West Ham post-match

[ronanm]

People like me who cant make an objective decision - flmao do me a favour Arn

I've slated Gerrard for his role in getting Rafa sacked

I've often said he aint a central midfielder

I've suggested that we should not play him or Meireles in the same team

I suggested he didnt look fit

I have stated he hasnt performed well enough for almost 2 years

The only thing I would question is his desire to play for LFC

As Darkon has posted him in the stands cheering on goals and whincing when Cole missed the sitter mid-week does not suggest that he is a player who has his mind elsewhere

In fact you could argue that Gerrard is probably BETTER when he has had such speculation surrounding him

Maybe hes feeling too comfortable and settled but I think to accuse him of not being committed to the club is absolute bollocks

Agreed. Looking at Torres, we should give SG a f*cking break - it looks like he is going to spend his whole career here ffs

[Arn]

Arn you are making yourself look a total tit

Name me many players who gave their all last season for Rafa?

I think you could comfortably count them on one hand and have fingers spare

Ask the same question about life under Roy - again you'd have fingers spare on one hand

Kenny has managed us for about a dozen games?

Gerrard has probably only figured in about 3 of them

Do me a ****ing favour

I will always have the opinion that Gerrard wanted to leave before this season. If he really wanted to stay then he would have said so BEFORE the world cup. Now it looks like he wanted to wait and see what options that was available.

If Real had made a bid then I'm almost 100% sure that he would have left. Can you say that you are almost 100% sure that he would have turned them down?

Players that always gave 100% last season?

Reina, Insua, Agger, Mascherano, Kuyt, Kelly(the game he played), Skrtel and Lucas.

[Lecter]

He is the type of player i reckon that - if we were a good team, we had Carroll up top on form, a pacy winger causing the opposition defence problems, gerrard playing well, agger coming out of defence with the ball etc, then all of a sudden Suarez will look ****ing world class because space will open up and he clearly has something about him - but right now, yesterday for example, the oppostion defence only had to worry about suarez and give him no time in space, because we didn't offer one single threat any where else on the ****ing pitch

Agree in part with this

One thing that has REALLY ****ed me off the last few games is our general decision making in the final third

Its ****ing absolutely shocking and its not just down to one specific player (although Kuyt has been as guilty as any). Two clear examples stick in mind yesterday. We broke in the first half Kelly brought the ball out and cut inside to attack their back four. Gerrard made a run outside him and was in acres of space and had a free run into the box/on goal. Yet Kelly just tried a glory ball to Suarez and it broke down

Same thing happened the other side with Wilson and I think Johnson made the run overlapping

Then the odd occasion when we do get into those positions it has been Kuyt and when an easy/simple ball is needed hes been unable to make the pass

Contrast that to Suarez's moment of quality turns the player and his decision making and the ball he played across for Johnson was top quality

[Reece]

I will always have the opinion that Gerrard wanted to leave before this season. If he really wanted to stay then he would have said so BEFORE the world cup. Now it looks like he wanted to wait and see what options that was available.

If Real had made a bid then I'm almost 100% sure that he would have left. Can you say that you are almost 100% sure that he would have turned them down?

Players that always gave 100% last season?

Reina, Insua, Agger, Mascherano, Kuyt, Kelly(the game he played), Skrtel and Lucas.

We can only dream that Gerrard would be as committed to Liverpool as Mascherano was....

[Arn]

Players that gave 100% under Roy?

Reina, Agger, Lucas, Skrtel, Kelly, Kuyt and Shelvey.

[Darkon]

We can only dream that Gerrard would be as committed to Liverpool as Mascherano was....

[Lecter]

I will always have the opinion that Gerrard wanted to leave before this season. If he really wanted to stay then he would have said so BEFORE the world cup. Now it looks like he wanted to wait and see what options that was available.

If Real had made a bid then I'm almost 100% sure that he would have left. Can you say that you are almost 100% sure that he would have turned them down?

Players that always gave 100% last season?

Reina, Insua, Agger, Mascherano, Kuyt, Kelly(the game he played), Skrtel and Lucas.

Reina ok

Mascherano sulked for the first part of last season because he never got a move to Barcelona

Agger, Kuyt and Lucas I'd probably agree with

Kelly played like two games or something last season I thought Skrtel was ****ing shocking last season mentally he was shot

Seriously Arn have a word with yourself

[Arn]

We can only dream that Gerrard would be as committed to Liverpool as Mascherano was....

If you forget about the off the pitch thing then who of them would you say showed last season with actions on the pitch that he was the most committed player of them?

My answer would be Mascherano by some distance.

[Lecter]

Players that gave 100% under Roy?

Reina, Agger, Lucas, Skrtel, Kelly, Kuyt and Shelvey.

FLMAO - Agger??

When the **** did he play under Roy

Ditto for Shelvey

Seriously get a grip of yourself

[Lecter]

If you forget about the off the pitch thing then who of them would you say showed last season with actions on the pitch that he was the most committed player of them?

My answer would be Mascherano by some distance.

That just shows how little you actually watch

He ****ing sulked the first few months when his move to Barcelona didnt materialise

One player stood out like a sore thumb last season for commitment and desire

Reina

[PTP]

Agree in part with this

One thing that has REALLY ****ed me off the last few games is our general decision making in the final third

Its ****ing absolutely shocking and its not just down to one specific player (although Kuyt has been as guilty as any). Two clear examples stick in mind yesterday. We broke in the first half Kelly brought the ball out and cut inside to attack their back four. Gerrard made a run outside him and was in acres of space and had a free run into the box/on goal. Yet Kelly just tried a glory ball to Suarez and it broke down

Same thing happened the other side with Wilson and I think Johnson made the run overlapping

Then the odd occasion when we do get into those positions it has been Kuyt and when an easy/simple ball is needed hes been unable to make the pass

Contrast that to Suarez's moment of quality turns the player and his decision making and the ball he played across for Johnson was top quality

exactly - we lack class or quality and it's why torres looked so isolated and it's why suarez struggled and was in and out of the game

the positives were suarez looked capable of some moments of sheer magic - he is so quick to turn and open up space - but he needs help - i think the kelly bit you mention iirc he actuall cut inside and shot instead of rolling it out to gerrard on the over lap.

Kuyt - first touch and decision making is terrible which doesn't help - but i agree it almost feels like every time we attack we make the wrong decisions - and that for me is purely down to lack of ability or class in most cases, and lack of confidence in others

[Arn]

Reina ok

Mascherano sulked for the first part of last season because he never got a move to Barcelona

Agger, Kuyt and Lucas I'd probably agree with

Kelly played like two games or something last season I thought Skrtel was ****ing shocking last season mentally he was shot

Seriously Arn have a word with yourself

and Gerrard sulked the whole of last season and a big part of this one.......

Start to show with actions on the pitch that you are committed. That would help. Right now he is Mr sulk on the pitch. He could be Mr Fantastic if he changed his attitude.

[Arn]

That just shows how little you actually watch

He ****ing sulked the first few months when his move to Barcelona didnt materialise

One player stood out like a sore thumb last season for commitment and desire

Reina

I see that you didn't answer the question.

Most committed player last season on the pitch, Gerrard or Mascherano?

[Lecter]

exactly - we lack class or quality and it's why torres looked so isolated and it's why suarez struggled and was in and out of the game

the positives were suarez looked capable of some moments of sheer magic - he is so quick to turn and open up space - but he needs help - i think the kelly bit you mention iirc he actuall cut inside and shot instead of rolling it out to gerrard on the over lap.

Kuyt - first touch and decision making is terrible which doesn't help - but i agree it almost feels like every time we attack we make the wrong decisions - and that for me is purely down to lack of ability or class in most cases, and lack of confidence in others

Yeah it might have been a shot from Kelly

It stood out for me but they are inexperienced lads so maybe there is a slight excuse for them but there were other moments from more senior players and I thought the lack of vision was mindblowing

[Lecter]

I see that you didn't answer the question.

Most committed player last season on the pitch, Gerrard or Mascherano?

Second half of the season was Mascherano but first half there was little or no difference

But you are singling out Gerrard when there were a lot more than just him

Same this season under Roy but again you will single out him

Even some of the ones you have used as being committed under Roy only played 1 or 2 games - flmao do me a ****ing favour

FACT is more than just Gerrard have been guilty of this

Equally you cant criticise his performances under Kenny because hes played in so few

Its hard to actually form an opinion based on someones commitment based on a couple of games under a manager especially as hes come back from suspension / injury so his fitness levels are also in doubt

You could also argue that someone like Meireles showed zero commitment under Roy and bucketloads under Kenny until the last few games when again you could question whether its fitness levels or lack of desire or BOTH