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Old 03-05-21, 02:28 PM   #281
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I have no idea.
Neither have I
I'm firmly in the camp of lining "gangsters" pockets until somebody comes up with a solution though. Won't be holding my breath.
In an ideal world though legislation making all clubs not-for-profit organisations would be a start.
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Old 03-05-21, 02:33 PM   #282
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I appreciate that games are often in the middle of the night in Oz, but the disparity in pricing for the Premier Leagueís Ďglobal audienceí is crazy.

Minimum £50+pm in the UK for just the televised schedule vs literally every game being given away with broadband subscriptions in other territories?
Wow I pay less than that for my broadband and football together!
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Old 03-05-21, 02:42 PM   #283
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The German model works, imo, in that it gives clubs a better chance to avoid financial mismanagement and the like by owners compared to what happens in other leagues, but, as you rightly pointed out it, it does not level the playing field between the financial powerhouse and the rest of the league.

You look at the Bundesliga compared to other leagues and the clubs seem to have less brushed with administrations and the like.


It is far from a perfect system though even though the concept of something more levelling based upon it would be interesting.



It would in a way be like if FFP had come in properly and was implemented in full. It would have prevented clubs from being finanically doped but it would also have meant the clubs that currently earn more would still earn more and thus would be able to spend more as they would be spending what they earned.
But ultimately, there is only so much you can do to restrict a market before it gets knocked down by courts. Forcing the sale of shares, the diluting of shareholding, restrictions on investment, dividends, salaries etc etc are all legally problematic, and especially so when looking at pan-European changes where multiple jurisdictions are involved.
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Old 03-05-21, 03:53 PM   #284
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Neither have I

I'm firmly in the camp of lining "gangsters" pockets until somebody comes up with a solution though. Won't be holding my breath.

In an ideal world though legislation making all clubs not-for-profit organisations would be a start.
Private equity, hedge funds and gangsters it is then.
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Old 03-05-21, 04:07 PM   #285
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It’s basically how we become a successful club. In fact the current model is essentially the same as it was in the 19th century. It used to be the richest guy in the town/city, now it’s the richest in the world. None of this really seems new, it’s just the scale that’s changed.
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Old 03-05-21, 04:17 PM   #286
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Not sure this is a good thing..

https://www.theguardian.com/football...akaway-leagues

Premier League preparing measures to stop threat of breakaway leagues

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As well as supporting the FA in a push for legislation the Premier League said it would itself implement further rules and regulations to protect the “principles of the Premier League and open competition”. Furthermore it would implement “a new Owners’ Charter that all club owners will be required to sign up to committing them to the core principles of the Premier League”.

Replace one power grab with another. “The core principles of the Premier League” Fuck that.
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Old 04-05-21, 08:48 AM   #287
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Who really has the authority to address any of it? Government will probably assume it does, but on what basis?
I think it would have to be FIFA unfortunately because as we saw with even as something as straightforward as the transfer window end time, if one league or nation does something, there's no guarantee the others will and said nation is then left at a comparative disadvantage.

So it needs a global solution but then you have the difficulties that come with different national laws around employment in all of these jurisdictions.

That's possibly one reason why it's not as easy a case as the NFL.
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Old 04-05-21, 10:01 AM   #288
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Football today is a self-fulfilling prophecy: different from any other business as itís classed as Ďhearts and mindsí - the club is Ďsupposed toí have a duty of care to their fans when marketing to them and likewise, authorities like FIFA are supposed to be task masters and uphold decency.

The problem is neither of these is true, hence the average joe is being increasingly priced out of the game while players, clubs, global organisations and broadcasters receive an increasingly larger percentage of the profits.

This drives up costs further with player wages escalating, TV rights extortionate, ticket price rises and so on... itís an endless upwards spiral of prices everywhere.

The game needs a reset. Thatís going to be almost impossible because of where itís at and how much money everyone receives...
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Old 04-05-21, 10:14 AM   #289
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Football today is a self-fulfilling prophecy: different from any other business as itís classed as Ďhearts and mindsí - the club is Ďsupposed toí have a duty of care to their fans when marketing to them and likewise, authorities like FIFA are supposed to be task masters and uphold decency.

The problem is neither of these is true, hence the average joe is being increasingly priced out of the game while players, clubs, global organisations and broadcasters receive an increasingly larger percentage of the profits.

This drives up costs further with player wages escalating, TV rights extortionate, ticket price rises and so on... itís an endless upwards spiral of prices everywhere.

The game needs a reset. Thatís going to be almost impossible because of where itís at and how much money everyone receives...


I do think the bubble is going to burst though to be honest. The ITV digital fiasco was as a result of getting market research totally wrong. The product they were trying to push was never going to sustain.

The same will / could be the case with the premier league in my view. The fact that BT sport are looking to pull out because they can't make it work is a sign. I genuinely think that the "product" of Premier League and Champions League has peaked in popularity. At least in this part of the world. It is likely that globally it still has a way to go..... but the likes of UEFA and FIFA have made their competitions less attractive / interesting by tweaking and tweaking. The Nations Leauge.......what a shite competition........the 48 team world cup.......just means that the first round of matches are pretty shite.

Go to a game and the average age of a fan is getting older and older every year. I am just not too sure if the next generation of fan is going to be as engaged as previous generations.
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Old 04-05-21, 11:56 AM   #290
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The only way BT could have made it work is, if like Sky originally, they had a complete monopoloy on PL and CL, but they didn't so the fans were not willing to shell money on Sky for the PL and BT for the CL. I don't think it means it has peaked in popularity, I think it is purely one step too far for most fans.
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Old 04-05-21, 12:24 PM   #291
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I do think the bubble is going to burst though to be honest. The ITV digital fiasco was as a result of getting market research totally wrong. The product they were trying to push was never going to sustain.

The same will / could be the case with the premier league in my view. The fact that BT sport are looking to pull out because they can't make it work is a sign. I genuinely think that the "product" of Premier League and Champions League has peaked in popularity. At least in this part of the world. It is likely that globally it still has a way to go..... but the likes of UEFA and FIFA have made their competitions less attractive / interesting by tweaking and tweaking. The Nations Leauge.......what a shite competition........the 48 team world cup.......just means that the first round of matches are pretty shite.

Go to a game and the average age of a fan is getting older and older every year. I am just not too sure if the next generation of fan is going to be as engaged as previous generations.
One of the reasons for this is we've all been season ticket holders since we were kids or young adults. I'm 45 and got my first season ticket when I was 9. I can't give it up as if I do I'll never see it again.

The club really do have to think on getting some local younger fans into the ground.

I'm really feeling the fatigue of it all at the minute.
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Old 04-05-21, 03:04 PM   #292
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Any whispers on a rearranged date. I'm struggling to see where it will fit in...maybe the 14th but that's only 2 days before we face West Brom

Liverpool fixture dates 8th, 16th, 19th, 23rd
Man U fixture dates 6th, 9th, 12th, 19th, 23rd
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Old 04-05-21, 03:20 PM   #293
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Any whispers on a rearranged date. I'm struggling to see where it will fit in...maybe the 14th but that's only 2 days before we face West Brom

Liverpool fixture dates 8th, 16th, 19th, 23rd
Man U fixture dates 6th, 9th, 12th, 19th, 23rd
west brom moved to 12th, 16th mancs
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Old 04-05-21, 03:25 PM   #294
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Any whispers on a rearranged date. I'm struggling to see where it will fit in...maybe the 14th but that's only 2 days before we face West Brom

Liverpool fixture dates 8th, 16th, 19th, 23rd
Man U fixture dates 6th, 9th, 12th, 19th, 23rd

Iíd like to hope that they will pick a date that suits us and let United deal with their own inconveniences. When we were in the World Cup we had to play 2 games within 24 hours in 2 different continents!

Iím not saying they should suffer because it was their fans, but because of their lack of security. Itís each clubs responsibility to provide a suitable and safe ground for the game to be played. Honestly I think thereís a strong argument for them having to just forfeit the points.
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Old 04-05-21, 03:28 PM   #295
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west brom moved to 12th, 16th mancs
West Brom will definitely move, but where did you see those dates confirmed?

I've seen a few different options discussed.
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Old 04-05-21, 03:38 PM   #296
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Nice

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Old 04-05-21, 03:39 PM   #297
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not confirmed, but unless they give the points (they won't) then that is the only possibility; plus too many journo's have been briefed that these are the likely dates for it to be anything else.
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Old 04-05-21, 03:45 PM   #298
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Saw posted elsewhere that the MUST are telling their members to keep the 15th/16th free for more 'protest action'; they're saying they may not be able to get into the ground, but they can block all the routes to the match itself. With any luck it will be another postponement and the points to us by default...be nice if they were the points that gave us CL football
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Old 04-05-21, 04:41 PM   #299
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Itís just a load of pissed up dickheads excited as they managed to break into the ground. There is no agenda. There is no cohesive point being made.
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Old 04-05-21, 04:56 PM   #300
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Itís just a load of pissed up dickheads excited as they managed to break into the ground. There is no agenda. There is no cohesive point being made.
Meh - I want to ban them
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Old 04-05-21, 10:54 PM   #301
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Meh - I want to ban them


For the sake of the game they need to be banned. Otherwise the game as we know it is at risk.
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Old 04-05-21, 11:15 PM   #302
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For the sake of the game they need to be banned. Otherwise the game as we know it is at risk.
For me, United should get a heavy fuckin penalty for this. Not just some bullshit fine. They should get something like a 6.game crowd ban for next season.....
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Old 05-05-21, 08:39 AM   #303
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https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/footb...tests-24030653

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Liverpool make decision on postponed Man Utd game with FA permitted to award win

The match at Old Trafford was postponed on Sunday after Manchester United fans stormed onto the pitch to protest against the Glazer ownership.

Liverpool will not ask the FA to award them the game, after their visit to Old Trafford was called off due to safety worries.

According to the rules, the governing body CAN declare the fixture will not be replayed at a later date, and instead award the three points to the Reds, if they decide it was “abandoned due to the conduct of one Club or its supporters”.

But the Anfield club have no interest in pursuing such an outcome, and instead will work with Manchester United to find a date for the fixture to be completed.

That will prove tricky, with the Manchester club involved in a Europa League semi final this week. They also have the following two midweek slots taken up with Premier League fixtures against Leicester and Fulham.

But United do have a free date on the weekend of May 15, when Liverpool are due to play West Brom on the 16th.

Liverpool have still to be given a date for their visit to Burnley, which is due to be played on one of the midweek days of May 18, 19, or 20th.

So it is possible if the West-Brom Liverpool game is brought forward, and the Burnley game put back, the fixture could be squeezed in around that time.
Good or bad decision by the club?

Regardless of what we decide Man Utd should face some form of punishment
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Old 05-05-21, 08:42 AM   #304
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Probably for the best.
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Old 05-05-21, 08:45 AM   #305
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If we were somehow to squeeze into the top 4 (unlikely I know) then there would be uproar amongst the football community.

We should be able to tell them exactly when we play them though. I would have said to play it tonight. If that doesn't suit United because they play in Italy tomorrow, fuck them. Tell them to take it up with their fans or that salford mafia nucklehead security fella who opened up the stadium
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Old 05-05-21, 08:53 AM   #306
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I agree we would face criticism if we made CL because of this, ultimately it shouldn't come down to what we decide the ruling bodies should make these decisions, so could decide to give us the points anyway (admittedly unlikely), but it is the first time this has happened so sets a precedent...

Since it looks like it is going back into the PL's hands it will be rescheduled at a time that is as convenient as possible for both clubs so they won't be putting Man Utd in a difficult position.
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Old 05-05-21, 09:00 AM   #307
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Ideal world the decision would be taken out of our hands! I can't see the 3 points being awarded, the broadcasters will want this game to go ahead and their interests will be looked after first and foremost.
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Old 05-05-21, 09:24 AM   #308
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Can we play it the day after their next Europa game please?
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Old 05-05-21, 09:32 AM   #309
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That would mean Friday. We play Southampton on Saturday.
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Old 05-05-21, 10:02 AM   #310
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Can we play it the day after their next Europa game please?
Day before surely? So we can kick the ever loving fuck out of them?
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Old 05-05-21, 10:32 AM   #311
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Fuck that...take the 3 points thanks.
If we qualify of the champions league because of this...I think I'll be able to cope with that.
I really don't give a rats ass about the criticism.
Why should our schedule be disrupted over this...it wasn't our fans.
Replay the tie and we'll see similiar...award the opposition 3 points and it will pretty much stop
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Old 05-05-21, 10:57 AM   #312
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Even if we take the points, we probably won’t qualify, so we look bad for no gain anyway.
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Old 05-05-21, 11:14 AM   #313
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Whenever we play it, there is a real risk that the fans will be back out on the streets to hamper efforts, especially given (at least the headline I read on Sky Sports) that the Glazers' refuse to apologise for the ESL thing, which will only rile up the Supporter's Trust even further.

If it gets postponed again due to fan action, I think there will be no other option but for United to forfeit the game.
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Old 05-05-21, 11:59 AM   #314
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still cant understand how fans got into the ground and then further onto the pitch and into "secure" areas. The protest was well publicised beforehand so it didnt exactly come as a shock.

Perhaps letting fans into the ground suited all round
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Old 05-05-21, 12:06 PM   #315
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still cant understand how fans got into the ground and then further onto the pitch and into "secure" areas. The protest was well publicised beforehand so it didnt exactly come as a shock.

Perhaps letting fans into the ground suited all round
i was shown a video of the security guard opening the gates for them. Literally unlocked the gate and held it open. There was one fella there asking him what the fuck was he doing.......that guy didn't go into the stadium.
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Old 05-05-21, 12:09 PM   #316
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Whenever we play it, there is a real risk that the fans will be back out on the streets to hamper efforts, especially given (at least the headline I read on Sky Sports) that the Glazers' refuse to apologise for the ESL thing, which will only rile up the Supporter's Trust even further.

If it gets postponed again due to fan action, I think there will be no other option but for United to forfeit the game.
Their supporters having nothing to loose. They're safe in 2nd. A loss of 3 points isn't going to derail their season in any way.

In that respect there's a real chance we could see more action for the rescheduled game.

You'd imagine that both the Primer League and United would be reticent to have this rescheduled to 8pm on a weekday given the increased likelihood of protests and / or violence. The Premier League could help them out and reschedule the game for a noon kick off on a Tuesday. Far less likely for the game to be disrupted at that time.

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Old 05-05-21, 12:28 PM   #317
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Their supporters having nothing to loose. They're safe in 2nd. A loss of 3 points isn't going to derail their season in any way.

In that respect there's a real chance we could see more action for the rescheduled game.

You'd imagine that both the Primer League and United would be reticent to have this rescheduled to 8pm on a weekday given the increased likelihood of protests and / or violence. The Premier League could help them out and reschedule the game for a noon kick off on a Tuesday. Far less likely for the game to be disrupted at that time.
I think Sky will have the upper hand here and would never agree to a daytime kick off on a week day.
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Old 05-05-21, 01:09 PM   #318
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i was shown a video of the security guard opening the gates for them. Literally unlocked the gate and held it open. There was one fella there asking him what the fuck was he doing.......that guy didn't go into the stadium.


There are videos of groups kicking doors in and smashing their way into the ground too though.

One of the vids had a few dozen all clustered around with two guys taking turns to kick a door in and once the door eventually gave they are rushed in and more came from off camera and rushed in.
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Old 05-05-21, 04:46 PM   #319
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I have to say... and I feel dirty for saying this... but I was impressed with what Ole had to say in his press conference today.. said they have the right to protest and that they hear them, but that going into the stadium was a step too far and now itís a police matter. Then he even brought up the policeman who had his face slashed, saying how he will be scarred for life.

I think a big problem is that you had ex players supporting them on tv. By all means support the message of the protest, but they all shoulda called them out for entering the stadium, and generally discouraged any fans watching from doing the same next week or whenever. Gary Neville even went as far as to say that most fans who entered the stadium were peaceful! You could have some fuckin idiot sitting 10 min down the road listening to him on tv who decides ahhh I might head down there and join in. Easy for neville to applaud them, wonít be him who could face jail time.
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Old 05-05-21, 06:05 PM   #320
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