Does he have a point or is talkin rollicks?

[-V-]

Zonal has worked ok for years. But it seems that the best opposition coaches can work it our. For some reason Alex Ferguson seems to keep exploiting it

[BFG]

Just the usual conservative bull**** from Britain's football 'experts.'

It's sad that non traditional methods brought in from other footballing cultures are immediately and permanently labelled as abnormal and unsuccessful no matter how well they work in this country. And then we wonder why our national game is crap, how about if we took some contemporary methods on board instead of instantly criticising them.

Hopefully the generation that's playing now will understand that the old way isn't always the best way when they retire and become critics.

[Nic83]

He's a dick but too right it needs to be ditched. The big teams especially take advantage of it and it proved to be the difference a lopt last year. IE: The UTD game at Anfield

[BFG]

He's a dick but too right it needs to be ditched

Why?

If the system is to blame why has it been so successful for us and Chelsea since 2005 with only last year as a blip? Surely that proves that the sytem can work but last year too many individual errors were made?

[Nic83]

Why?

If the system is to blame why has it been so successful for us and Chelsea since 2005 with only last year as a blip? Surely that proves that the sytem can work but last year too many individual errors were made?

It hasn't been successful for us, it's cost us more points than it would have if we played a normal system IMO. I wasn't aware Chelsea used it. In fact, aren't Terry and Carvalho always hanging onto defenders in their box from corners? Can't get more man marking than that

Individual errors will always be made for me with zonal marking and it isn't just that, it's the fact that the striker will always have an advantage as they get a run on the defender and can exploit the space. It works better abroad as the attackers are far less aggressive in general at attacking the ball in the air. It's a much more technical game on the continent.

For me it will never work in the premiership and I hate it.

[The Birdman]

It shouldn't be ditched, a lot of our goals conceeded from set pieces were from the 2nd ball which sometimes you can't do anything about. The amount of goals we conceeded from a free shot or header is minimal. That Utd goal was a scuffed shot from 20 yards that was turned in. The faults with that goal was not closing the 1st man (Rooney??)then not pushing out from the posts as a team (I think Masch stayed in) that goal had absolutely **** all to do with zonal marking.
You can't eliminate individual errors from football, that's what makes it unpredictable and exciting, what Rafa does is minimalise the impact an individual error has.

It's attacking set pieces that we need to improve on.

[Nic83]

It shouldn't be ditched, a lot of our goals conceeded from set pieces were from the 2nd ball which sometimes you can't do anything about. The amount of goals we conceeded from a free shot or header is minimal. That Utd goal was a scuffed shot from 20 yards that was turned in. The faults with that goal was not closing the 1st man (Rooney??)then not pushing out from the posts as a team (I think Masch stayed in) that goal had absolutely **** all to do with zonal marking.
You can't eliminate individual errors from football, that's what makes it unpredictable and exciting, what Rafa does is minimalise the impact an individual error has.

It's attacking set pieces that we need to improve on.

In a man marking system, Rooney would have been marked, simple as that

[BFG]

It hasn't been successful for us, it's cost us more points than it would have if we played a normal system IMO. I wasn't aware Chelsea used it. In fact, aren't Terry and Carvalho always hanging onto defenders in their box from corners? Can't get more man marking than that

Individual errors will always be made for me with zonal marking and it isn't just that, it's the fact that the striker will always have an advantage as they get a run on the defender and can exploit the space. It works better abroad as the attackers are far less aggressive in general at attacking the ball in the air. It's a much more technical game on the continent.

For me it will never work in the premiership and I hate it.

If you read the Pauil Tompkins article that was written a year or so ago he points to the fact that the two teams that have conceded the least goals from set pieces since 2005 are Liverpool and Chelsea and both use zonal marking so it has and does work in the Premiership.

When a goal is conceded in man marking system the individual is to blame but when it's a zonal system it's the method that's at fault. Madness.

[BFG]

In a man marking system, Rooney would have been marked, simple as that

If everyone did their job properly yes but if everyone did their job properly in a zonal system the ball would have been cleared by whoever was marking the zone the ball was played into no?

[Ryan_Derrick]

The fact Daniel Agger has been out since the 1st week in September has been the key reason. Hyypia, Arbeloa and then Skertl has all deputised well but the constant change of personel at CB has been he problem.

[Slim]

If you read the Pauil Tompkins article that was written a year or so ago he points to the fact that the two teams that have conceded the least goals from set pieces since 2005 are Liverpool and Chelsea and both use zonal marking so it has and does work in the Premiership.

When a goal is conceded in man marking system the individual is to blame but when it's a zonal system it's the method that's at fault. Madness.

But then when you are a footbal pundit with something to say why let the facts get in the way? See also our supposed constant rotation of Torres last season which every lazy pundit on the radio and TV made reference to.

[Nic83]

If you read the Pauil Tompkins article that was written a year or so ago he points to the fact that the two teams that have conceded the least goals from set pieces since 2005 are Liverpool and Chelsea and both use zonal marking so it has and does work in the Premiership.

They are also 2 of the teams who conceed the least corners so that would make sense

When a goal is conceded in man marking system the individual is to blame but when it's a zonal system it's the method that's at fault. Madness.

[BFG]

Well I'd like to see the figures for number of set pieces compared to goals conceded Nic because from memory there wasn't a man marking team anywhere close to having so few goals conceded and you would have thought Arsenal and ManU would have only conceded a similar amount of set pieces but both conceded a lot more goals from them, last season excluded of course.

[vocey]

First sensible thing you've said all year.

and also you, but maybe thats only happened since you got hit with a golf ball.

[Dessy]

and also you, but maybe thats only happened since you got hit with a golf ball.

Ouch....again. My arm is nicely bruised now thanks to that shanker!