Progress

[Marclfc]

We fans might and probably do but that's based more on ignorance about what is really going on than anything else. At the top level I suspect it's a complicated game. Unless you're Bronto Bodge.

That's not to say any particular game for any particular team is complicated but the variations in tactics across different matches probably make it a lot more complicated than we recognise. We don't know what their tactical set-up is for a game so we don't easily see if it has been nullified by the opposition's tactics. All we know is that things aren't working and the team looks crap yet last week they demolished their opponents. So we read it as the players aren't trying, they've got no passion, they haven't turned up, blah, blah...

I'm reminded of the story at Valencia when the new coach came in after Benitez left. A defender said - How do you want us to set up in defence?

- Just as you did under Benitez.

- He got us playing six different systems. Which one do you want for this game?

Benitez was a master tactician and knew how to set up and also grind out results when needed. Brendan leaves us open in midfield with his set up at times and while I'm not just blaming him, there is something that leaves us disjointed between midfield and defence, I don't know if it's the fullbacks playing further forward leaving Lucas just too much to do but he's less effective since he came back but that could be to do with his fitness.

[Neil Young]

So your conclusion is that we need more tactical sophistication, not less, in which case I agree wholeheartedly.

[Marclfc]

So your conclusion is that we need more tactical sophistication, not less, in which case I agree wholeheartedly.

Yep pretty much

[Mattshark]

Benitez was a master tactician and knew how to set up and also grind out results when needed. Brendan leaves us open in midfield with his set up at times and while I'm not just blaming him, there is something that leaves us disjointed between midfield and defence, I don't know if it's the fullbacks playing further forward leaving Lucas just too much to do but he's less effective since he came back but that could be to do with his fitness.

I think a major difference that should not be ignored here is that Rafa also had a much stronger squad to work with.

[Marclfc]

I think a major difference that should not be ignored here is that Rafa also had a much stronger squad to work with.

Very true! I was just meaning that while rafa had a great set up as in not conceding many we also rarely scored lots in games, I meant that I'd like Rodgers to find that balance between defence and attack and as I said on another thread I'd like somebody in to work on that side of things, maybe carra?

[Aj34]

I think a major difference that should not be ignored here is that Rafa also had a much stronger squad to work with.

Whilst I agree with that isn't it also partly his fault that we don't have such a great squad now

[Mattshark]

Whilst I agree with that isn't it also partly his fault that we don't have such a great squad now

Not really. He can't be blamed for Kenny and Roy's awful transfers. Summer 2011 was the biggest killer IMO, we threw so much away on buying substandard players.

[Marclfc]

Not really. He can't be blamed for Kenny and Roy's awful transfers. Summer 2011 was the biggest killer IMO, we threw so much away on buying substandard players.

Yep I agree with that but Benitez did mess the team up in his final years but that could be partly his fault and the fact the club was in turmoil, no secret in the targets he had and the ****e he had to settle for!

[Neil Young]

I don't think any blame can be levelled at Benitez except possibly over his handling of Alonso. And even then I think his fault is usually overstated because people choose to believe Alonso's version of events since they like him as a player.

I realise defending Benitez like that will annoy the usual suspect but that's just a lucky coincidence for me.

[Marclfc]

I don't think any blame can be levelled at Benitez except possibly over his handling of Alonso. And even then I think his fault is overstated.

He wasted his fair share of cash in the market but he did bring some quality also, I think he can take some of the blame but he was caught in a wrangle between the cowboys and broken promises...

[Aj34]

I'm certainly not going to attack rafa. Love the bloke but he did have his faults. There was a good interview with henchoz. On talksport a few weeks back said his man management was very poor

[Neil Young]

He wasted his fair share of cash in the market but he did bring some quality also, I think he can take some of the blame but he was caught in a wrangle between the cowboys and broken promises...

That's exactly why he can't be held responsible. He simply wasn't backed properly after signing Torres. No manager gets all the signings right even when they do get their targets and he didn't.

It was much the same pattern with Hicks's handling of the Texas Rangers - a big money signing (Rodriguez) followed by steady and unsustainable milking of the club leading towards financial and sporting collapse before being rescued by outsiders.

[Marclfc]

That's exactly why he can't be held responsible. He simply wasn't backed properly after signing Torres. No manager gets all the signings right even when they do get their targets and he didn't.

It was much the same pattern with Hicks's handling of the Texas Rangers - a big money signing (Rodriguez) followed by steady and unsustainable milking of the club leading towards financial and sporting collapse before being rescued by outsiders.

Totally agree but his stubbornness and his stand off approach to the players was a big concern and I think due to pressures as we talked about I think he made some strange choices kind of lost the plot in the end, don't get me wrong, I love the guy and gave me many happy visits to anfield but like andy said he had his faults...

[Nick77]

He wasted his fair share of cash in the market but he did bring some quality also, I think he can take some of the blame but he was caught in a wrangle between the cowboys and broken promises...

True but always moved those players on for at least what he paid, sometimes more...

[Neil Young]

I don't for a moment think he was perfect and I'm sure he could have been better at some things - the man management thing does ring true (although frankly I think some of these so-called professionals need to act more that way). But his strengths far outweighed his weaknesses and really it was only his tactical acumen that made up for the weaknesses (at first inherited, later imposed by the cowboys' mismanagement) in the squad throughout his time at LFC.