THE Lucas thread

[DannyMan2006]

My point is that the gap in the team made by Alonso is not solely Lucas' responsability to fill it's up to all members of the team to ensure that Alonso isn't missed, as Lucas isn't the same type of player as Alonso hence we are playing a different system. Therefore I think it's unfair to single out Lucas in this respect.

I think your comments above may have a small level of truth but the guy is still only 22 and there is a huge exageration in some of those comments in my opinion.

You are right in what you say. But in the games where teams have actually bothered closing us down and put us under pressure the team as a whole has shown a distint lack of faith in the ability of Lucas to carry it off.

Mascherano is trying to do things he can't and Gerrard is trying to cover two positions and leaving Torres all alone, leaving him to get booted from pillar to post as he runs with the ball into blind alleys becasue he has no support. A fully fit Torres would struggle with that, never mind one who is not match fit.

[Roberto Bobbolino]

We are playing the same formation but not the same system because we have different players, Lucas isn't the same type of player as Alonso, so hence we have to play a different way and adapt our style within the formation. If we were to play Gerrard or Aquilani in the Alonso role we would be playing with a different style. We have to adapt our style of player to fit the players we have in the team, in order to do this all the players need to adapt their roles not just one, it's not a case of carrying passengers it's a case of ensuring the team works as a unit.

Formations have **** all to do with anything. Great players adapt and use their own initative.

[Exiled_red]

Isn't that the point?

Not sure why everyone keeps bringing Alonso up, he's gone. If Lucas isn't capable of stamping his own mark on that position then get him out of the team.

Much of the critisism of Lucas seems to be because he isn't Alonso alot of people are bluring the issues of missing Alonso and Lucas' ability

[DannyMan2006]

Denilson is far, far better than Lucas, and has a bit more fight in him.

No he's not, hence the reason Denilson has never been in the full Brazilian squad.

[pondus]

Much of the critisism of Lucas seems to be because he isn't Alonso alot of people are bluring the issues of missing Alonso and Lucas' ability

I think it has more to do with the fact he isn't good enough.

[Roberto Bobbolino]

Carlton Palmer played for England, what's your point?

Actually, I can see why Dunga rates him, he's like a clone of himself without the fight.

[cream]

We definitely suffer when teams press us and close us down because we don't have players who can put their foot on the ball and keep hold of it. Aquilani, Agger and Aurelio are all good at this, as was Alonso, lucas should be doing it but isn't.

[Jaymo]

Once again, i think people are looking for the scapegoat, and for someone to blame for our woeful performance tonight.

By no means was he the worst on the pitch tonight, and to be honest he was one of the better players against Tottenham.

What do people expect this fella to do.. Come in and start passing the ball like Xabi.. He's not that kind of player, and he's the only central midfielder we have with any premier league and international experience, that can play in that position.

The lad can't do right, for doing wrong. Against Stoke, he didn't play the ball forward (we where 2-0 up) and he got torrents of abuse directed at him by 'fans'.. I think these people need to think before they act.. "do we still have the ball.."

I think its a case of people don't like to criticise our better players. The likes of Torres tonight, who spent more time arguing with the ref, and on the floor, than he did playing football. Yeah he scored our goal but if he had his mind on the game, he could have buried at least 2 more.

Kuyt tonight was another player who un-characteristically didnt turn up today.. He put in a lot of effort, but was out played by the Villa defenders.

I know i will probably get slated for this, but i find that people find it easier to criticise the likes of Lucas, when something goes tits up.

[Roberto Bobbolino]

Well that's the problem. People keep comparing him to Alonso but his biggest weakness is his tendency to get bullied out of the game when teams press him closely. Then his head drops and he just takes up space.

[DannyMan2006]

We are playing the same formation but not the same system because we have different players, Lucas isn't the same type of player as Alonso, so hence we have to play a different way and adapt our style within the formation. If we were to play Gerrard or Aquilani in the Alonso role we would be playing with a different style. We have to adapt our style of player to fit the players we have in the team, in order to do this all the players need to adapt their roles not just one, it's not a case of carrying passengers it's a case of ensuring the team works as a unit.

Lucas has not adapted to the formation. He is occupying the same positions Alonso used to without the passing ability and vision to effect the game in the same way.

Because he can not do what Alonso did he needs to take up different positions. Rafa himself stated that his idea was for one of the midfielders to occupy a position closer to the forwards. Because if you do that you don't have to be able to pass it to feet from forty yards.

At the moment it is like a goal poacher trying to play as a hold up striker. Gary Lineker was an exceptional player but he would not be capable of dropping deep and winning flick ons. Lucas needs to take up positions where he can be effective.

[Roberto Bobbolino]

Once again, i think people are looking for the scapegoat, and for someone to blame for our woeful performance tonight.

Predictable. Every valid criticism of Lucas is met with this patronising rubbish. If I needed a scapegoat I would have blamed Babel for being terminally useless.

[Exiled_red]

You are right in what you say. But in the games where teams have actually bothered closing us down and put us under pressure the team as a whole has shown a distint lack of faith in the ability of Lucas to carry it off.

Mascherano is trying to do things he can't and Gerrard is trying to cover two positions and leaving Torres all alone, leaving him to get booted from pillar to post as he runs with the ball into blind alleys becasue he has no support. A fully fit Torres would struggle with that, never mind one who is not match fit.

Isn't that something that comes with game experience though? There were questions about Alonso's ability for a couple of years when he was under pressure, people saying he wanted too much time on the ball etc. Maybe the issue is the same with Lucas?

[Jaymo]

Predictable. Every valid criticism of Lucas is met with this patronising rubbish. If I needed a scapegoat I would have blamed Babel for being terminally useless.

where are the thread's on torres then mate?

yeah Lucas isnt a world beater, and yeah he does have alot of flaws.. but we lose to Villa and the first thing that gets posted...


LUCAS.

[Roberto Bobbolino]

We know Torres is genuine top drawer and will come good. What's your point?

[Jaymo]

We know Torres is genuine top drawer and will come good. What's your point?

Point is, Whats above there.. Lucas singled out, from the many dire performances tonight..

or is this just a big co-incidence..