Rafa's 'facts' (January rant)

[Dhav]

That Blackburn one is probably the only clear cut one you can name from the past 2 years, i bet.

Isnt it?

I'll give you another clear cut pen from the last two years that wasn't given - Vidic on Torres yesterday. You can guarantee that if that was Carra on Ronaldo up the other end of the pitch it would have been given.

[Craig_H]

I'll give you another clear cut pen from the last two years that wasn't given - Vidic on Torres yesterday. You can guarantee that if that was Carra on Ronaldo up the other end of the pitch it would have been given.

That was never clear cut mate.

[Dhav]

That was never clear cut mate.

It was mate. He blocked Torres' run and also had a hold of his shirt. At the other end it would have been given, 100%.

[Craig_H]

It was mate. He blocked Torres' run and also had a hold of his shirt. At the other end it would have been given, 100%.

Have to disagree, i'm not saying it couldnt have been given but it wasnt clear cut for me. If we'd got it, it would've been generous - Vidic got his body in between Torres and the ball. Yes there was some pulling on Torres' shirt, but Nando had Vidic by the arm too. 50/50 for me.

[dww]

My feeling is that there is mild bias towards United in terms of 50:50 decisions (above even that given to other big teams including ourselves) but that the fact they play the game in the opponents half most of the time is by far the biggest factor in the lack of penalties against them.

It is interesting that now we have beaten United a number of journos have come round to the idea that Fergie has undue influence with the FA/PL and started mitigating their criticism of Rafa's so called 'rant'.

I'm with Dhav I thought the Vidic - Torres incident was pretty clear penalty to be honest.

[G]

That Blackburn one is probably the only clear cut one you can name from the past 2 years, i bet.

Isnt it?

Thats correct cos I don't support them so don't watch them often,but I bet its not the only one and I ain't going to watch re runs of their last 2 seasons to let you know

Its still one too many though.

A pen is pen no matter where its conceded.None in 2 years is a joke,some reaction to it proves that,there were mancs who actually questioned the audacity of the ref giving one against them at home.It has to be an absolute stonewaller for it to be given and even then your lucky with some ref's.

[Craig_H]

My feeling is that there is mild bias towards United in terms of 50:50 decisions (above even that given to other big teams including ourselves) but that the fact they play the game in the opponents half most of the time is by far the biggest factor in the lack of penalties against them.

It is interesting that now we have beaten United a number of journos have come round to the idea that Fergie has undue influence with the FA/PL and started mitigating their criticism of Rafa's so called 'rant'.

I'm with Dhav I thought the Vidic - Torres incident was pretty clear penalty to be honest.

Apart from the last line, i'd go along with that.

I dunno about that peno though, my train of thought is that of saying 'it's not one you get given' - but whether that means it isnt a pen, i dunno.

I'd still fall slightly on the side of the fence that say not a penalty.

[G]

I'll give you another clear cut pen from the last two years that wasn't given - Vidic on Torres yesterday. You can guarantee that if that was Carra on Ronaldo up the other end of the pitch it would have been given.

[Craig_H]

Thats correct cos I don't support them so don't watch them often,but I bet its not the only one and I ain't going to watch re runs of their last 2 seasons to let you know

Its still one too many though.

A pen is pen no matter where its conceded.None in 2 years is a joke,some reaction to it proves that,there were mancs who actually questioned the audacity of the ref giving one against them at home.It has to be an absolute stonewaller for it to be given and even then your lucky with some ref's.

I agree that a pen is a pen and it shouldnt matter what ground you're at. I would however say that all the big clubs get slightly favourable penalty decisions at home.

I'd also dispute the notion that anything you've alluded to 'proves' that they dont get legitimate penalties given against them at OT.

[Dhav]

Have to disagree, i'm not saying it couldnt have been given but it wasnt clear cut for me. If we'd got it, it would've been generous - Vidic got his body in between Torres and the ball. Yes there was some pulling on Torres' shirt, but Nando had Vidic by the arm too. 50/50 for me.

Vidic had Nando's shirt first and Nando grabbed Vidic's to regain balance. Did Andy Gray say that outside the box it would have been a definite foul? If so he was absolutely right IMO.

[G]

I agree that a pen is a pen and it shouldnt matter what ground you're at. I would however say that all the big clubs get slightly favourable penalty decisions at home.

I'd also dispute the notion that anything you've alluded to 'proves' that they dont get legitimate penalties given against them at OT.

Dispute what you like mate

The Blackburn one is proof enough for me,it was late in the game,it would have given them a chance to pull level and the Ref bottled it with 70k odd muppets screaming at him.

IMO of course

[G]

Vidic had Nando's shirt first and Nando grabbed Vidic's to regain balance. Did Andy Gray say that outside the box it would have been a definite foul? If so he was absolutely right IMO.

Yes he did

[Craig_H]

Vidic had Nando's shirt first and Nando grabbed Vidic's to regain balance. Did Andy Gray say that outside the box it would have been a definite foul? If so he was absolutely right IMO.

Yeah he did say that, as it goes. And i'd agree. But there's definitely a level of foul, rightly or wrongly, where the officials dont give them in the box, but would do outside.

A penalty is a big call but yes, i would agree that they're bigger calls against the home side at OT. But also at Anfield, Stamford Bridge and the Emirates IMO.

[Craig_H]

Dispute what you like mate

The Blackburn one is proof enough for me,it was late in the game,it would have given them a chance to pull level and the Ref bottled it with 70 odd muppets screaming at him.

IMO of course

One incident doesnt exactly "prove" a wholesale conspiracy.

[dww]

Hmmm. I'm not sure about specific incidents but in my opinion Fergie has wielded undue influence over the disciplinary procedures in this country for a while now. Rafa's views were right when he said them and right now. The only difference I see on the pitch or off is that now one or two journalists are willing to agree.