The New Manager Thread

[Craig_H]

FFS you could do that to EVERY manager and their record

IF Henchoz hadnt gotten away with the handball in the FA CUP Final V Arsenal how would Houlliers record have looked?

IF United hadnt scored two goals in the last 5 minutes against Barcelona in the European Final....

I feel your pain Lec.

5europeancups is a WUM.

[SB]

Fangled. You've just made up the word fandangled.

Mine sounds better. FACT

[red g]

I think you need to remember that Rafa won the CL, pretty much with that squad.

Dudek, Finnan (Hamann 46), Traore, Hyypia, Carragher, Riise, Gerrard, Luis Garcia, Alonso, Kewell (Smicer 23), Baros (Cisse 85).

Subs Not Used: Carson, Josemi, Nunez, Biscan.

and greece won the euros as well........doesnt make them a great team.

unbelievable effort by everyone of them but the reality is it wasnt a particulary good team and flopped in the league as well.

[Rich]

Leverkusen was 2002, Porto won it in 2004.

Cheers dude, couldn't remember exactly when Porto won it! Times a-flyin'!! :-(

[CJ]

i am sure i have heard fandangled as a word before.

[Broner]

Just imagine Arry letting rip like this at Melwood after N'gog fires another wayward shot which ends up on Arry's head:

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zRZTna7tRHk"]YouTube- Harry Redknapp[/ame]

[red g]

Youtube - Harry Redknapp

Sounds about right

[-V-]

Youtube - Harry Redknapp

Sounds about right

red g rules

[kris90210]

embarrassing quotes from Houllier if accurate. He left Liverpool and his reputation was severely damaged. Benitez is on the verge of being snapped up by the european champions. That speaks volumes.

I stood by Houllier when he was taking all sorts of flack but by the end (after 2 **** seasons in a row), there was no doubt about it, he had to go. He was always a level below the other top managers in the league. Remember the shoeings we took in Europe under him? Rafa turned all that round.

He was backed pretty decently, relatively speaking for the time, and was working in far, far more stable conditions than Benitez ever was.

Houllier did a good job of arresting the rot that set in post Souness / Evans. Ive read a lot of the players' autobiographies and not many of the ones I have cast him in a particularly favourable light. Wish he'd have kept these opinions to himself.

[Exiled_red]

He came second.

As Gerard pointed out, he won more trophies than Benitez and apart from a couple of players, left him with a team which would ultimately lead to all of his successes.

I agree that Benitez built a team that should have won the league that year, but due to a number of draws aagainst weaker teams failed to fulfill its potential.

Dont get me wrong. Benitez was the far superior intellect when it came to football but if we look at the facts in the cold light of day If we had not have scored that goal against Olympiakos, how would Benitiez' record have looked.

But Benitez won us the Champions League, and with all due respect that's at a whole other level to the UEFA Cup that Houllier won.

If you are going to go down the route of "ifs", If Inzaghi hadn't got that lucky defected goal in the 2007 final Rafa could have had a second Champions League title.

As for looking at Benitez record in the cold light of day, these are the win percentages of Liverpool managers:

Shankly...52.0%
Paisley....57.4%
Fagan.....52.6%
Dalglish...60.6%
Souness..41.4%
Evans.....50.4%
Houllier...50.8%
Benitez...57.1%

Only Paisley and Dalglish have better records and they both inherited squads what had been successful in winning league titles within the previous couple of years befor they took over. Given that Rafa took over a squad that was struggling and going nowhere I think that is a good record.

[Exiled_red]

Houllier wasnt perfect but with the players he left Rafa with plus a couple of new faces that team won the CL.

Houllier came within a breadth(in my opinion0 of also winning the CL when we got knocked out by Bayer Leverkisen, and I think Porto won th eleague that year. If we had beaten BL we would have won the tournament. Its all about percentages.

We weren't even in the Champions League in 2004 (when Porto won it) We went out of the UEFA Cup in the 4th round to Marseille.

The year we went out to Bayer Leverkusen, we would have had to face Man Utd in the semi finals and Real Madrid in the final, so while I respect your opinion personally I would find it difficult to share your confidence. That was Houllier's one good season in the CL, his other CL season saw us go out in the group stage at the expence of Rafa's Valencia and Basel. Houllier's record in Europe (aside from CL and 2001 UEFA Cup) saw us exit the UEFA Cup to Celta Vigo, Celtic and Marseille. This makes me appreciate how far we have come in Europe under Rafa.

[Kenneth]

But Benitez won us the Champions League, and with all due respect that's at a whole other level to the UEFA Cup that Houllier won.

If you are going to go down the route of "ifs", If Inzaghi hadn't got that lucky defected goal in the 2007 final Rafa could have had a second Champions League title.

As for looking at Benitez record in the cold light of day, these are the win percentages of Liverpool managers:

Shankly...52.0%
Paisley....57.4%
Fagan.....52.6%
Dalglish...60.6%
Souness..41.4%
Evans.....50.4%
Houllier...50.8%
Benitez...57.1%

Only Paisley and Dalglish have better records and they both inherited squads what had been successful in winning league titles within the previous couple of years befor they took over. Given that Rafa took over a squad that was struggling and going nowhere I think that is a good record.

The win percentages are interesting but they don't tell the whole story. A gulf has opened up between the top sides and the rest of the league in the last decade or so. Sure, it was never a level playing field, but I would bet that the win percentages for all of the 'big four' or so have increased over time because of this when plotted season by season. Maybe dave could draw a graph?

[Guest]

Morientes
Gonzalez
Josemi
Pellegrino

You're ****ing deluded mate. Gonzales was a decent player just never adapted at Anfield, Morientes was one of the best strikers in Europe at the time again never adapted here, Pellegrino did well at Valencia as for Josemi, well he was bought early on and he was a bit of a bargain.

You look stupid comparing them with Ferri and Diao.

[Darkon]

But Benitez won us the Champions League, and with all due respect that's at a whole other level to the UEFA Cup that Houllier won.

If you are going to go down the route of "ifs", If Inzaghi hadn't got that lucky defected goal in the 2007 final Rafa could have had a second Champions League title.

As for looking at Benitez record in the cold light of day, these are the win percentages of Liverpool managers:

Shankly...52.0%
Paisley....57.4%
Fagan.....52.6%
Dalglish...60.6%
Souness..41.4%
Evans.....50.4%
Houllier...50.8%
Benitez...57.1%

Only Paisley and Dalglish have better records and they both inherited squads what had been successful in winning league titles within the previous couple of years befor they took over. Given that Rafa took over a squad that was struggling and going nowhere I think that is a good record.

Just to update your sheet there, after the season that just ended Rafa's win percentages is 55.43% - just to be nitty gritty

[Lecter]

I'm pretty pessimistic about the future - getting a good manager, getting rid of the owners etc.

However something I can't fully rationalise is why Dalglish is still on board and apparently actively involved in finding a replacement for Rafa. If things are as bad as I think I really can't understand why Dalglish is prepared to be associated. He's not daft and won't want to be linked with the demise of LFC and he will also know that if he walked / or spoke out against the owners and board it would add enormous pressure making RBS even more edgy.

This makes me think there's obviously more to the situation than I can see.

Because him and Purslow are buddies (and have been for years), if you believe some of the press reports / rumours

The rumours go that it was Purslow and NOT Rafa who brought him back to the club and that Kenny has been advising Purslow / the board accordingly on Rafa's performance