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-   -   Nat Phillips (https://www.est1892.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=91115)

Jaco_Pastorious 11-03-21 01:07 PM

Who he reminded me of last night was a less dirty version of Harry Maguire.

Phillips plays in a very similar manner to Maguire and to my eyes has a lot of similar qualities and similar limitations to Maguire. Just without the massive price tag.

Makes me wonder could we flog him to some team as the next Maguire

Bound to be some club that would throw 15 to 20 million at us for a CL proven CB :D

Hell we bought dross like Diouf on the back of less good games than Phillips has had.

Slinky Skills 11-03-21 01:21 PM

Can't believe people want to flog him. I really want us to keep him, yes he's raw and not the quickest but he's a fucking tough, brave big unit of a lad and he's exactly what we need. He inspired so much confidence in the defence last night, literally cleared everything. I really hope we keep him and he scores in front of the Kop next year. I will be ecstatic if he does and will be doing a Klopp Triple fist pump when he does haha!

frank the tank 11-03-21 01:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slinky Skills (Post 3701430)
Can't believe people want to flog him. I really want us to keep him, yes he's raw and not the quickest but he's a fucking tough, brave big unit of a lad and he's exactly what we need. He inspired so much confidence in the defence last night, literally cleared everything. I really hope we keep him and he scores in front of the Kop next year. I will be ecstatic if he does and will be doing a Klopp Triple fist pump when he does haha!

:handshake:

could be a cult hero for sure......

Also, put Stephen fuckin Hawking (before he died) next to Virgil and he'd be a better defender than 75% of the league! Put Nat in with a fully fit team and I'm sure he'd be fine

Jaco_Pastorious 11-03-21 01:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slinky Skills (Post 3701430)
Can't believe people want to flog him. I really want us to keep him, yes he's raw and not the quickest but he's a fucking tough, brave big unit of a lad and he's exactly what we need. He inspired so much confidence in the defence last night, literally cleared everything. I really hope we keep him and he scores in front of the Kop next year. I will be ecstatic if he does and will be doing a Klopp Triple fist pump when he does haha!


He played well last night and it is not the first time he has turned in a good performance of late, but I would also say that he is a player that we could upgrade upon easily enough and right now he is certainly putting himself in the shop window every time he tuns in a good 90 minutes.


Now if he is still with us next season I would not be upset, but if he was playing for another club right now I do not think he would be anywhere near being signed by us.

kev776 11-03-21 01:34 PM

I wonder if Davies is any better, it would be nice to find out. Klopp knows Philips intimately and still went out and signed both Kazbak and Davies. There must be a reason he thinks Philips is not the answer.

Jaco_Pastorious 11-03-21 01:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kev776 (Post 3701438)
I wonder if Davies is any better, it would be nice to find out. Klopp knows Philips intimately and still went out and signed both Kazbak and Davies. There must be a reason he thinks Philips is not the answer.


Curious about that myself. I know nothing about Davies in terms of how good he is or is not, and pretty sure that even if I have seen him play for Preston in a cup game against a PL team that nothing stood out.

Given he is an experienced Championship player you would have to imagine that he should be at the same level or maybe above that of Phillips, Williams and maybe Kabak although Kabak despite being only 20 has more top flight experience than any of them.

Do agree with your point about Klopp bringing in two CBs as well rather than going straight to using Phillips and maybe bringing in only one CB as cover.

On paper I thought Davies might bring a nice balance to the back line what with him being a natural left footer given Kabak and Phillips are right footers but last night I thought Kabak looked very comfortable on the left side and he played quite a few passes, many of them long passes, with his left foot.

wiw 11-03-21 02:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Buzzo (Post 3701416)
This appears to be a gross violation of internet protocols.

Sorry, but who asked you? Prick.





Better? :D:D

Buzzo 11-03-21 03:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wiw (Post 3701449)
Sorry, but who asked you? Prick.





Better? :D:D

:D Much better thankyou :handshake:

...Trying to amicably work your way through a disagreement FFS :rash: :rolleyes: :grr:

...Exactly who 'dya think you are?

Roboklopp 11-03-21 04:53 PM

Manfred Hoerbel
Mariusz Pudzianowsk
Marcus Fenix
Nat Phillips


Hmm...

frank the tank 11-03-21 04:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kev776 (Post 3701438)
I wonder if Davies is any better, it would be nice to find out. Klopp knows Philips intimately and still went out and signed both Kazbak and Davies. There must be a reason he thinks Philips is not the answer.

:chin:

:source:

:horse:

Jaco_Pastorious 11-03-21 05:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roboklopp (Post 3701483)
Manfred Hoerbel
Mariusz Pudzianowsk
Marcus Fenix
Nat Phillips


Hmm...

the do rag? Did not google the other two, but once you said Marcus Fenix it has to be the do rag :)

Exiled_red 11-03-21 05:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kev776 (Post 3701438)
I wonder if Davies is any better, it would be nice to find out. Klopp knows Philips intimately and still went out and signed both Kazbak and Davies. There must be a reason he thinks Philips is not the answer.

Davies was supposed to be quite promising no idea if he is better or worse than Phillips or Kabak, just gives us options. As much as we needed a CB part of me wonders if there is a financial aspect to the Davies deal as well, given how much we paid for him we could still presumably sell him for a profit even if he never kicks a ball for us. I hope I am wrong and we did sign him for footballing reasons and he turns out to be a good player, but I don't see all of Phillips, Davies and Kabak being here next season unless someone else is shipped out (as other wise we'd go from starting this season with 3 CBs to next with 6.

Roboklopp 11-03-21 05:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jaco_Pastorious (Post 3701486)
the do rag? Did not google the other two, but once you said Marcus Fenix it has to be the do rag :)

https://vikingstrength.com/wp-conten...ed-hoeberl.jpg

https://ironmind.com/export/sites/ir...es/pudz_lg.jpg

Given Chris Pena who was the art director for the proper Gears games was big into powerlifting it wouldnít surprise me if these guys were a design influence on the COG hero.

Jaco_Pastorious 11-03-21 05:45 PM

The Hero of Aphos Fields. :rock:

Roboklopp 11-03-21 05:47 PM

Don’t man. I could cry, the fucking abomination they made of Gears 5.

Jaco_Pastorious 12-03-21 12:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roboklopp (Post 3701505)
Donít man. I could cry, the fucking abomination they made of Gears 5.


Think the only thing wrong with Gears 5 was the legacy it had to live up to.

Same game with a different title is actually a decent game. That said I would love another game set in the classic Gears era, maybe even a game of one of the Karen Travis books that act as prequels/bridges between games.

vlahka 12-03-21 09:46 AM

Didn't realize he was 23. Never understood why we didnt use him more.

Norbs 12-03-21 09:59 AM

Probably because it was thought that he wasn't good enough, or that at the time we had much better options.

Roboklopp 12-03-21 10:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jaco_Pastorious (Post 3701562)
Think the only thing wrong with Gears 5 was the legacy it had to live up to.

Same game with a different title is actually a decent game. That said I would love another game set in the classic Gears era, maybe even a game of one of the Karen Travis books that act as prequels/bridges between games.

Perhaps it would have been serviceable, however would have been for a different demographic.

Given youíve mentioned Travis, youíve clearly a good knowledge of the universe. I donít think you can divorce the game from its prior context. For me the story, tone, art direction, characters and gameplay betrayed all that. They prostituted a well-formed universe with its own unique flavour and gravity and turned it into something colourful garish, overtly derivative and jokey to attract new players in doing so completely invalidated not only the game but spoiled the universe and its themes. Itís the Last Jedi of games.

Roboklopp 12-03-21 10:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Norbs (Post 3701581)
Probably because it was thought that he wasn't good enough, or that at the time we had much better options.

Aye we had fewer injuries and Lovren too. Heís not suited to how we want to play in ideal circumstances, but he definitely should have been given more chance earlier in our far from ideal ones!

frank the tank 12-03-21 11:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roboklopp (Post 3701589)
Aye we had fewer injuries and Lovren too. Heís not suited to how we want to play in ideal circumstances, but he definitely should have been given more chance earlier in our far from ideal ones!

I agree.

When everyone is fit though, I think he will still be useful in certain scenarios. Let's say we are a goal or two up against a dogshit Sam Allardyce or Sean Dyche team.......then surely he will be a good option to throw on to help shore up the defence and see the game out.

npinn001 12-03-21 11:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by frank the tank (Post 3701595)
I agree.

When everyone is fit though, I think he will still be useful in certain scenarios. Let's say we are a goal or two up against a dogshit Sam Allardyce or Sean Dyche team.......then surely he will be a good option to throw on to help shore up the defence and see the game out.

I agree, the guy could do a job for sure. I think i read though (and it may be bollocks) that he was on a relatively high wedge and that could be an issue for renewing his contract (c£70/80/90k p/w).

On the flip side I doubt we would get an English CB (for the quota) for less than that and without a stupid fee, so keeping him makes sense in a lot of ways.

RedAndWhite 12-03-21 12:44 PM

He has proven to be reliable. Not spectacular or world class but reliable. Which ticks alot of boxes for a 5th/6th choice CB. And by the end of the season he will have a lot omore miles under his belt. The question then becomes would he be happy as a backup to the backups getting the odd game here and there or would he fancy a move down the league for more playing time.

BobTheCharmer 12-03-21 12:56 PM

Is this one of those cases whereby through chance and luck an unexpected opportunity has arisen and he's literally taken the bull by the horns and is playing above his level. If the confidence continues to grow he may carve out a decent career that but for the injury crisis may never of presented itself. I hope so. I like stories like this. So many players that are good honest pro's fall by the wayside these days as the chances to get a break in the team rarely come along. I don't think carragher would get a look in these days as he wasn't blessed with skills like a Gerrard. Attacking players will naturally get more opportunities as their ability stands out more.

red g 12-03-21 01:08 PM

I was shocked to read we are paying him 70k a week, that can't be correct or did Rick Parry come in for a day when Michael Edwards had a sickie

SB 12-03-21 01:11 PM

Can’t believe he’d be on a penny more than ~£30k

Buzzo 12-03-21 01:20 PM

If he has 'literally taken the bull by the horns', as Bob suggests it may explain why all the other defenders have been getting injured?

Shaggy 12-03-21 01:48 PM

:haha:


Fivex 12-03-21 01:56 PM

:haha::haha::haha::haha:

frank the tank 12-03-21 02:18 PM

no fuckin way is he on 70k per week.

If so, then people like Gini should be getting the 200k or whatever he wants......

Jaco_Pastorious 12-03-21 02:45 PM

Think it is just media/online crap that says he is on that much.

Not a hope a guy with so little playing time prior to the past few months is earning anything close to that.

Exiled_red 12-03-21 03:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by red g (Post 3701630)
I was shocked to read we are paying him 70k a week, that can't be correct or did Rick Parry come in for a day when Michael Edwards had a sickie

:haha: No way, more likely to be £7k a week

Jaco_Pastorious 12-03-21 03:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Exiled_red (Post 3701664)
:haha: No way, more likely to be £7k a week


Just looked at one of the so called "confirmed" wage lists for the 2019/20 season and Phillips is listed as being on 70k a week for last season.

TAA is listed as being on 60k a week, Gomez is on 70k a week, Milner is on 75k a week and so on :haha:

Not a hope that a ressie like Phillips is or was on the same wages as first team regulars.

S-RED 12-03-21 04:07 PM

hahaha not a fucking chance, 4.5k according to this

https://footballleaguefc.com/liverpo...-player-wages/

S-RED 12-03-21 04:09 PM

Dupe

Jaco_Pastorious 12-03-21 04:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by S-RED (Post 3701669)
hahaha not a fucking chance, 4.5k according to this

https://footballleaguefc.com/liverpo...-player-wages/


4.5k sounds closer to reality. :handshake:

Fivex 12-03-21 04:34 PM

Feel for him if he's smashing it on £4.5k when the likes of Tsimikas is getting 7x that for doing fuck all. I'm sure that's not what he's thinking about though.

Fivex 12-03-21 04:35 PM

Ojo is on 32k? Wtffff

vlahka 12-03-21 10:16 PM

Why are we saying he'd be great as a 4th/5th choice defender? I dont see why he cant be third, or even paired up with VVD at times. I'm tired of midfielders being put into our defenders spots when he can do just as well as they can if not better. Gomez is always broken and Kabak is still getting used to things but seems to be fine. Other than those two thats about it. I dont want to see Rhys taking Philip's spot anymore. Hes far too slow to be of any use to us in the long term.

Big-Red-Ed 12-03-21 10:24 PM

I had him down as marginally our second best player after Fabinho the other night in what was his CL debut in the last 16. I think he is performing way better than he is getting credit for. I'd happily play him against anyone. Obviously not 1st or 2nd choice but a keeper for me.

YNWA

SB 12-03-21 10:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Big-Red-Ed (Post 3701736)
I had him down as marginally our second best player after Fabinho the other night in what was his CL debut in the last 16. I think he is performing way better than he is getting credit for. I'd happily play him against anyone. Obviously not 1st or 2nd choice but a keeper for me.

YNWA

Totally agree. The jury is still out whether weíll keep Kabak next season but I suspect we will. Who knows if Joe will ever be the same player after his injuries , Joel is made of glass & unreliable & hereís hoping Virg comes back as good as he was prior to injury but thereís no guarantee that he will straight away. :handshake:

Scratch 12-03-21 11:00 PM

He'd be great alongside VVD against teams with a big target man, but not so great against teams with pacey frontmen...if he's happy to stay, on low wages, then I don't mind seeing him as 4th or 4th choice.

baitman 12-03-21 11:17 PM

How the doubters have flipped :crackoff:

danperkins 12-03-21 11:49 PM

Looking at that Matip, Ox, Shaq, Origi and Keita really need to up their game to find any sort of value for money.

Scratch 12-03-21 11:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by baitman (Post 3701741)
How the doubters have flipped :crackoff:

Thankfully, I don't think I've ever bad mouthed him :hug:

Fivex 13-03-21 12:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scratch (Post 3701740)
He'd be great alongside VVD against teams with a big target man, but not so great against teams with pacey frontmen...if he's happy to stay, on low wages, then I don't mind seeing him as 4th or 4th choice.



Have you considered he might be better suited to being 4th choice instead?

Jaco_Pastorious 13-03-21 12:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by baitman (Post 3701741)
How the doubters have flipped :crackoff:


Nope I still think he is doing well atm but that he is having a run of good games rather than being a good player of the level we need.

Would not be upset if he stays at the club but for me it would have to be as a 5th or 6th choice CB.

I think he could do very well at a Championship club that does not play a high line or at a PL club like Burnley, but I do not think he is good enough to be coming into our first team on a regular basis next season.

Be delighted if in a years time he is having a really good season helping us towards number 20 and this post comes back to haunt me, but I do not see that happening.

Irishnev 13-03-21 08:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jaco_Pastorious (Post 3701746)
Nope I still think he is doing well atm but that he is having a run of good games rather than being a good player of the level we need.

Would not be upset if he stays at the club but for me it would have to be as a 5th or 6th choice CB.

I think he could do very well at a Championship club that does not play a high line or at a PL club like Burnley, but I do not think he is good enough to be coming into our first team on a regular basis next season.

Be delighted if in a years time he is having a really good season helping us towards number 20 and this post comes back to haunt me, but I do not see that happening.

:handshake: Our game is based on a high line and the ability to either carry the ball (Gomez/Matip) out from the back or hit long cross field diagonals (VVD) to evade when we are pressed. Phillips is doing great but I saw some interesting stats vs RBL

He won the same amount of aerial duels as Mane (2) - he did make clearances

He lost the ball 34% of the time which is huge for a CB where pass completion is high 80s

This is where we need to be ruthless as a club and it has bitten us in the past. Nat is a great lad, honest, stick his head where you wouldnít put your boot type of player but our team doesnít need that. Both Matip and VVD win far more headers than him and they do all the stuff he canít do with pace and technical ability. We need to buy a CB like them and let them fight fir the right to play with VVD

We will never get more for Phillips than this summer (even in a depressed market) - he need to capitalize on that and let him play in a side that suits his abilities and where heíll be first choice

baitman 13-03-21 08:57 AM

Nev, even if it would be the best time to maximise any return on Nat you have to balance that with the lack of availability and durability of our other defence options.

Im not saying he is a worldie, just that he is half decent and committed, his stock is higher than matip, gomez and half of our midfield as he is bulletproof.

To sell him would mean bringing in at least 2 30m+ defenders as we cannot be sure Gomez will ever be truely fixed or if there is too much humidity for Joel Biscuits to risk it.

Irishnev 13-03-21 09:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by baitman (Post 3701756)
Nev, even if it would be the best time to maximise any return on Nat you have to balance that with the lack of availability and durability of our other defence options.

Im not saying he is a worldie, just that he is half decent and committed, his stock is higher than matip, gomez and half of our midfield as he is bulletproof.

To sell him would mean bringing in at least 2 30m+ defenders as we cannot be sure Gomez will ever be truely fixed or if there is too much humidity for Joel Biscuits to risk it.

I get that Baitman - if we are broke then keeping him as a 4th CB makes sense and play him where his skills are most suited. Iíd sell Matip as well and buy 2 CBs in an ideal world but I guess that wonít happen.

I donít want to come across as being totally disparaging to Nat because I love his attitude and am delighted with his recent performances. We just went down this road with Divock and didnít sell him when we could have maximised our return.

Exiled_red 13-03-21 10:13 AM

Now everyone is bigging him up he's going to go to shit isn't he

Norbs 13-03-21 10:30 AM

Standard :haha:

Irishnev 13-03-21 09:07 PM


baitman 13-03-21 11:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Irishnev (Post 3701757)
I get that Baitman - if we are broke then keeping him as a 4th CB makes sense and play him where his skills are most suited. Iíd sell Matip as well and buy 2 CBs in an ideal world but I guess that wonít happen.

I donít want to come across as being totally disparaging to Nat because I love his attitude and am delighted with his recent performances. We just went down this road with Divock and didnít sell him when we could have maximised our return.

Divock has had many chances to finally show be has the balls and the results are in :sigh:

I think Nat is a good option that we already have, if we had paid 20m for him we'd be thinking we had a bargain.
So for me he is a guaranteed starter unless vvd and matip/gomez are fully fit (if ever) and ready to go.

Zapater 14-03-21 12:25 PM

I'm in the minority, but I just don't see it. Seems like a great lad, but I think his performances are mediocre at best. Doesn't seem that dominating to me and his over reliance on his right foot is clear. He's playing because we have no one else and he'll be exposed over time. With a fit squad, doubt he'd get much of a look in and I don't expect to see too much of him in the future.

Paul12 14-03-21 01:53 PM

He's brought back the Carragher hoof.

Charly 14-03-21 07:06 PM

He is a solid unit, and seems a better defender than Kabak and Williams.Seems to win things in the air too, which is a dying art amongst defenders.

I guess we have the rest of the season to see. But he has yet to drop a Lovren style bollock.

He may not want to stay as 4th/5th choice.

Angryred 15-03-21 01:52 PM

give that guy a proper contract & he will stay, loves LFC!

Scratch 15-03-21 04:17 PM

I think he will want first team football tho, he doesn't strike me as the type to sit idly by and earn a paycheck, he'd rather be playing every week, even if it limits his chance of a trophy-laden career. Man just wants to head balls for a living.

ronanm 15-03-21 05:00 PM

I hope they don't ban heading


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