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Old 15-11-18, 03:38 PM   #41
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In the Premier League next season.
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Old 15-11-18, 03:59 PM   #42
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Excellent. Now all we need is some decent refs.
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Old 15-11-18, 05:04 PM   #43
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In the Premier League next season.

How would it deal with a goal like the one on Sunday, withe the offside goal, the quick free kick and then our goal? Would play have stopped straight after their goal or would our breakaway be allowed and then the reviews?
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Old 15-11-18, 05:08 PM   #44
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How would it deal with a goal like the one on Sunday, withe the offside goal, the quick free kick and then our goal? Would play have stopped straight after their goal or would our breakaway be allowed and then the reviews?
play should continue until a decision is made, and if its only used for glaring errors it should be ok. I think they had the balance right in the world cup, trigger happy VAR refs detract from the game rather than add to it.
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Old 15-11-18, 06:24 PM   #45
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I think basically it would work a lot better if the primary official was in the room giving the ref on the pitch advice to play on, stop play, issue a card / penalty, pick his nose etc. Shouldn't be up to the ref on the pitch to look at vid evidence.
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Old 15-11-18, 06:35 PM   #46
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I think basically it would work a lot better if the primary official was in the room giving the ref on the pitch advice to play on, stop play, issue a card / penalty, pick his nose etc. Shouldn't be up to the ref on the pitch to look at vid evidence.
That would be the best option to keep play flowing.
Play to the whistle should be instruction number one, with no players calling for var making little box shapes like pre school kids or or 80s ravers.
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Old 15-11-18, 06:39 PM   #47
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That would be the best option to keep play flowing.
Play to the whistle should be instruction number one, with no players calling for var making little box shapes like pre school kids or or 80s ravers.
Yeh exactly. If they can't see the person making the decision to stop play or play on there's no chance of them having an impact on that front, even the person in the room will be too busy reviewing the evidence to see what they're up to.
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Old 17-11-18, 11:54 AM   #48
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play should continue until a decision is made, and if its only used for glaring errors it should be ok. I think they had the balance right in the world cup, trigger happy VAR refs detract from the game rather than add to it.
As I understand it play is allowed to continue until the ball goes dead or play is stopped by the referee. Obviously the referee has to call on VAR to be used in order to overturn the decision of the linesman, which may or may not happen, but assuming it did in the case of the Fulham disallowed goal when the ball crosses the goal line the play is dead, so we cannot take the freekick to restart play and go down the other end to score because the play would be being reviewed.

As I understand the rules we wouldn't have been allowed the opportunity to break.
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Old 17-11-18, 12:48 PM   #49
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Old 08-12-18, 11:25 PM   #50
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I noticed sky bringing up VAR with regards to Salah's first goal today, technically yes it was offside but by the narrowest of margins. I'm not just saying this because we benefited from it but I don't want goals being ruled out for such marginal calls, if you have to pause the film and draw lines across the screen and can still barely tell you can't be ruling it out. If the player is clearly offside and the linesman has missed it, then absolutely rule out the goal, but if it's that tight it needs to be the linesman's call stands. Otherwise we will completely ruin the game.
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Old 09-12-18, 12:19 AM   #51
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I disagree. If you can easily tell or barely tell you can still tell.

It's one thing if you can't be certain, then sure lino's call, but if you can tell you can tell.
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Old 09-12-18, 12:22 AM   #52
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I disagree. If you can easily tell or barely tell you can still tell.

It's one thing if you can't be certain, then sure lino's call, but if you can tell you can tell.


It was pretty clearly off. I agree if it's ambiguous it should favour the attacking team, but it rarely is in the case of offside and having some sort of 'let the marginal offsides stand' guidance is just adding arbitrary subjective nonsense into the rules which would only lead to confusion and inconsistency.
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Old 09-12-18, 09:27 AM   #53
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I'm not sure the way to deal with this but I'm sorry I just don't like the idea of it. The original VAR brief was to correct the clear and obvious mistakes which I think makes sense. To determine that was offside you needed slow motion, a single frame of footage and a line across the screen so in my opinion it can't havery been clear and obviously wrong.

This is the danger with VAR that every decision is going to be reviewed the game is going to become a mess. If these types of decision are going to be reviewable, the linesmen are going to give less offside decisions because if they are wrong and play has been stopped that chance has gone, because if they don't do that VAR will only disallow goals that had been allowed and won't be able to give goals that were wrongly given offside, in that situation only the defending team benefits.

Also there is almost no point in the linesman being there for any tight calls because all wold end up being reviewed I feel like there needs to be a 'linesman's call' for decisions so tight. Or that the officials should only be allowed to review it at full speed because if you can't tell seeing it again at full speed it isn't clear and obvious.

I didn't like it in the world cup when a ball hitting a hand was reviewed in slow motion and given as a penalty, when it was ball to hand.

I think there needs to be alot more thought about VAR and how it should be applied.
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Old 09-12-18, 10:08 AM   #54
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I thought our first goal last night was clear and obviously offside to be honest. It may not have been a mile off, but it was clearly off.

And if you're not going to allow slow motion and aids to enable better detection then there's not much point in it anyway.
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Old 09-12-18, 11:18 AM   #55
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I noticed sky bringing up VAR with regards to Salah's first goal today, technically yes it was offside but by the narrowest of margins. I'm not just saying this because we benefited from it but I don't want goals being ruled out for such marginal calls, if you have to pause the film and draw lines across the screen and can still barely tell you can't be ruling it out. If the player is clearly offside and the linesman has missed it, then absolutely rule out the goal, but if it's that tight it needs to be the linesman's call stands. Otherwise we will completely ruin the game.
The whole point is to ensure that the correct decision is made whenever it's used. Otherwise what's the point?

In offside cases, however close to it is, it's always going to be a black and white decision. An open or shut case. You're either on or off.

Penalties will still be argued over at times because what constitutes a foul is still a subjective decision.

But for offside, nope. Has to be 100% every single time.
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Old 09-12-18, 11:40 AM   #56
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That's the image from sky, assuming they have picked the exact frame Firmino kicks the ball and the line is in the right place; from that single frame and with the line superimposed, Salah is the width of a knee or the width of his boot offside, so what 3 or 4 inches offside? If this is what it takes to tell I don't think that you can say that is assistant's decision is "clearly" wrong, which is supposed to be what VAR was about.

The other side is you want to get big decisions correct, fair enough you used whatever technology is available to get the decision correct and rule the goal out, but what is the cost to the game? It seems that offsides are easy to change, but you also need to give equal weighting to other decisions, potential fouls in the build up would have an equal impact are those going to be reviewed too or do you allow the referee to use his judgement and accept that the game is going to have some subjective decisions, but that the assistants calls have to be perfect? For me there is an inconsistency in that
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Old 09-12-18, 12:50 PM   #57
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I don't understand how Salah is 'active' at that point.
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Old 09-12-18, 01:19 PM   #58
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I don't understand how Salah is 'active' at that point.
He's not active at that point, but he is in an offside position (this would have no effect if Firmino's shot went directly in or if another LFC player put the rebound in). But as he is in an offside position there, when the ball comes back to him off the keeper he is deemed to be offside because he gained an advantage from being in that position. (As I understand the rule...)
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Old 09-12-18, 01:29 PM   #59
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Look at the VAR in the A League and what people think of it. They can’t do it right here and it just ruins games too much
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Old 09-12-18, 01:45 PM   #60
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Look at the VAR in the A League and what people think of it. They canít do it right here and it just ruins games too much
In what way? (I don't follow the A league at all).

I like the idea of all the decisions being perfect but that is an idealistic position which will never happen because it is completely impractical. There are going to have to be some compromises, and that involves limiting VAR's use or it only being applied in certain circumstances. Where I have seen it applied (trials in the League cup in England, and the World Cup) I haven't been happy with it's use and some of the results (soft penalty awards)
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Old 09-12-18, 03:35 PM   #61
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If the ball from firmino went straight to salah then its offside, but surely if its played back to salah from the keeper of an oppo player then its another phase of play.

And to add, this "phase of play" thing is all shite and whats really fucked up the offside rule.
It needs binning so its either offside or not, with no complications.
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Old 09-12-18, 03:51 PM   #62
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I don't agree. It is the same phase of play. Salah, or any striker for that matter, is gaining a massive advantage by standing beyond the last defender. If the keeper pushed the ball out wide and the defence retreated and Salah headed in a subsequent cross I would agree second phase but in that scenario its the same one, for me at least.
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Old 09-12-18, 03:54 PM   #63
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They just seem to complicate things here. They rarely overturn decision when it’s clear it’s wrong. It takes so long to check things and when you’re at the game you have no idea what’s happening.

http://www.espn.com/soccer/australia...al-failure-ffa

This is from the grand final last season. So it’s meant to fix the clear errors but still can’t. Most of the mistakes are from the video refs interfering and so far this season it’s just every round they make mistakes. There are too many to talk about.

Last season there were 3 reds in one game and if I remember right none were reds it’s the video ref getting in the refs ear saying you need to go look at the video. It worked in the World Cup but here it doesn’t. I don’t know if it’s the people or how they’ve set it up but I hate it. I may be biased but I did see a stat saying my team had been done by the VAR more than any team with wrong decisions.
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Old 09-12-18, 04:36 PM   #64
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They just seem to complicate things here. They rarely overturn decision when itís clear itís wrong. It takes so long to check things and when youíre at the game you have no idea whatís happening.

http://www.espn.com/soccer/australia...al-failure-ffa

This is from the grand final last season. So itís meant to fix the clear errors but still canít. Most of the mistakes are from the video refs interfering and so far this season itís just every round they make mistakes. There are too many to talk about.

Last season there were 3 reds in one game and if I remember right none were reds itís the video ref getting in the refs ear saying you need to go look at the video. It worked in the World Cup but here it doesnít. I donít know if itís the people or how theyíve set it up but I hate it. I may be biased but I did see a stat saying my team had been done by the VAR more than any team with wrong decisions.
Wow that's bad.

Personally I didn't think that the VAR system worked in the world cup, alot of incidents that were referred to VAR resulted in soft penalties or soft fouls because they were viewed in slow motion, there was at least one penalty for handball which was given from VAR that was stupidly soft. But there was still a huge lottery as to whether incidents are referred to VAR or not, it needs to be decided how the referral system works or whether someone is going to be in the refs ear telling him he might want to take a look at this or whether all scoring plays are reviewed or what.

When it comes in I hope I'm wrong, but I fear that it will be worse than the existing system because any wrong decisions will be amplified massively.
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Old 09-12-18, 04:51 PM   #65
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It’s meant to fix the complete fuck ups but it doesn’t and makes it more complicated. We’ve had the same system for how long now and it’s part of the game. Human error is annoying but players make mistakes as well. Goal line technology is the type of technology that works. It’s clear, simple and you get an immediate answer. Otherwise there are far more important things to fix like diving and all the Neymar type carry on.
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Old 09-12-18, 09:50 PM   #66
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At the end of the day I think he's clearly offside, we got away with it, we won by enough it doesn't really matter, and people will whinge about anything.
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Old 24-02-19, 10:31 PM   #67
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I was massively for it thinking it'd stop the robberies I've seen so many times at Old Trafford but I'm beginning to think it's a waste of time, there's still loads of horrific decision and stuff like this is still getting penalties even with VAR involved.

https://streamja.com/qNvX
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Old 24-02-19, 10:39 PM   #68
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I was massively for it thinking it'd stop the robberies I've seen so many times at Old Trafford but I'm beginning to think it's a waste of time, there's still loads of horrific decision and stuff like this is still getting penalties even with VAR involved.

https://streamja.com/qNvX
joke of a decision, why did the ref not go & view the video?
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Old 24-02-19, 10:54 PM   #69
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Old 06-03-19, 10:59 PM   #70
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I got this so wrong. Man Utd getting favours was the thing I thought it'd cut out but it's going to make it worse. Scandalous.
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Old 06-03-19, 11:30 PM   #71
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It's the death of football. It leaves it even more open to corrupt or inept decisions. It can't work. It won't work.
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Old 06-03-19, 11:35 PM   #72
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It could work if it was thoughtfully introduced with clear rules around where and how it is used.

Doesn’t look like that is happening though so, yeah, it could well be the death of football.

Referees pretty much deciding games and like last night in the Madrid game looking at throw ins for 5 mins etc.

Shouldn’t be that difficult to implement with clear areas where it is to be used and how it is run. But that’s not happening.

They HAVE to show the crowd what the ref sees. And they should mic the ref like in Rugby.
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Old 07-03-19, 09:45 AM   #73
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Must admit I was pro VAR but the decisions I've seen lately are quickly turning me against it.

Agree with mic'ing the ref too, I would love to know his thought process for considering that deliberate handball yesterday.
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Old 07-03-19, 09:50 AM   #74
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Doesn't the ref get any help from the fourth ref to assess things like these? I'd rather not use VAR if it isn't cutting out mistakes.
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Old 07-03-19, 10:13 AM   #75
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As a minimum requirement, they must adopt the Rugby system:

• Ref micked up
• Used only for clear & obvious errors
• The on-field ref can ask for opinion from VAR ref,
• The VAR ref cannot influence the on-field ref until opinion is asked for
• Reviews shown on stadium screens
• Review in real-time from various angles
• Slow-mo only used when in real-time repeats have been shown
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Old 07-03-19, 11:36 AM   #76
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Used only for clear & obvious errors
The on-field ref can ask for opinion from VAR ref,
Bit of an issue there. If the ref feels his decision is an obvious error then he would make a difference decision. If he doesn't think he's made an error but has, the VAR couldn't intervene. IMO, the VAR should overrule the referee in cases of errors, whether the ref likes it or not. Ref should get a message to say something is being reviewed and then get the outcome. This should only happen in exceptional circumstances, ideally where there is no scope for interpretation. There will always be some grey areas and scope for disagreement, but the line needs moving significantly away from the level of intervention than is being used at the moment.
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Old 07-03-19, 01:57 PM   #77
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As a minimum requirement, they must adopt the Rugby system:

ē Ref micked* up
ē Used only for clear & obvious errors
ē The on-field ref can ask for opinion from VAR ref,
ē The VAR ref cannot influence the on-field ref until opinion is asked for
ē Reviews shown on stadium screens
ē Review in real-time from various angles
ē Slow-mo only used when in real-time repeats have been shown
*mic'd or mic'ed.
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Old 07-03-19, 02:00 PM   #78
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*mic'd or mic'ed.
Maybe he wants refs to carry a can of Guinness and wear green velvet suits
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Old 19-03-19, 08:07 PM   #79
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Old 19-03-19, 08:35 PM   #80
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