Are we better than Man Utd?

[Vermilion]

So hard to fathom, well, we are doing fine in the 'top 4 mini league', but we've been so unlucky against the smaller sides, dominating many games, hitting the woodwork countless times only to come away with a poxy draw, such fine margins.

Are we better than utd, well obviously as a club we're miles better, as a squad i would say no, but i'd have to qualify that by saying i think we are playing better and our manager is getting far more out of the players we have compared to utd.

So my honest asnswer is.... Don't really know.

[wiw]

Most definitely YES. They just have momentum and fear on their side this season unfortunately

They will most probably equal our 18 but they sure as **** won't better it. New owners, Kenny in, Sammy is back and 1 or 2 tweaks to our team and we're laughing all the way to the title. Fergie is no match for Rafa anymore the senile old prick

[spanky]

Big differance between the two teams is the fear factor. You could argue over players but for me thats it. When we go a goal up you always have a feeling they'll sit back and try to control the game which gives the opposition heart whereas with the scum, the opposition team usually starts to panic and conceeds a 2nd goal.
Unfortunately you can't put a finger on when a team gets that factor but they have it. Even when their playing rubbish they still look capable of a goal.

[DannyMan2006]

Big differance between the two teams is the fear factor. You could argue over players but for me thats it. When we go a goal up you always have a feeling they'll sit back and try to control the game which gives the opposition heart whereas with the scum, the opposition team usually starts to panic and conceeds a 2nd goal.
Unfortunately you can't put a finger on when a team gets that factor but they have it. Even when their playing rubbish they still look capable of a goal.

Comes from History.

Over the years the Macs have done this, which makes teams think it will happen to them. Mancs also have the belief.

Has happened with us and late goals this year. You could see Chelsea and Arsenal visibly shaking when we were going for it.

[EwarWoo]

When we go a goal up you always have a feeling they'll sit back and try to control the game which gives the opposition heart whereas with the scum, the opposition team usually starts to panic and conceeds a 2nd goal.

Because they don't sit back and control the game, they go for the jugular.

The opposition thinks ****, we need to score now, we can't just defend, they're going to slaughter us!

There's the fear factor.

Has happened with us and late goals this year. You could see Chelsea and Arsenal visibly shaking when we were going for it.

When we didn't sit back

[Vermilion]

Most definitely YES. They just have momentum and fear on their side this season unfortunately

They will most probably equal our 18 but they sure as **** won't better it. New owners, Kenny in, Sammy is back and 1 or 2 tweaks to our team and we're laughing all the way to the title. Fergie is no match for Rafa anymore the senile old prick

where ? where? show me the money....please god show me the feckin money.

[ronniedrew]

they have 2 trophys already(world and carling), lost in fa cup final , will win the league (for the 3rd time in a row) and are still in europe (having won it last year).

they have a lot more world class players than us and a bigger squad, if we have torres or gerrard out , we have major issues, they make a lot more money than us and can buy whatever they need .

they are the better team, like it or not, silly poll

[DannyMan2006]

they have 2 trophys already(world and carling), lost in fa cup final , will win the league (for the 3rd time in a row) and are still in europe (having won it last year).

they have a lot more world class players than us and a bigger squad, if we have torres or gerrard out , we have major issues, they make a lot more money than us and can buy whatever they need .

they are the better team, like it or not, silly poll

FA cup semi final mate.

And if the poll was who has been the best team this season then the answer is clearly Man Utd. But it doesn't ask that, it says who is the better team.

My answer remains the same. We have the better first XI, but they have the better squad. Next year we have to bring in either young players with massive potential, or players who are better than our first XI. Then get rid of the players who are no longer second choice in their chosen position - Unless they are utility and can cover a few positions.

EDIT:

That said, I don't think we are a million miles away. A bit of luck against Chelsea and we'd be in the semi of the CL. Had Lucas not got himself sent off v Everton it could easily have been us who played Man Utd in the semi of the FA cup. Few more decisions in the league and we'd be top. I should say that most teams can point to the odd decision that goes against them. Fine margins at the top. A bit more quality and we will compete at the top again next year.

[Leyton388]

Big difference is against us teams come to Anfield and park the bus thinking they can get something where as when they go to the toilet they are pretty much defeated before they kick off and just write the game at old toilet off at the beginning of the season.

Also apart from 3 or 4 managers in the league when it comes to going up against united the rest are either friends of whiskey nose or just complete losers.

For example if i was a chairman of a club and my manager was being all pally with whiskey nose after being beaten or in some cases we have seen this season basically write the game against them off i would ask some serious questions about the mentality of a man i am paying millions to do a job.

[ronniedrew]

FA cup semi final mate.

And if the poll was who has been the best team this season then the answer is clearly Man Utd. But it doesn't ask that, it says who is the better team.

My answer remains the same. We have the better first XI, but they have the better squad. Next year we have to bring in either young players with massive potential, or players who are better than our first XI. Then get rid of the players who are no longer second choice in their chosen position - Unless they are utility and can cover a few positions.

EDIT:

That said, I don't think we are a million miles away. A bit of luck against Chelsea and we'd be in the semi of the CL. Had Lucas not got himself sent off v Everton it could easily have been us who played Man Utd in the semi of the FA cup. Few more decisions in the league and we'd be top. I should say that most teams can point to the odd decision that goes against them. Fine margins at the top. A bit more quality and we will compete at the top again next year.

only a liverpool fan would say we have a better team than theirs,starting 11 or not, injuries or not

we would need to add 3 world class players to be good enough
to be dominant, some pool fans are creaming themselves over tevez who warms their bench for the most part?, he cant get into the team.

there is no embarasment, they have spent a lot to assemble their team/squad, there is no argument for me, they are the better team (especially attacking wise) and have proved it again over this season

[Woobus]

only a liverpool fan would say we have a better team than theirs,starting 11 or not, injuries or not

we would need to add 3 world class players to be good enough
to be dominant, some pool fans are creaming themselves over tevez who warms their bench for the most part?, he cant get into the team.

there is no embarasment, they have spent a lot to assemble their team/squad, there is no argument for me, they are the better team (especially attacking wise) and have proved it again over this season

We have out scored them this year, its their defense that has them doing so well this year.

[Redspin]

I was referring to this:


It seems to me you were selecting some "facts" and discounting others simply to strengthen your position.

The stats you quote may be correct but your interpretation is partial. As in "lies, damned lies and statistics," you know?

It's not an interpretation: it is a fact that they have only scored an avaerage of a goal a game away from home if WBA away is not included.

[Redspin]

If you genuinely dont think Rooney, Tevez and Berbatov are capable of scoring goals, then we have little to debate.

The facts show that all of them are easily capable of netting 20 odd a season but i wouldnt expect you to let facts get in the way of bias.

Actually the facts show the opposite. Rooney has never scored more than 20 league goals a season. In fact it took until last season, which must be at least his sixth top-flight season, before he passed the 50 league goal mark. Berbatov netted just 13 and 12 league goals in his previous 2 seasons at Spurs. Tevez - 3 this season - has not been in England long enough to know if he's capable but his paltry return this season would tend to suggest he's unlikely to get 20 league goals so is therefore not capable of it as you have decided. I read yesterday that he's played more often than Rooney or Berbatov - in his apparent moan about not playing enough games for them - so the excuse that he hasn't played enough games doesn't apply.

So, it's rather apparent that, although the facts say one thing, your apparent innate bias towards all things Manc has led to your bias getting in the way of the actual facts.

One other point is that your poll is a bit pointless anyway. Any self-respecting Manc on these forums - and there are plenty - would make sure he voted in their favour and against Liverpool, so it rather defeats the object

[Redspin]

indeed you could
then of course boro fans will say they beat us last time and you see that argument is shot down
great we played them twice and won
i would of taken gettin beaten twice but winning the league meself
but im in the minority of course and imo crowing how you beat them twice only actually "bigs" them up and makes us look small

but **** what do i know

How does losing at Middlesbrough have any bearing on the fact that we have scored more goals than the Mancs and have given them a football lesson twice this season? My point was directly in response to a point asking how we could consider ourselves better than them and I proffered the response.

If you're going to drag in matters not related to the two teams in relation to each other you might as well mention that losing to and being outplayed by Fulham is hardly the hallmark of a team better than Liverpool, but it is absurd as your mentioning Liverpool losing at Boro, where in fact we should have won handsomely but paid the price of missing numerous chances and conceded a soft own goal and were then caught on the break for another

[Redspin]

only a liverpool fan would say we have a better team than theirs,starting 11 or not, injuries or not

we would need to add 3 world class players to be good enough
to be dominant, some pool fans are creaming themselves over tevez who warms their bench for the most part?, he cant get into the team.

there is no embarasment, they have spent a lot to assemble their team/squad, there is no argument for me, they are the better team (especially attacking wise) and have proved it again over this season

If they're better "especially attacking wise" why have they scored fewer goals than us? Worth bearing in mind that we've managed this with our main striker injured for nearly half the league games