Selling Crouch?

[dww]

red g, I agree with the sentiment but in general feel that all world class players have to be good players for the team. Ultimately this is what means that players like Zidane have incredibly successful careers. I find it hard to think of a player who most people would agree was world class who doesn't put in the work for the team.

I guess the point is that you need the right player to do the job you require. Crouch certainly did that last season. If he is to remain the right player as our team improves then he needs to add more goals to his game.

[Laz]

Why do 'supporters' feel the need to insult current players based on their appearance? Why are people so selective when quoting statistics? Why, instead of constructive argument, do some threads degrade into petty name-calling and one-upmanship? (ooer).

The facts are;

1. Peter Crouch was an integral part of our improvement last season. We achieved our highest Premiership points total with him, not in spite of him.

2. He is tall.

True, he is by no means quick or a prolific striker but does add to the team in other areas. His hold-up play is good and did contribute our defensive performance. 'Not what we want from a striker' you might say but this is how Rafa wants the team to work and that's the main thing. It's no good us saying he's crap because of his strike rate because in the end it's how well he plays the role the manager has assigned to him that counts. Rafa seems quite happy with him and, for now at least, that'll do for me.

[Shaggy]

Why do 'supporters' feel the need to insult current players based on their appearance? Why are people so selective when quoting statistics? Why, instead of constructive argument, do some threads degrade into petty name-calling and one-upmanship? (ooer).

The facts are;

1. Peter Crouch was an integral part of our improvement last season. We achieved our highest Premiership points total with him, not in spite of him.

2. He is tall.

True, he is by no means quick or a prolific striker but does add to the team in other areas. His hold-up play is good and did contribute our defensive performance. 'Not what we want from a striker' you might say but this is how Rafa wants the team to work and that's the main thing. It's no good us saying he's crap because of his strike rate because in the end it's how well he plays the role the manager has assigned to him that counts. Rafa seems quite happy with him and, for now at least, that'll do for me.

[red g]

Why do 'supporters' feel the need to insult current players based on their appearance? Why are people so selective when quoting statistics? Why, instead of constructive argument, do some threads degrade into petty name-calling and one-upmanship? (ooer).

The facts are;

1. Peter Crouch was an integral part of our improvement last season. We achieved our highest Premiership points total with him, not in spite of him.

2. He is tall.

True, he is by no means quick or a prolific striker but does add to the team in other areas. His hold-up play is good and did contribute our defensive performance. 'Not what we want from a striker' you might say but this is how Rafa wants the team to work and that's the main thing. It's no good us saying he's crap because of his strike rate because in the end it's how well he plays the role the manager has assigned to him that counts. Rafa seems quite happy with him and, for now at least, that'll do for me.

good post

[Rosco]

The facts are;

1. Peter Crouch was an integral part of our improvement last season.

That's not a fact. That's merely an opinion. If you read my earlier post there's a whole host of reasons why we improved. Peter Crouch was not integral to our improvement last season.

[Laz]

It is a fact because he played in most of our Premiership games. I didn't say he was the sole reason for the improvement.

integral; adjective
necessary and important as a part of, or contained within, a whole.

[mark1975]

He was. People go on about his assist rate, to assist you need to have the final touch, but he was directly involved in a whole chunk of our goals last season.

He's not great mind, but anyone who thinks we finished 3rd and improved our points tally so dramatically, WITHOUT him being a major factor in it all, is wide of the mark.

[Shaggy]

It is a fact because he played in most of our Premiership games. I didn't say he was the sole reason for the improvement.

integral; adjective
necessary and important as a part of, or contained within, a whole.

Correct.

[Delinquent]

It is a fact because he played in most of our Premiership games. I didn't say he was the sole reason for the improvement.

integral; adjective
necessary and important as a part of, or contained within, a whole.

Posting a definition of "integral" still doesn't make your assertion any more than an opinion. There's nothing to suggest that we wouldn't have improved equally, had we made the other improvements that Rosco highlighted. Crouch's job was done nothing more than adequately, and even that is debatable. It is perfectly reasonable to suggest that the same job could have been done as well, if not better, by a whole host of other mediocre players.

It's true however, that his role was "necessary" for our improvement, but we shouldn't let that confuse us into thinking that he is of sufficient quality to lead a Liverpool front line.

[Laz]

Posting a definition of "integral" still doesn't make your assertion any more than an opinion. There's nothing to suggest that we wouldn't have improved equally, had we made the other improvements that Rosco highlighted. Crouch's job was done nothing more than adequately, and even that is debatable. It is perfectly reasonable to suggest that the same job could have been done as well, if not better, by a whole host of other mediocre players.

It's true however, that his role was "necessary" for our improvement, but we shouldn't let that confuse us into thinking that he is of sufficient quality to lead a Liverpool front line.

I posted a definition because it confirmed my point that it was a fact.

It was not my opinion that we improved last year, neither was it my opinion that Peter Crouch played in 31 Premiership games. Therefore Peter Crouch was necessary and important as a part of, or contained within the team that improved last season.

I was not talking about a hypothetical situation involving another nonexistent player, I was talking about what actually happened.

[Delinquent]

I posted a definition because it confirmed my point that it was a fact.

It was not my opinion that we improved last year, neither was it my opinion that Peter Crouch played in 31 Premiership games. Therefore Peter Crouch was necessary and important as a part of, or contained within the team that improved last season.

I was not talking about a hypothetical situation involving another nonexistent player, I was talking about what actually happened.

It confirmed nothing, I'm afraid. It's still an opinion as the answer is entirely subjective. I would post a definition but I don't think that's necessary.

Besides, I wasn't trying to be confrontational. I was merely pointing out that Crouch is an average player, who made nothing more than an adequate contribution.

[jonymadness]

I really cant believe some of the stuff on this, BUT, everyone is entitled to their opinion.

In my opinion, Crouch was one of our best players last season and we had a lot of good performers last year. OK so he has no pace and he isn't a goal scorer. Does anyone really think that Rafa is not aware of that? Rafa takes a very scientific approach to the game, he looks at it from every angle, he saw an area we were lacking in the year before and he purchased a player for that role.

Cisse, Moro, Baros, FSP, ALT, Mellor - not one of them can hold up the ball and bring their teamates into play, Crouch can. Would Stevie have scored so many goals last year without Peter? Think of his two goals against Newcastle. Perfect example of what Crouch gives us. For all the talk of Rooney and Owen and Walcott in the WC, Crouch showed in the 30 mins he played against Portugal how to play with 10 men, he held up the ball well and brought his teamates into play.

One other point is that he seems to get on with everyone and all the lads seem to have great time for him. Do not underestimate the importance of that type of player in the dressing room.

Rafa has shown he is not afraid to admit he was wrong and move players on if he thinks they're not up to it or he can get someone better - I believe that he won't be moving Crouchy on anytime soon.

[red g]

I really cant believe some of the stuff on this, BUT, everyone is entitled to their opinion.

In my opinion, Crouch was one of our best players last season and we had a lot of good performers last year. OK so he has no pace and he isn't a goal scorer. Does anyone really think that Rafa is not aware of that? Rafa takes a very scientific approach to the game, he looks at it from every angle, he saw an area we were lacking in the year before and he purchased a player for that role.

Cisse, Moro, Baros, FSP, ALT, Mellor - not one of them can hold up the ball and bring their teamates into play, Crouch can. Would Stevie have scored so many goals last year without Peter? Think of his two goals against Newcastle. Perfect example of what Crouch gives us. For all the talk of Rooney and Owen and Walcott in the WC, Crouch showed in the 30 mins he played against Portugal how to play with 10 men, he held up the ball well and brought his teamates into play.

One other point is that he seems to get on with everyone and all the lads seem to have great time for him. Do not underestimate the importance of that type of player in the dressing room.

Rafa has shown he is not afraid to admit he was wrong and move players on if he thinks they're not up to it or he can get someone better - I believe that he won't be moving Crouchy on anytime soon.

fantastic post

[jonymadness]

fantastic post

I live to give...

[Shaggy]

I really cant believe some of the stuff on this, BUT, everyone is entitled to their opinion.

In my opinion, Crouch was one of our best players last season and we had a lot of good performers last year. OK so he has no pace and he isn't a goal scorer. Does anyone really think that Rafa is not aware of that? Rafa takes a very scientific approach to the game, he looks at it from every angle, he saw an area we were lacking in the year before and he purchased a player for that role.

Cisse, Moro, Baros, FSP, ALT, Mellor - not one of them can hold up the ball and bring their teamates into play, Crouch can. Would Stevie have scored so many goals last year without Peter? Think of his two goals against Newcastle. Perfect example of what Crouch gives us. For all the talk of Rooney and Owen and Walcott in the WC, Crouch showed in the 30 mins he played against Portugal how to play with 10 men, he held up the ball well and brought his teamates into play.

One other point is that he seems to get on with everyone and all the lads seem to have great time for him. Do not underestimate the importance of that type of player in the dressing room.

Rafa has shown he is not afraid to admit he was wrong and move players on if he thinks they're not up to it or he can get someone better - I believe that he won't be moving Crouchy on anytime soon.

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