Liverpool v Wigan Post Match Thread

[Muddled]

So do you think Kenny is the right man to take us to the next level?

Honestly? I don't know. Part of me would like to think so and that's probably my heart.

My head says the results don't tell the full story (I've spoke about this at length), but yes - there are clearly issues. For me, it is around how fragile we are; I think we have a lot of confidence players who are low on self-belief, I think the cup runs have had an adverse effect on the players with some thinking ahead to a starting spot as apposed to earning it and I think the fact we are impotent upfront has created a tension in our play. I think the latter has a big part to play in our season.

If I look at the season so far, we've been singing the praises of Clarke for our shape and we've praised Kenny for our transition from back to front, but it just hasn't happened in front of goal - imagine a heavy foot or the pressure to put the ball in the back of the net after six months of build-up? Hell, from 12 yards we've seen our best players buckle.

For every statement that Roy had a similar win-rate, our football was turgid.

For every statement that Rafa was sacked for a similar position, it was in his sixth season after he experienced a difficult bedding-in first season.

Relating it to the above, Kenny deserves a period of time to continue to implement his vision and he deserves our patience, because we know football results can't be generated out of the fact we are Liverpool Football Club. We're gonna have to earn them and we are gonna have to develop a habit of winning when playing poorly, but if we can't win when we're playing well imagine how tough it is to get your head around that.

**** it, I'm fully in Kenny's corner.

[S-RED]

I can't believe that some people fail to contextualise our season. We've completely ****ed up the league but if we win the two other domestic cups we'd have had a good season.

fantasy, we are an awful side, ffs sheff wed got to two cup finals in one season once.......

[Craig_H]

Honestly? I don't know. Part of me would like to think so and that's probably my heart.

My head says the results don't tell the full story (I've spoke about this at length), but yes - there are clearly issues. For me, it is around how fragile we are; I think we have a lot of confidence players who are low on self-belief, I think the cup runs have had an adverse effect on the players with some thinking ahead to a starting spot as apposed to earning it and I think the fact we are impotent upfront has created a tension in our play. I think the latter has a big part to play in our season.

If I look at the season so far, we've been singing the praises of Clarke for our shape and we've praised Kenny for our transition from back to front, but it just hasn't happened in front of goal - imagine a heavy foot or the pressure to put the ball in the back of the net after six months of build-up? Hell, from 12 yards we've seen our best players buckle.

For every statement that Roy had a similar win-rate, our football was turgid.

For every statement that Rafa was sacked for a similar position, it was in his sixth season after he experienced a difficult bedding-in first season.

Relating it to the above, Kenny deserves a period of time to continue to implement his vision and he deserves our patience, because we know football results can't be generated out of the fact we are Liverpool Football Club. We're gonna have to earn them and we are gonna have to develop a habit of winning when playing poorly, but if we can't win when we're playing well imagine how tough it is to get your head around that.

**** it, I'm fully in Kenny's corner.

Cracking post. There's always going to be ups and downs, and we'll have our doubts but it's about faith, nailing colours to the mast and having the courage to stick with the guy through the bad times. Through the wind and the rain, no?

I dont know this for a fact obviously but it really seriously wouldnt be remotely surprising to me if we had an excellent summer and started playing some wonderful and exciting football again into next season.

[Slinky Skills]

The thing is Slinky that over 75m has been already spent on the players that supposed to fullfill those requirements and bring us good quality all around and Carroll cannot even start, Hendo had 1 assist and 1 goal so far, Downing 2 goals and 1 assist in all competitions and Adam is squaddie at best.

FFS ****ing Newcastle spent less what we paid for Downing alone to get Ba, Papa Cisse, Cabaye and Tiote and every single one of them would walk into our team..

35 mill of that will come good at some point.

Henderson has quality no doubt about it, Downing I'm not too sure of think he may have been a mistake.

It is a love of money but if you balance Henderson's signing against that of Caroll I think potentially he could become a real talent.

[Exiled_red]

I just want this season to be over

[Daniel 7]

Fact is, I don't want us to be a good cup team. I want us to be a great league team.

The only cup I give two hoots about is the European Cup. Seems like a lot of Liverpool fans have adjusted sights to Hodgson.

League first, cups are a nice addition, but they are no barometer for how well a club is doing. Realistically, we could equal Birmingham's trophy haul from last season. They were relegated.

[Craig_H]

Fact is, I don't want us to be a good cup team. I want us to be a great league team.

The only cup I give two hoots about is the European Cup. Seems like a lot of Liverpool fans have adjusted sights to Hodgson.

League first, cups are a nice addition, but they are no barometer for how well a club is doing. Realistically, we could equal Birmingham's trophy haul from last season. They were relegated.

Difference is, it takes time to build a side that can challenge in the league. If we can do that while winning cups along the way, i honestly cant see what's to complain about.

In fact, having gone 6 years without a trophy and us all seemingly gagging to win one, i'm amazed at how dismissive people have suddenly become at the prospect of winning 2 in one season.

[Daniel 7]

Two cup wins will mean a lot more than just a Carling Cup, granted.

We haven't won the FA Cup yet though, and on the form we are showing in the league, nor should we take it as a given that we should win it.

This is a bit chicken and egg really.

[Mostar]

Neither one of Cabaye nor Tiote would get in our team when people are fit. That's like us saying Henderson and Adam would get in Newcastle's team, when Cabaye and Tiote are injured.

And Papa Cisse has been here 2 minutes, slight exaggeration. Ba would get in our team to play with Suarez, Cisse wouldnt.

All 4 could find their way in our best 11 even if we have everybody healthy.

I'd play Cabaye over Hendo any day, who is regular starter for us, Tiote is very close in quality to Lucas (not better but many would put them in very close contention), Ba as you said would make it and I'd play Cisse over Carroll too as he has more in his game than Carroll, which really doesn't matter if he has been here short time or not.

Let me go further to say that I'd take Ben Arfa over Downing too and he too only cost 5m.

My point in all this was that we spank 75m on players that are not LFC quality and mostly like they will never do and Kenny and Comolli have to responsible for those calls.

That's all.

[Craig_H]

There's no doubt we need to do a lot in the league and improve, but as i said that will take time. And there will indeed be downs as well as ups along the way. But as i also said, if we can compete for/win cups en-route, then which LFC could complain about that?

[Craig_H]

All 4 could find their way in our best 11 even if we have everybody healthy.

I'd play Cabaye over Hendo any day, who is regular starter for us, Tiote is very close in quality to Lucas (not better but many would put them in very close contention), Ba as you said would make it and I'd play Cisse over Carroll too as he has more in his game than Carroll, which really doesn't matter if he has been here short time or not.

Let me go further to say that I'd take Ben Arfa over Downing too and he too only cost 5m.

My point in all this was that we spank 75m on players that are not LFC quality and mostly like they will never do and Kenny and Comolli have to responsible for those calls.

That's all.

No they couldnt. Lucas and Gerrard in CM. Suarez and Ba upfront. No place for Tiote, Cabaye or Cisse.

[Vermilion]

How realsistic is being title contenders on a consistant basis though in the near future?

Arsenal are set for years financially now with their new stadium well on the way to being paid for, Chavski will always spend, City! well..say no more!

It's going to be very difficult indeed for us to become consistant title contenders in the next 3 seasons, it will take some extremely canny management, a lot of luck, and a transfer kitty as big as is possible or affordable.

[Exiled_red]

Difference is, it takes time to build a side that can challenge in the league. If we can do that while winning cups along the way, i honestly cant see what's to complain about.

In fact, having gone 6 years without a trophy and us all seemingly gagging to win one, i'm amazed at how dismissive people have suddenly become at the prospect of winning 2 in one season.

I think if we were doing better in the league people would be much more excited. Personally I'm finding it difficult to get excited because we are playing so badly I don't expect us to win any games at the moment. I think things are looking negative at the moment so we look at everything in a negative light. If things were more positive people would look at everything in a more positive light and be more excited about winning things.

[danperkins]

All 4 could find their way in our best 11 even if we have everybody healthy.

I'd play Cabaye over Hendo any day, who is regular starter for us, Tiote is very close in quality to Lucas (not better but many would put them in very close contention), Ba as you said would make it and I'd play Cisse over Carroll too as he has more in his game than Carroll, which really doesn't matter if he has been here short time or not.

Let me go further to say that I'd take Ben Arfa over Downing too and he too only cost 5m.

My point in all this was that we spank 75m on players that are not LFC quality and mostly like they will never do and Kenny and Comolli have to responsible for those calls.

That's all.

great post

[Muddled]

in rafas first season, we were totally up and down in the league but we had something to believe in. We knew he didnt have the players he wanted because he only signed luis garcia and xabi alonso. Kenny has spend well in excess of £100m in 15 months and signed eight or so players.

Rafa couldnt really play the way he wanted but we still won the CL. We knew he wanted to play a game based on pressing high up the pitch and attacking teams with pace and intensity.

When you see kennys teams play football, do you actually understand the tactics because i dont. I genuinely dont understand where we're going as a team and how we're supposed to play. All i see is a load of our players constantly bunched together waiting for something to happen.

There doesnt seem to be a set method of play, the full backs dont know what to do with the ball and how to link in with their attackers. Midfield is too static, we're too slow moving the ball forward and we play people out of position all the time and then call them ****.

I dont see a lot of promise going forward and a carling cup victory that we almost blew against cardiff wont be papering over any cracks.

Why can't you believe in Kenny this season?

We won a trophy, a chance of another and have played some great football in spells this season. Yes, Rafa won the CL in his first year, but we only knew of the style of his play from his time at Valencia - zonal marking was being questioned, we were susceptible from set-pieces and we didn't quite know what formation we were playing or what team to expect.

When you see kennys teams play football, do you actually understand the tactics because i dont. I genuinely dont understand where we're going as a team and how we're supposed to play. All i see is a load of our players constantly bunched together waiting for something to happen.

I do think there is a method to our play, I just think it's a lazy statement we use it as a stick to beat Kenny with after a defeat.