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Old 14-02-20, 08:42 PM   #6841
Chris
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Originally Posted by Paul12 View Post
Why is it? He was a force of nature, but he was not disciplined tactically. Benitez in effect said that a number of times. He needed to be given a free role because he could not consistently do what was expected in a disciplined role. That doesn't make him a bad player or anything, but I thought it was something that was widely acknowledged. (I certainly wasn't trying to be controversial.)
I think giving him a different role nearer to the goal was just as much about making the most of his special abilities than him being clueless tactically. Rafa loved his 2 guys sitting and all that stuff, why would anyone limit Gerrard in his prime to that?! World class attackers cost the most for a reason so sitting one in a holding midfield role permanently would be daft. He could do it if asked, like he did plenty of times including to perfection at home to Chelsea in the 2007 CL Semi where we couldn't afford to concede an away goal, but getting Gerrard to play a Lucas Leiva or Momo Sissoko type role all the time is a waste given how gifted he is with the ball.

Obviously I wouldn't say it was one of his main strength's when talking about him, yeah he could go superman and vacate a space on occasions, wasn't as smart as Xabi or whatever but I think this thing about him supposedly being tactically clueless is massively over done and it seems to be getting more of a thing with every year he's retired. This is a guy that's been brilliant as a 6 when his legs had gone, an 8, a 10 or out wide and quality whenever he filled in at full back yet he's apparently meant to be thick as fuck in tactical intelligence. Not his best attribute or a particularly big strength sure, "tactically illiterate" as you put it no chance.
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Old 14-02-20, 09:04 PM   #6842
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Originally Posted by Buzzo View Post
I’m not sure the ‘Rangers are getting done over by the refs’ angle will have much mileage up here The standard of officiating up here is historically dire, but the OF are definitely the beneficiaries of many, many favourable decisions.

Gerrard is getting (and deserves) praise for how he is handling this mini crisis. It would have been some achievement to have taken the title, I’m sure they will regroup. They were very unlucky not to win the League Cup - I’m sure they will focus on the Scottish Cup.

I only saw the last 20 mins but the first Killie goal could have been ruled out for h-ball then Morelos was denied a penalty - fair enough except the foul committed on him was the almost identical foul that he was then penalised for when scoring a few minutes later

I couldn't quite work that out

It's very rare I watch Scottish football, pretty much the only other game I've seen was the LC final where they played Celtic off the park for75 minutes but SG doesn't seem to have had much luck TBH as illustrated by Killei scoring from a ridiculous mishit on Wednesday night.
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Old 14-02-20, 09:05 PM   #6843
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Originally Posted by Chris View Post
I think giving him a different role nearer to the goal was just as much about making the most of his special abilities than him being clueless tactically. Rafa loved his 2 guys sitting and all that stuff, why would anyone limit Gerrard in his prime to that?! World class attackers cost the most for a reason so sitting one in a holding midfield role permanently would be daft. He could do it if asked, like he did plenty of times including to perfection at home to Chelsea in the 2007 CL Semi where we couldn't afford to concede an away goal, but getting Gerrard to play a Lucas Leiva or Momo Sissoko type role all the time is a waste given how gifted he is with the ball.

Obviously I wouldn't say it was one of his main strength's when talking about him, yeah he could go superman and vacate a space on occasions, wasn't as smart as Xabi or whatever but I think this thing about him supposedly being tactically clueless is massively over done and it seems to be getting more of a thing with every year he's retired. This is a guy that's been brilliant as a 6 when his legs had gone, an 8, a 10 or out wide and quality whenever he filled in at full back yet he's apparently meant to be thick as fuck in tactical intelligence. Not his best attribute or a particularly big strength sure, "tactically illiterate" as you put it no chance.
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Old Yesterday, 12:47 PM   #6844
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Stevie was great but he was never an Aimar, Pirlo or a KDB. He wasn't the greatest at unpicking a lock, working out how to pull players around with 3 or 4 passes before spotting and pouncing on a small opening. If he couldn't fuck it, eat it or kill it he didn't know what to do. If it wasn't working then do the same thing harder, faster and with more commitment.

As a player 'force of nature' is a good description, the way he would 'grab the bull by the horns' and barnstorm a way through was second to none. But at the very highest levels, it wasn't enough and that was his relative weakness and the quality that I am interested to see how it shows as a manager. If he hasn't learnt that finesse then he will struggle at the highest levels as he did as a player, getting slightly out manoeuvred by those with less inherent talent but a more measured and sophisticated and patient approach.

It's a pretty fair point and I'd agree it's not controversial.
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Old Yesterday, 01:00 PM   #6845
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Tricky question for him to answer as Rangers Manager, but good to see Stevie is paying attention to the City news. He'd take the backdated medal for sure.

Quote:
"I read that myself this morning," Rangers manager Gerrard, who was captain of Liverpool when they finished two points behind City in 2014, said after his side's win over Livingston.

"We will wait and see. From a UEFA point of view, it is obviously a real strong sentence or punishment. I'm sure they will appeal so we will wait and see what the outcome is on that.

"Then we will see whether the Premier League act from there. But if you look at the severity of the punishment from UEFA, something has gone badly wrong.

"So I'm really interested to see the outcome of that. Until I get the punishment from the Premier League, I won't comment further. But I'm really, really interested in it...for obvious reasons.
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Old Yesterday, 02:39 PM   #6846
frank the tank
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris View Post
I think giving him a different role nearer to the goal was just as much about making the most of his special abilities than him being clueless tactically. Rafa loved his 2 guys sitting and all that stuff, why would anyone limit Gerrard in his prime to that?! World class attackers cost the most for a reason so sitting one in a holding midfield role permanently would be daft. He could do it if asked, like he did plenty of times including to perfection at home to Chelsea in the 2007 CL Semi where we couldn't afford to concede an away goal, but getting Gerrard to play a Lucas Leiva or Momo Sissoko type role all the time is a waste given how gifted he is with the ball.

Obviously I wouldn't say it was one of his main strength's when talking about him, yeah he could go superman and vacate a space on occasions, wasn't as smart as Xabi or whatever but I think this thing about him supposedly being tactically clueless is massively over done and it seems to be getting more of a thing with every year he's retired. This is a guy that's been brilliant as a 6 when his legs had gone, an 8, a 10 or out wide and quality whenever he filled in at full back yet he's apparently meant to be thick as fuck in tactical intelligence. Not his best attribute or a particularly big strength sure, "tactically illiterate" as you put it no chance.
Good post Chris

Rafas 4-2-3-1 was so robust and rigid. And when Gerrard was behind Torres, it really was special.

Hypothetical, but it would have been really interesting to see Gerrard play in a middle 3 in the current set up. He played sitting midfielder in a 3 under Rodgers but it would have been interesting to see him play next to someone like Fabinho (Masch) in the role that Henderson plays a lot now. With our current front 3 - and how fuckin awesome they are - then i think Gerrard would have potentially been even better.
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Old Yesterday, 06:09 PM   #6847
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Originally Posted by frank the tank View Post
Good post Chris

Rafas 4-2-3-1 was so robust and rigid. And when Gerrard was behind Torres, it really was special.

Hypothetical, but it would have been really interesting to see Gerrard play in a middle 3 in the current set up. He played sitting midfielder in a 3 under Rodgers but it would have been interesting to see him play next to someone like Fabinho (Masch) in the role that Henderson plays a lot now. With our current front 3 - and how fuckin awesome they are - then i think Gerrard would have potentially been even better.
The thing with our current 8s is they cover the full backs who offer so much of our attacking outlet that it would curb so much of his drive forward. Gerrard was a freak of nature and Rafa got the absolute best out of him, especially those years with Torres.

Iím sure Klopp would find a spot for him and maximize his output for the team
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Old Yesterday, 11:05 PM   #6848
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Gerrard would be in the front three I reckon.
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