.

i stand by the fact that we would never have pulled off what the germans did. they set a new standard.

[Danish_Pastry]

... to be honest - did study a year with Uni. of Liverpool - being from Denmark - and that year nearly made me a marxist as I saw how kids in Toxteth were living in gangs, my Landlady had her house broken into, even having ironcover for the ground floor. Nearly everywhere you see ironfences or cover for the groundfloor windows. That kind of things you would never see in Denmark - and Im highly convinced there is a reason to that. England (and esp. the NW) has such a strong social diversity - with very little middleclass and a lot of lower incomes. A lot on social security in small flats etc. I havn't been in Liverpool for 1½ year now, but I hope the regenratoin for Cult2008-city has made some changes.

I know we pay high taxes in Denmark - abt. 45% from 3000-35000£ - and higher above up ot 60% - but then nobody are left out in their unluck. Everyone can be cared for - and nobody has to commit crime for money (maybe only a few for drugs - or someone from eastern europe with no nationalty that gives them rigths here. Things are very similar in Germany - just a little lower level of taxes, so - I do understand the crows comments. Things are worse in England - few very rich people and a lot with very little money. That of course gives some money to run a club like LFC (which is nearly impossible in Denmark), but for the sake of normal life, I'd prefer to stay here in DK and only visit Liverpool (where I luw to go!).

[Vermilion]

He's come out today & backtracked i believe.

[DannyMan2006]

whoa easy dannyman. ;-)

what i was talking about was things like the fan parks and great transport around the place. I was in cologne and it was just so bleedin easy and well organised. no intimidating police presence anywhere a beer was sold. it was a brilliantly organised publicly enjoyable spectacle. we couldnt do that because of the very hooliganism element you describe. in fact weren't there huge kick offs and violence in canary wharf during the 06 world cup! sure england had decent stadiums but thats co-incidence no? we didnt build any or provide funding for any with euro 96 in mind like germany did for the world cup.

i stand by the fact that we would never have pulled off what the germans did. they set a new standard.

I think we'd pull it of no problems.

And anyone not happy in England can do one and **** off to another country. And that includes the crow.

I believe you could go anywhere in the world and still find complaints with regards to the lifestyle. But no one forced anyone to come here and immigration are usually more than willing to assist in deporting people back to their country of origin.

So if Andriy is struggling to raise the cash for a flight he can always pop in and ask!

On a more serious note we all know England is not the best at everything in the world, but we are a helluva alot better of than most. The crow should count his blessings.

[barnes10]

so why didnt we do it in 96? where were the fan parks and broader concept to make the most of it? Where was the extra stadium building? I think it didnt happen because we don't have the ideas first of all but crucially we don't have the infrastructure to support it. because of that it costs too much to upgrade things like transport services to make it happen. look at the costs of the olympics and wembley. the last thing england does well is affordably build stadiums and host global events.

we're gonna have to agree to disagree on this one really. its not about saying england is 'sh1t' nor a cultural backwater - that i don't agree with and the crow himself didnt even say. what im saying is that in some respects - as you seem to agree yourself - we're lagging behind and lagging behind the very place where the crow came from. its undeniable.

[BFG]

I think we'd pull it of no problems.

And anyone not happy in England can do one and **** off to another country. And that includes the crow.

I believe you could go anywhere in the world and still find complaints with regards to the lifestyle. But no one forced anyone to come here and immigration are usually more than willing to assist in deporting people back to their country of origin.

So if Andriy is struggling to raise the cash for a flight he can always pop in and ask!

On a more serious note we all know England is not the best at everything in the world, but we are a helluva alot better of than most. The crow should count his blessings.

Them foreigners eh. If you look at his direct quotes from the official he didn't say half of what that **** rag of a paper said he did so maybe you're being a tad harsh on the Ukrainian porn star.

[DannyMan2006]

so why didnt we do it in 96? where were the fan parks and broader concept to make the most of it? Where was the extra stadium building? I think it didnt happen because we don't have the ideas first of all but crucially we don't have the infrastructure to support it. because of that it costs too much to upgrade things like transport services to make it happen. look at the costs of the olympics and wembley. the last thing england does well is affordably build stadiums and host global events.

we're gonna have to agree to disagree on this one really. its not about saying england is 'sh1t' nor a cultural backwater - that i don't agree with and the crow himself didnt even say. what im saying is that in some respects - as you seem to agree yourself - we're lagging behind and lagging behind the very place where the crow came from. its undeniable.

As the Germans are at the forefront and have been for some time in regards to the building aspect, this is no embarrassment to say we are behind them. Everyone else is to.

The price of Wembley was ridiculous, but that is London prices and London wages. It would be far cheaper elsewhere. I agree there was a lack of facilities to keep the foreign fans happy in Euro '96, but these sorts of things have only started to appear since around the Millenium.

I would guarantee that if we hosted the World Cup in the future we would carry it off without a problem. We already have the stadiums and increasing the overtime hours for rail and bus drivers would probably help support the transport infrastructure. Nothing wrong with our roads and rail, just a lack of buses and trains to catch, meaning alot of waiting around. I'm sure there would be enough people willing to put in the overtime to increase the number of buses and trains.

With regards to the NHS, I've lived here all my life more or less and I've never had any problems. I think you'll find that in the UK the negative stories of the NHS, Police Service and Armed Forces are always printed in the tabloids, whilst positive stories are put on the back burner.

That's not to say everything is perfect.

[DannyMan2006]

Them foreigners eh. If you look at his direct quotes from the official he didn't say half of what that **** rag of a paper said he did so maybe you're being a tad harsh on the Ukrainian porn star.

That comment was very tongue in cheek. I read yesterday he had been mis quoted.

Had he actually said all that then maybe I'd have a go at him. After all, if anyone can complain then it is surely LFC fans with regards his performances on the pitch!

[BFG]

That comment was very tongue in cheek. I read yesterday he had been mis quoted.

Had he actually said all that then maybe I'd have a go at him. After all, if anyone can complain then it is surely LFC fans with regards his performances on the pitch!

I thought it might have been. That's why I tried to not come across as having too much sand in my vagina.

[Joe King]

Them foreigners eh. If you look at his direct quotes from the official he didn't say half of what that **** rag of a paper said he did so maybe you're being a tad harsh on the Ukrainian porn star.

I think the UK as a whole is awfully bad when it comes to regenerating. Wembley is a classic case, it took longer than an ape evolving into a human but that is not the discussion here. Crow is talking about crime and the police 'force' in this country is ****. They do nothing to protect citizens from the townies, chavs, ****s on the street

[Shaggy]

... to be honest - did study a year with Uni. of Liverpool - being from Denmark - and that year nearly made me a marxist as I saw how kids in Toxteth were living in gangs, my Landlady had her house broken into, even having ironcover for the ground floor. Nearly everywhere you see ironfences or cover for the groundfloor windows. That kind of things you would never see in Denmark - and Im highly convinced there is a reason to that. England (and esp. the NW) has such a strong social diversity - with very little middleclass and a lot of lower incomes. A lot on social security in small flats etc. I havn't been in Liverpool for 1½ year now, but I hope the regenratoin for Cult2008-city has made some changes.

I know we pay high taxes in Denmark - abt. 45% from 3000-35000£ - and higher above up ot 60% - but then nobody are left out in their unluck. Everyone can be cared for - and nobody has to commit crime for money (maybe only a few for drugs - or someone from eastern europe with no nationalty that gives them rigths here. Things are very similar in Germany - just a little lower level of taxes, so - I do understand the crows comments. Things are worse in England - few very rich people and a lot with very little money. That of course gives some money to run a club like LFC (which is nearly impossible in Denmark), but for the sake of normal life, I'd prefer to stay here in DK and only visit Liverpool (where I luw to go!).

Interesting to hear your perspective mate....

[DannyMan2006]

I thought it might have been. That's why I tried to not come across as having too much sand in my vagina.

[DannyMan2006]

I think the UK as a whole is awfully bad when it comes to regenerating. Wembley is a classic case, it took longer than an ape evolving into a human but that is not the discussion here. Crow is talking about crime and the police 'force' in this country is ****. They do nothing to protect citizens from the townies, chavs, ****s on the street

Police Service mate. You not seen Hot Fuzz

I take it you're in a position to judge the abilities of the police? By this I mean you have seen the powers made available to them, which are given by way of laws, which are created by the people who are voted in power by the majority every General Election..........

[DannyMan2006]

Police Service mate. You not seen Hot Fuzz

I take it you're in a position to judge the abilities of the police? By this I mean you have seen the powers made available to them, which are given by way of laws, which are created by the people who are voted in power by the majority every General Election..........

In addition to that post.

Most people would look at the Gerrard situation and use that to criticise Police. It's a sad state of affairs when it takes an underworld gangster to solve the problems of our skipper.

But Police can only act on the evidence they can collect, such as when the fella in question got 10 years for supplying Heroin. And of course Police have long moved on from the days of threatening violence to solve problems.

A gangland enforcer does not require evidence and certainly has no problems with violence. Hence the problem got solved.