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Old 25-02-21, 12:37 PM   #2521
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Dossena scored against Man U and Real Madrid.
Degen never really got a game due to injury.

Cissohko was bad, true, but for alroind lack of ability PFK is the winner. I recall games where he really couldn’t mark his man, seemingly had no real understanding of the position or his requirements. He was awful.
He was a shocker no doubt. Thank god stevie G won that FA cup final in 2006. The thought of losing partly because of a PFK cross that went in over Reina is too much
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Old 25-02-21, 12:44 PM   #2522
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For me the other two stand out flops were Carroll & Big Ben. Konch only cost us 2m with few other lads going to Fulham so he's not even close to the worst imo (There are several signing for low fees that have been awful). As far as value for money goes I think here's a little break down, make of it what you will (Figures approx):

- Carroll scored 11 goals in 58 appearances, cost £35m and was on £100k pw.
- Big Ben was 42 appearances with 10 goals, cost £32.5 & was on £140k pw.
- Keita so far has had 71 appearances for us. He cost £48m & is on £120k pw.

We can't really compare Keita's goal return with the other two donkey's as it's not fair but in those 71 appearance, I genuinely cannot remember a stand out game from him. So 'not even close' isn't really true in my opinion when you look at the data & obviously his performances. 'Thus far' it has been a dreadful signing from a value for money point of view which really is what clubs ultimately are looking for in any signing. Whether that will change at the stage i'm not so sure, it will take an almighty comeback effort & a miracle to keep him fit.
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Old 25-02-21, 12:48 PM   #2523
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Dossena scored against Man U and Real Madrid.
Degen never really got a game due to injury.

Cissohko was bad, true, but for alroind lack of ability PFK is the winner. I recall games where he really couldn’t mark his man, seemingly had no real understanding of the position or his requirements. He was awful.
what a game that madrid match was - sat in the kop for that one. Unbelievable. First and only time in my life I've seen an opposition goalkeeper clapped off by the kop for playing an absolute blinder even after conceding a pile of goals
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Old 25-02-21, 01:07 PM   #2524
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It's nowhere near as bad as Aquilani.

You don't half go overboard sometimes
He cost us £17m or so and was an absolute crock, hated the signing at the time aswell. Definitely up there with the worst but Keita was nearly 3 times his cost. So again I go back to value for money. It's not so over board when you take the transfer fee into account, wages paid out & the lack of return we have got from him.
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Old 25-02-21, 01:08 PM   #2525
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Diomede? Have a WC winner ever contributed less?
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Old 25-02-21, 01:15 PM   #2526
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Taking into account the massive fee and wage, could it be argued that this far it's one of, if not the worst signing we've ever made?


Think if you take inflation etc into account then you have to be looking at the likes of Andy Carroll, Benteke and a couple others before Keita along with waiting to see what Keita does for te rest of his LFC career. Also take into account how big a purchase Carroll and Benteke were versus the state of the club's financial heft at the time.

Unlike the likes of Carroll, Benteke and a few other awful buys, I can see why Keita was bought as he was immense before joining us but he just has been unable to stay fit enough to show it on a regular enough basis.

Would agree that his LFC career is coming to a make or break stage though because we simply cannot afford to keep carrying the amount of non playing or rarely playing passengers that we do each season, frwak injuries aside.
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Old 25-02-21, 01:16 PM   #2527
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For me the other two stand out flops were Carroll & Big Ben. Konch only cost us 2m with few other lads going to Fulham so he's not even close to the worst imo (There are several signing for low fees that have been awful). As far as value for money goes I think here's a little break down, make of it what you will (Figures approx):

- Carroll scored 11 goals in 58 appearances, cost £35m and was on £100k pw.
- Big Ben was 42 appearances with 10 goals, cost £32.5 & was on £140k pw.
- Keita so far has had 71 appearances for us. He cost £48m & is on £120k pw.

We can't really compare Keita's goal return with the other two donkey's as it's not fair but in those 71 appearance, I genuinely cannot remember a stand out game from him. So 'not even close' isn't really true in my opinion when you look at the data & obviously his performances. 'Thus far' it has been a dreadful signing from a value for money point of view which really is what clubs ultimately are looking for in any signing. Whether that will change at the stage i'm not so sure, it will take an almighty comeback effort & a miracle to keep him fit.
You’re making a very basic evaluation based on appearances, wages, fee.
But if you’re doing it that way, you’d have to include Ox as I’ve said and also Adam Lallana (178 apps in 6 years, £25m - big money in 2014, £110k pw).

When you look at data and performances, Naby actually has been a standout performer for us. If you can't remember, that’s on you. Many of our best team performances since last season have coincided with him playing, which is not a coincidence. So ‘not even close’ is completely fair.
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Old 25-02-21, 01:19 PM   #2528
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You’re making a very basic evaluation based on appearances, wages, fee.
But if you’re doing it that way, you’d have to include Ox as I’ve said and also Adam Lallana (178 apps in 6 years, £25m - big money in 2014, £110k pw).

When you look at data and performances, Naby actually has been a standout performer for us. If you can't remember, that’s on you. Many of our best team performances since last season have coincided with him playing, which is not a coincidence. So ‘not even close’ is completely fair.

Yeah he has actually been a very steady performer when he has actually played. Very much in that 7/10 performance each game sort of bracket. Plays, does his job well in a not overly flashy manner.

Watching him tells you he plays well and his stats back that up too.

Agree on your pont regarding Chamberlain and Lallana too. Both were not cheap buys, both on good wages and both missing a hell of a lot of playing time.
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Old 25-02-21, 01:23 PM   #2529
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Think if you take inflation etc into account then you have to be looking at the likes of Andy Carroll, Benteke and a couple others before Keita along with waiting to see what Keita does for te rest of his LFC career.

Unlike the likes of Carroll, Benteke and a few other awful buys, I can see why Keita was bought as he was immense before joining us but he just has been unable to stay fit enough to show it on a regular enough basis.

Would agree that his LFC career is coming to a make or break stage though because we simply cannot afford to keep carrying the amount of non playing or rarely playing passengers that we do each season, frwak injuries aside.
he may very well turn it around, I doubt it but I suppose you have to look at what he had contributed thus far which really is not much. I never expected much from Carroll & Benteke to be honest and both are up there in the top 3 worst buys in our history alright but Keita I thought would be a revelation.

Is my opinion slightly skewed by how disappointed I have been in Keita as oppose to what I thought he would be? Maybe, but I think people seem to forget the huge fee wee paid for him, he was our marquee buy. When you say it aloud that he could be one of the worst value for money transfer in our history, it sounds daft but then you look at the figures and it's not so daft after all.

Injuries, bad luck, poor performances etc whatever way you try to swing it, from a value for money perspective it has been a disaster. Whether that will change we will see, I really hope it fucking does
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Old 25-02-21, 01:25 PM   #2530
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You’re making a very basic evaluation based on appearances, wages, fee.
But if you’re doing it that way, you’d have to include Ox as I’ve said and also Adam Lallana (178 apps in 6 years, £25m - big money in 2014, £110k pw).

When you look at data and performances, Naby actually has been a standout performer for us. If you can't remember, that’s on you. Many of our best team performances since last season have coincided with him playing, which is not a coincidence. So ‘not even close’ is completely fair.
I am saying from a value for money perspective he has been a bad signing & yeah I agree with regard to Ox and Lallana too. IMO we should have got rid of Lallana years ago & same goes for Ox. I do think Ox will be gone in the summer.

Value for money is surely the way any club judges any signing no?
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Old 25-02-21, 01:26 PM   #2531
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I think he will come good. He has had spells where he has played really well, scored some goals and our record with him playing is really strong.

Injuries have blighted him. But. He offers something different in midfield so I would stick with him.
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Old 25-02-21, 01:30 PM   #2532
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For me the other two stand out flops were Carroll & Big Ben. Konch only cost us 2m with few other lads going to Fulham so he's not even close to the worst imo (There are several signing for low fees that have been awful). As far as value for money goes I think here's a little break down, make of it what you will (Figures approx):

- Carroll scored 11 goals in 58 appearances, cost £35m and was on £100k pw.
- Big Ben was 42 appearances with 10 goals, cost £32.5 & was on £140k pw.
- Keita so far has had 71 appearances for us. He cost £48m & is on £120k pw.

We can't really compare Keita's goal return with the other two donkey's as it's not fair but in those 71 appearance, I genuinely cannot remember a stand out game from him. So 'not even close' isn't really true in my opinion when you look at the data & obviously his performances. 'Thus far' it has been a dreadful signing from a value for money point of view which really is what clubs ultimately are looking for in any signing. Whether that will change at the stage i'm not so sure, it will take an almighty comeback effort & a miracle to keep him fit.



Having said that, surely the fact that we got 32.5m back for Benteke means that overall the deal wasn't as bad. Similarly with Carroll, we got a loan fee followed by 17.5m back......

Keita could end up staying at LFC because nobody would pay him the same wage and seeing out his contract.

I do think the "so far" aspect is true here too. He could still come good. Hopefully.
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Old 25-02-21, 01:35 PM   #2533
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Have to say I would be very surprised if he was indeed on 110k or 120k as his basic wage too.

He might be on that when things like endorsements and other sponsorship add ons get added to his basic wage but would be stunnned if it is on 120k a week before endorsements/sponsorships etc.

Have a feeling that the wage that gets banded about for him includes endorsements and his signing on fee.


Just looked on a few sites and even things like whether it is in euro or pound is being mixed up by a lot of them.
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Old 25-02-21, 01:36 PM   #2534
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Yeah he has actually been a very steady performer when he has actually played. Very much in that 7/10 performance each game sort of bracket. Plays, does his job well in a not overly flashy manner.

Watching him tells you he plays well and his stats back that up too.

Agree on your pont regarding Chamberlain and Lallana too. Both were not cheap buys, both on good wages and both missing a hell of a lot of playing time.
I disagree with this point. IMO instead of being a steady performer, he has either coasted through most games or not been involved full stop. Tentative and afraid to take responsibility.

Watching him tells you he's a nice footballer that is clear, I have said that myself. But there are plenty of nice footballers who don't actually do much. He was brought here because he looked a dynamic midfielder, aggressive, box to box he could pass, tackle and get involved with goals and assists... the whole package. What we have seen is that he is not that dynamic, he is slow, needs time on the ball & has struggling massively with the physicality of the league. The stats can be skewed if you really want to with pass percentage etc which I am beginning to hate but what he is showing so far is not what we bought him for & that's besides the injuries.
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Old 25-02-21, 01:38 PM   #2535
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Having said that, surely the fact that we got 32.5m back for Benteke means that overall the deal wasn't as bad. Similarly with Carroll, we got a loan fee followed by 17.5m back......

Keita could end up staying at LFC because nobody would pay him the same wage and seeing out his contract.

I do think the "so far" aspect is true here too. He could still come good. Hopefully.
I suppose it's great that we got the fees back but unfortunately we couldn't get the time they spent at the club back
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Old 25-02-21, 01:40 PM   #2536
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Downing's signing gets away with murder if you ask me......had been stinking up the league for years with his subpar mediocrity, and we still went and paid 20m+, probably unopposed as well from what I recall.

Baffling.
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Old 25-02-21, 01:41 PM   #2537
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Forgot about him actually, yeah he was a shocker alright.
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Old 25-02-21, 01:44 PM   #2538
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I loathed watching Big shit Chris. Klopp had a barely disguised loathing himself, he was always going bezerk at him. Everything Klopps style of footy stands for is everything big Chris was not.
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Old 25-02-21, 01:47 PM   #2539
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I am saying from a value for money perspective he has been a bad signing & yeah I agree with regard to Ox and Lallana too. IMO we should have got rid of Lallana years ago & same goes for Ox. I do think Ox will be gone in the summer.

Value for money is surely the way any club judges any signing no?
True, though I’d say Naby is a very good signing blighted by bad luck.

Others like Carroll, Downing, Balotelli, Djibril Cisse, El Hadj Diouf were all big money or even marquee signings of the time. Some of them were hampered by injury too, but they were all far poorer than Naby in terms of quality and fit and also in terms of value for money too.

I know you don’t agree, but at least Naby does actually show his value when he’s playing, unlike that lot and many others.
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Old 25-02-21, 01:47 PM   #2540
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Aye......the likes of Keita etc are somewhat understandable given the potential ceiling, as is the frustration when he's, overall, contributed very little in his years here up to now for a variety of reasons.

But the Downing one always bothered me. Everyone knew what he little he could offer, what his history was and we still went and paid for that shit. Plus the English tax. For me, way worse than the likesnof the Carroll signing.
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Old 25-02-21, 01:47 PM   #2541
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I disagree with this point. IMO instead of being a steady performer, he has either coasted through most games or not been involved full stop.

Watching him tells you he's a nice footballer that is clear, I have said that myself. But there are plenty of nice footballers who don't actually do much. He was brought here because he looked a dynamic midfielder, aggressive, box to box he could pass, tackle and get involved with goals and assists. What we have seen is that he is not that dynamic, he is slow, needs time on the ball & has struggling massively with the physicality of the league. The stats can be skewed if you really want to with pass percentage etc which I am beginning to hate but what he is showing so far is not what we bought him for & that's besides the injuries.

Was not even thinking about his pass % with regards to stats, but I was giving more weight to what I have seen with my eyes anyway and just said that the stats for him back up what I thought I have seen.


But to dig into his stats a bit on the things you mentioned. His stats for things like tackles made and successful tackles have been consistently good since joining us, his interception and dribble stats have been consistently good, his dispossession stats have been very good which says he does not have the ball taken from him a lot, and his poor ball control stats for the last three seasons range show he does not miscontrol the ball much, and your fave stat, pass completion %, shows him to be one of the more efficient passers of the ball in the team when he plays.

So basically the guy does everything well and is pretty much a text book 7/10 player on the pitch who does all the basics well almost all the time and who is very good at keeping possession and resisting presses. His heat maps show he is also very mobile during games and his stats for link up play (one twos and so on) are also good.

The guy is not spectacular to watch, but he ticks away in a very consistent manner when he plays and I think it is no coincidence that if you look at some of our best offensive performances this season and last, you will find that Naby played in a number of those games and he was being used in the pivot role to ensure smooth transitions in the middle and the keeping of possession.
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Old 25-02-21, 01:53 PM   #2542
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I disagree with this point. IMO instead of being a steady performer, he has either coasted through most games or not been involved full stop. Tentative and afraid to take responsibility.

Watching him tells you he's a nice footballer that is clear, I have said that myself. But there are plenty of nice footballers who don't actually do much. He was brought here because he looked a dynamic midfielder, aggressive, box to box he could pass, tackle and get involved with goals and assists... the whole package. What we have seen is that he is not that dynamic, he is slow, needs time on the ball & has struggling massively with the physicality of the league. The stats can be skewed if you really want to with pass percentage etc which I am beginning to hate but what he is showing so far is not what we bought him for & that's besides the injuries.
Disagree, I see a totally different player to you.

And when you look at the data (well beyond pass percentage) he is consistently one of our top performers across every possible metric.
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Old 25-02-21, 02:05 PM   #2543
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Dossena scored against Man U and Real Madrid.
Degen never really got a game due to injury.

Cissohko was bad, true, but for alroind lack of ability PFK is the winner. I recall games where he really couldn’t mark his man, seemingly had no real understanding of the position or his requirements. He was awful.
TBF neither did Bodge


Balotelli also sticks out as a terrible signing for me. We knew he was a twat and inconsistent on the field at best & still chucked best part of £20m at him. Even worse than Downing who was a massively overpriced mehhhhhhh.
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Old 25-02-21, 02:13 PM   #2544
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lazar markovic and Stewart Drowning probably have to be up there for big money flops.
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Old 25-02-21, 02:14 PM   #2545
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Was not even thinking about his pass % with regards to stats, but I was giving more weight to what I have seen with my eyes anyway and just said that the stats for him back up what I thought I have seen.


But to dig into his stats a bit on the things you mentioned. His stats for things like tackles made and successful tackles have been consistently good since joining us, his interception and dribble stats have been consistently good, his dispossession stats have been very good which says he does not have the ball taken from him a lot, and his poor ball control stats for the last three seasons range show he does not miscontrol the ball much, and your fave stat, pass completion %, shows him to be one of the more efficient passers of the ball in the team when he plays.

So basically the guy does everything well and is pretty much a text book 7/10 player on the pitch who does all the basics well almost all the time and who is very good at keeping possession and resisting presses. His heat maps show he is also very mobile during games and his stats for link up play (one twos and so on) are also good.

The guy is not spectacular to watch, but he ticks away in a very consistent manner when he plays and I think it is no coincidence that if you look at some of our best offensive performances this season and last, you will find that Naby played in a number of those games and he was being used in the pivot role to ensure smooth transitions in the middle and the keeping of possession.


All of this. And loads of other stuff too, like creating chances from pressing, winning possession from pressing, etc
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Old 25-02-21, 02:19 PM   #2546
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lazar markovic and Stewart Drowning probably have to be up there for big money flops.
Markovic is a good shout. Forget about him. £20m, a massive flop in terms of performance and we paid his wages to play more games for other clubs than he did for us.
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Old 25-02-21, 02:21 PM   #2547
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All of this. And loads of other stuff too, like creating chances from pressing, winning possession from pressing, etc


Yep he really is a very effective player albeit in a very under the radar to the eye sort of way at times.

The only issue I have with him is the amount of time is is unavailable to either start or be ready to step in as a back up.

In terms of ability and performances I would not be looking to move him on, but in terms of availability I would have him pretty much in a show what you got between now and the next Jan window or we move you on bracket.

Would certainly sell a few other players in our squad before him though as he offers more than say Chamberlain on the pitch when both are fit so if one crock had to go to raise funds, Chamberlain would be gone first of those two for me.
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Old 25-02-21, 02:26 PM   #2548
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Markovic is a good shout. Forget about him. £20m, a massive flop in terms of performance and we paid his wages to play more games for other clubs than he did for us.
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Old 25-02-21, 02:26 PM   #2549
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Was not even thinking about his pass % with regards to stats, but I was giving more weight to what I have seen with my eyes anyway and just said that the stats for him back up what I thought I have seen.


But to dig into his stats a bit on the things you mentioned. His stats for things like tackles made and successful tackles have been consistently good since joining us, his interception and dribble stats have been consistently good, his dispossession stats have been very good which says he does not have the ball taken from him a lot, and his poor ball control stats for the last three seasons range show he does not miscontrol the ball much, and your fave stat, pass completion %, shows him to be one of the more efficient passers of the ball in the team when he plays.

So basically the guy does everything well and is pretty much a text book 7/10 player on the pitch who does all the basics well almost all the time and who is very good at keeping possession and resisting presses. His heat maps show he is also very mobile during games and his stats for link up play (one twos and so on) are also good.

The guy is not spectacular to watch, but he ticks away in a very consistent manner when he plays and I think it is no coincidence that if you look at some of our best offensive performances this season and last, you will find that Naby played in a number of those games and he was being used in the pivot role to ensure smooth transitions in the middle and the keeping of possession.
Last season there was so many amazing performances to be honest, everyone was on it, this season has been few and far between. Keita has only played 90 mins once this season in his 9 or 10 appearances and featured when we had a fully fit side so hard to say that. The reason I actually bumped this thread was because of a conversation about Keita with friends on whatsapp. One of the lads thinks he has been shit a disaster signing, the other lad thinks he has been good and produced the stats for pretty much what you said above. Both LFC fans.

So the guy that thinks he has been good posted all the stats from above that you have just mentioned & he other guy pretty much said this in reply. That pass, dribble, dispossession and ball control stat are pretty much inter linked. He doesn't try many high risk balls so possession stat is safe, most of them are sideways and simple, he doesn't dribble much so dribbling/dispossession stat is good and if he does it's over short distances to less like to lose the ball. He does have nice control, he is a nice footballer and technically efficient I don't think anybody will deny that. Interesting to hear such contrasting opinions. It's escalated a bit as there is 17 lads on the thread so I thought it would be good to rehash it on here but there was valid points on both sides imo.

Here's my take on it, at RBL his role seemed more dynamic as he had more license to drift, go from box to box and play a role with freedom as he was allowed to. At LFC & in the premier league imo he has been asked to play a much more tactical game in a much higher tempo & physciality which I do genuinely think he has struggled with. You could argue that the language barrier or that he is constantly injured could have something to do with that.

The reason I keep mentioning value for money is because we usually seems to have to sell to buy so it's a tight ship all round. With covid and the lack of finances value for money is even more important than ever. So we spend nearly 50m on a guy who is different from our current midfielders and who many of us described as a game changer signing (myself included), we bought him as our current midfield where tactically astute and workmanlike and we needed an x factor.

I wonder will Klopp and the backroom team be looking to cash in on the likes of Keita, Ox, Shaq, Matip who simply are not offering value for money and using the potential funds we can raise for them towards players who can potentially make a consistent difference. I do wonder if Klopp's patience has finally worn out with these guys & with what has gone on this season?
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Old 25-02-21, 02:31 PM   #2550
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Lazar has been be top 5 alright. Totally forgot that he ever existed. What a pile of shite
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Old 25-02-21, 02:34 PM   #2551
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I'd completely forgotten about him too. He's kind of morphed in to the same person as Squintilani
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Old 25-02-21, 02:35 PM   #2552
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Last season there was so many amazing offensive performances to be honest, everyone was on it, this season has been few and far between. Keita has only played 90 mins once this season in his 9 or 10 appearances and featured when we had a fully fit side. The reason I actually bumped this thread was because of a conversation about Keita with friends on whatsapp. One of the lads thinks he has been shit a disaster signing, the other lad thinks he has been good and produced the stats for pretty much what you said above. Both LFC fans.

So the guy that thinks he has been good posted all the stats from above that you have just mentioned & he other guy pretty much said this in reply. That pass, dribble, dispossession and ball control stat are pretty much inter linked. He doesn't try many high risk balls so possession stat is safe, most of them are sideways and simple, he doesn't dribble much so dribbling/dispossession stat is good and if he does it's over short distances to less like to lose the ball. He does have nice control, he is a nice footballer and technically efficient I don't think anybody will deny that. Interesting to hear such contrasting opinions. It's escalated a bit as there is 17 lads on the thread so I thought it would be interesting to rehash it on here but there was valid points on both sides imo.

Here's my take on it, at RBL his role seemed more dynamic as he had more license to drift, go from box to box and play a role with freedom as he was allowed to. At LFC & in the premier league imo he has been asked to play a much more tactical game in a much higher tempo & physciality which I do genuinely think he has struggled with. You could argue that the language barrier or that he is constantly injured could have something to do with that.

The reason I keep mentioning value for money is because we usually seems to have to sell to buy so it's a tight ship all round. With covid and the lack of finances value for money is even more important than ever. So we spend nearly 50m on a guy who is different from our current midfielders and who many of us described as a game changer signing (myself included), we bought him as our current midfield where tactically astute and workmanlike and we needed an x factor.

I wonder will Klopp and the backroom team be looking to cash in on the likes of Keita, Ox, Shaq, Matip who simply are not offering value for money and using the potential funds we can raise for them towards players who can potentially make a consistent difference.


I would be surprised if conservations were not already had about a number of players tbh. At some point we need to have our next tier down actually available when needed instead of having some or all of them out every time a first teamer needs to be covered.

If you go through our current squad you could probably list maybe eight to ten players that if they were not Liverpool players in the morning we would not even notice they were gone such is their lack of availability this season be it through injury, loan or non selection and that says a lot about those players given the opportunities that have been there this season for back up players to try and stake a claim.
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Old 25-02-21, 02:36 PM   #2553
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Lazar has been be top 5 alright. Totally forgot that he ever existed. What a pile of shite


What a brute. Did that player ever recover from that vicious assault?
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Old 25-02-21, 02:37 PM   #2554
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I can't wait to see the back of him. His percentage stats might be OK. But the amount of times he goes hiding does my head in. Too shy, too timid. He'll never make it in this league.
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Old 25-02-21, 02:38 PM   #2555
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I can't wait to see the back of him. His percentage stats might be OK. But the amount of times he goes hiding does my head in. Too shy, too timid. He'll never make it in this league.


At least wait until Perkins is offline before slagging him off like that
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Old 25-02-21, 02:40 PM   #2556
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I'll give Naby 3 gams till he's injured again ....one of thee all time shit transfer ever
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Old 25-02-21, 02:42 PM   #2557
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True, though I’d say Naby is a very good signing blighted by bad luck.

Others like Carroll, Downing, Balotelli, Djibril Cisse, El Hadj Diouf were all big money or even marquee signings of the time. Some of them were hampered by injury too, but they were all far poorer than Naby in terms of quality and fit and also in terms of value for money too.

I know you don’t agree, but at least Naby does actually show his value when he’s playing, unlike that lot and many others.
Sorry just seen this. For me, we'll never know what may have been as he is always injured or coming back from injury. Has it had an effect? Absolutely, it has to have had and would be ignorant to suggest otherwise. In terms of his quality on the pitch, for me he's been average, just there so to speak. Neat and tidy and not much else & certainly polar opposite to RBL Naby who admittedly had a role with much more freedom. But surely that dynamic, box to box midfielder is exactly why we wanted him in the first place? Nearly 50m on the guy you chase for years because of certain specific attributes & then watch him play in a completely different manner, surely that is not Klopps doing? Is it because we play more tactically or is it because he's just not as good in this league?

Language barrier, injuries, tactics, tempo, physicality? Too many questions imo and we didn't pay that amount of money for 6 or 7 out of 10 players in my opinion.
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Old 25-02-21, 02:51 PM   #2558
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Sorry just seen this. For me, we'll never know what may have been as he is always injured or coming back from injury. Has it had an effect? Absolutely, it has to have had and would be ignorant to suggest otherwise. In terms of his quality on the pitch, for me he's been average, just there so to speak. Neat and tidy and not much else & certainly polar opposite to RBL Naby who admittedly had a role with much more freedom. But surely that dynamic, box to box midfielder is exactly why we wanted him in the first place? Nearly 50m on the guy you chase for years because of certain specific attributes & then watch him play in a completely different manner, surely that is not Klopps doing? Is it because we play more tactically or is it because he's just not as good in this league?

Language barrier, injuries, tactics, tempo, physicality? Too many questions imo and we didn't pay that amount of money for 6 or 7 out of 10 players in my opinion.

A player that gives you 7/10 every week will cost that sort of money nowadays. A 7/10 week in week out is a very good player.

Graelish at Villa would be a 7/10 player for me albeit in a very different role and I am sure there would be plenty on here that would like to have him in our team.

And when I say 7/10 I don't mean that player never puts in a beter performance, I just mean that when he is on the pitch you usually get a 7/10 performance.

Great teams usually have the majority of the team being those 7/10 players with maybe a handful of other players on the team that are a bit better again and who are the "star" names.

We have just been a bit spoiled the past few years as we seem to have had as many higher level performers as we have had 7/10s.

Right now though I would kill for a team that was full of 7/10 performances each game
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Old 25-02-21, 03:14 PM   #2559
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Get him fit, give him a few games to prove his fitness and then get shut asap.
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Old 25-02-21, 03:16 PM   #2560
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Markovich fucking hell. Kenneth’s fave- never sure what he saw in him.
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