How much are you prepared to pay for Football? - Page 3

paulg · 18-08-14, 02:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dom9

Do you watch streams Paul?

No, mainly cos I can never find decent ones and spend ages mucking about with different ones. So gave up. If the game isn't on BT then it's the only time I have TalkSport on. This weekend was cool, doing the gardening with my earphones in and jumping about when we scored. Bit ridiculous as I look like a demented mime, but hey

dom9 · 30-09-14, 04:01 PM

Good old Virgin have made an official complaint about the cost of watching football on telly.

It's good to see that they have taken on board my feedback to them.

Trouble is I'm sure it's doomed to failure because the present absurd situation is caused directly by European legislation.

http://www.bbc.com/news/business-29426570

Quote:

Virgin Media has asked broadcast regulator Ofcom to open an investigation into the way that the Premier League sells the TV rights to its live football games.

The cable firm says the auction process is driving up prices for fans and causing "significant consumer harm".

Ofcom said it was "considering" the complaint.

The Premier League said its audio-visual rights had "always been sold in a transparent and open process".

"Regulators have examined our rights packaging and sales process in considerable detail in the past and found both of them to be compliant with UK and European competition law," it added in a statement.

Price rises

"UK fans pay the highest prices in Europe to watch football on TV," said Virgin Media's chief corporate affairs officer Brigitte Trafford.

Earlier this year Virgin Media, owned by Liberty Global, said it did not plan to bid in the next auction.

However, Virgin says it is still affected because it has to pay higher prices to buy the sports channels from BSkyB and BT.

BSkyB and BT currently share the rights to televise the Premier League football games.

The price for the latest rights deal - covering 2013-16 - rose 70% to £3bn when it was announced in 2012.

Virgin Media filed its complaint to Ofcom earlier this month.

Ofcom said it would take about eight weeks to consider the complaint "before deciding whether any further action is required".

Muddled · 30-09-14, 04:30 PM

BT throwing money around to blow Sky out of the water isn't helping.

That snippet about a 70% increase is crazy.

dom9 · 30-09-14, 04:42 PM

The breaking up of TV coverage into 6 packages, with no more than 4 packages going to one provider is the problem here.

The Euro people found that having one broadcaster owning the sole rights to all live games was uncompetitive for the consumer. Now that the coverage is split into six parts, between two parties (in this case), it means that each package is attracting a super premium. If you want to watch all the games, you need to buy a TV deal from each vendor.

The real way to introduce fair competition to benefit consumers would be for more than TV company to be allowed to show the same games. Consumers would be faced with a choice of how to watch the game live, rather than which lives games to watch. Prices would tumble. The BBC could even compete. That would never happen.

It's a spectacular own goal of regulation.

Charly · 30-09-14, 04:42 PM

Kin virgin.

I have to watch football on my pc these days. virgins online service was awful. sky make virgin customers use their portal this season, and its much improved. I would not have minded if virgin were not an isp with their own fibre connection. should be their speciallity. instead i got timed out every 15 min...

dom9 · 30-09-14, 04:44 PM

Why don't you watch it on a television?

dom9 · 30-09-14, 11:33 PM

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/29427511

Quote:

Premier League: Would an Ofcom probe burst commercial bubble?

More than any other source of revenue, TV rights are what has propelled the Premier League towards its current status as the richest football league in the world.

They are, of course, what fuelled the record £835m expenditure in this summer's transfer window, enabling England's top clubs to lure some of the game's biggest stars.
With BT providing the first real competition to the league's traditional broadcast partner Sky, the next three-year TV deal is worth a staggering £3bn - a 71% increase on the last agreement. This of course, is music to the ears of Premier League chief Richard Scudamore, club owners under increasing pressure to balance the books, the players and their agents.

But it is also these TV rights, the Premier Leagues argues, that allows it to invest £340m into youth development in the form of its Elite Player Performance Plan, and a further £23m each year on good causes such as grassroots facilities. Many critics argue that these should be bigger numbers, and that this bonanza should be used to reduce ticket prices, but that is a different story for another day.

It is natural, therefore, that any perceived threat to this ultra-lucrative status quo might cause shudders in club boardrooms up and down the country, and at the Premier League's Gloucester Place HQ.

So how significant is Virgin Media's request that Ofcom opens a formal investigation into the way the Premier League sells its TV rights, and what will happen next?

First of all, Ofcom is giving nothing away in terms of whether it is likely to agree to look into the arrangement, and typically takes about eight weeks before deciding on such matters. Virgin Media lodged its complaint two weeks ago, so we have some time to go before we hear whether the Premier League will face a formal probe.

Virgin Media is positioning itself as consumer champion, highlighting the fact that UK fans pay the highest prices in Europe to watch football on TV, adding that a further 60% rise in the cost of the rights is predicted in the next auction. Virgin Media says it is unfair that fans in the UK have to pay £51 monthly for access to all top-flight matches on TV, while it is £25 in Italy, £21 in Germany, £18 in Spain and as little as £10 in France.

Back in 2006, the Premier League did a deal with the European Commission, which had found its collective selling of TV rights restricted competition. The League was allowed to continue selling its rights on behalf of all its clubs, as opposed to the model in Spain, for instance, where clubs strike their own TV deals. But the League had to ensure no single bidder could acquire all the rights, and to commit to increased competition and consumer choice.

Virgin Media argues that this simply has not happened, with fans having to pay more than ever - and more than anywhere else - to watch live matches. The cable TV operator wants more matches to be broadcast live, and for these games to be broadcast simultaneously on both Sky and BT for instance - so that fans can choose one or the other to watch all the available matches. At the moment, fans who want to see all the live games have no choice but to buy both Sky and BT. Virgin Media say that if both networks showed all the games, there would then be real choice, proper competition, and costs would come down.

But as ever in sports business, there is a lot going on behind the scenes. Virgin Media are unhappy with the amount of money they have to pay Sky and BT to show live football on their cable networks, and it is in their interests of course to try to engineer some downward pressure on the cost of these wholesale rights. Virgin Media say they make no money from the football rights they buy, and are desperate for the cost to come down. This is all part of that attempt.

The Premier League argues it has the balance right when it comes to the number of matches broadcast live in this country; 154 out of 380 possible games. Televise traditional Saturday 3pm kick-off matches, it says, and it will have a detrimental effect on attendances at Football League clubs, and on grassroots participation up and down the country.

Football League chief executive Shaun Harvey, said: "Football's long-standing blocked hours on Saturday afternoons are there to protect attendances at all levels of the domestic game and their continued existence has to be in football's wider interests.

Ticket revenue remains the biggest single source of income for Football League clubs and is worth around £200m per season to our clubs. Therefore, any move to allow televised matches to compete with games played at 3.00pm on a Saturday afternoon could potentially be catastrophic for the game in this country."

And when it comes to choice, the Premier League is adamant that fans have more options than ever when it comes to consuming content, live on TV with two providers, live on radio via BBC Radio 5 live, Talksport and Absolute, online highlights via News International and then TV highlights via Match of the Day.

The League also points to the equitable way it divides up its TV revenue between its clubs, insisting that this contrasts favourably with countries like Spain where Real Madrid and Barcelona gain an unfair advantage through direct selling, and La Liga becomes predictable as a result.

And what of the broadcasters? Have football rights become too expensive for them? Hardly. BSkyB's profits fell last year because of the £760m it had to fork out for Premier League rights. But its profits were still more than half a billion pounds. That hardly suggests Rupert Murdoch has overpaid.

The middle season of the Premier League's three-year deal with Sky and BT has only just got under way. But already, Scudamore and his team are preparing to begin the auction process for the next 2016-19 deal early next year. So should they and the clubs be worried by Virgin Media's intervention?

Toby Syfret, from media experts Enders, says this. "If nothing else, this is is a timely reminder of the importance of the public, who must ultimately bear the brunt of the escalation in top-league rights, already so much higher in the UK than anywhere else in Europe.

"Assuming Ofcom intervenes, it opens up the prospect that we will not only see much lower inflation of these rights than predicted at the next auction, but maybe also wider choice and lower price per game."

Good news potentially for the consumer then. Privately, the Premier League acknowledges that there is every chance that Ofcom will take this opportunity to launch an investigation into the way it sells its TV rights.

It may even have to change the number of rights packages it sells, and the number of games that are broadcast live. But it also remains confident that such is the competition between broadcasters, and the desire to sell subscriptions, advertising, phone and internet services through football, that whatever happens, the demand will be maintained, and the money will continue to pour in.

And that, ultimately is the point.

As long as the likes of Angel Di Maria and Radamel Falcao can be tempted to ply their trade here, as long as Leicester City can beat Man Utd 5-3, as long as the title race goes down to the final day, and as long as it continues to provide the kind of soap opera that other forms of entertainment struggle to match, then the Premier League will be in demand.

All good things, they say, must come to an end. And there are some signs that at a time when many families are struggling to make ends meet, the cost of watching football live on TV is becoming prohibitive for some.

But those who believe today's news may bring about a burst in the Premier League's commercial bubble may be disappointed.

The estate agents and luxury car dealers of Surrey and Cheshire can rest easy, for now.

Charly · 01-10-14, 07:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dom9

Why don't you watch it on a television?

Kids, Wife, Cat... in that order.

Alex · 01-10-14, 09:14 PM

The idea of the same games going to 2 different broadcasters is my preferred option. Or even a 3rd choice of online only. I'd pay to watch any game. Then I can choose how I do it. At the moment it costs too much to watch them all. As such I had to miss out on the Derby at the weekend because BT sport is a waste of money.

Just watched it on MOTD.

dom9 · 06-10-14, 12:49 PM

Did you watch the derby on a dodgy stream?

Alex · 06-10-14, 12:54 PM

No, didnt as it happened. Had it on the radio. But watched it on MOTD.

BobTheCharmer · 06-10-14, 01:12 PM

For me BT Sports is good value and its Sky that is a rip off.

I'm with Virgin and having not had access to live premiership football though my TV since Setana went bust, upgrading my box to Tivo and getting XL package which includes BT Sport for about £10 a month more than I was paying has meant I now get some lives games in the comfort of my home. But if I want Sky I have to pay £150 for a season ticket or £27 a month to get Sky Sports through Virgin.

It's all a con though.

Pablo · 06-10-14, 01:26 PM

I've got Sky Go working via my dad's virgin account now. I hook it up to the TV now and it looks perfect

For the non-Sky games (BT Sport or Setanta Ireland etc.) I still have the streaming site I pay £3.50 a month for.

£3.50 a month and that's me covered for all of the sports channels

Muddled · 06-10-14, 01:28 PM

Please tell me more about the streaming site, Pabs.

dom9 · 10-02-15, 06:20 PM

Bump>

rodo · 10-02-15, 06:24 PM

at the moment vpn £4 a month xbmc nbc sports extra every prem game live easy really

Keyser Soze · 10-02-15, 06:31 PM

Do you need a US address to sign up to NBC?

Alex · 10-02-15, 06:33 PM

Going to cost BT and Sky £10m per game for the right, that's not including production costs. Fuck me.

rodo · 10-02-15, 06:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Keyser Soze

Do you need a US address to sign up to NBC?

not at the moment mate there is just an xbmc add on although dunno if they have any plans to change anything

Keyser Soze · 10-02-15, 06:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rodo

not at the moment mate there is just an xbmc add on although dunno if they have any plans to change anything

Thanks, it's something i'll look in to for next season.

ChesterDave · 10-02-15, 07:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alex

Going to cost BT and Sky £10m per game for the right, that's not including production costs. Fuck me.

Yup. Radio 2 highlighted it was over £100,000 per minute

Alex · 10-02-15, 09:08 PM

Ticket prices will continue to raise, Burgers will still cost £6, getting to the game will still be expensive, replica shirts will cost £60. Nothing will change apart from a select group of players getting more money when they sign in a few years.

The Premier League is in danger of becoming isolated in its financial power. The team that finishes bottom of the Premier League gets more money than the winner of any other league in Europe.

Wealth distribution is good, but its better if its towards the lower end of the game more.

shanks69 · 10-02-15, 09:24 PM

the winners will be the clubs,the players, sky/bt and sponsors us the fans the big losers.

Alex · 10-02-15, 09:45 PM

Considering cancelling my Sky Sports after The Ashes this summer. Its a lot of money for watching Liverpool a couple of times a month.

Boogs · 10-02-15, 11:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alex

Considering cancelling my Sky Sports after The Ashes this summer. Its a lot of money for watching Liverpool a couple of times a month.

Yup I'm the same. Calling it a day after the cricket.

dom9 · 12-02-15, 11:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shanks69

the winners will be the clubs,the players, sky/bt and sponsors us the fans the big losers.

I'm not even sure the clubs are the winners. They'll still blow every single penny on trying to be successful, and they will still struggle to meet FPP.

This might finally be a watershed for Sky. Although we'll see how many people ditch pay TV when push eventually comes to shove.

The real winners are the players, and the agents.

Scaramanga · 12-02-15, 11:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alex

Considering cancelling my Sky Sports after The Ashes this summer. Its a lot of money for watching Liverpool a couple of times a month.

I did this over a year ago. Watching games legally (ie ignoring any streaming options), I get by with BT sport being free with Virgin plus a now tv box which included a pass for 6 games, after which it's £6.99 per game.

Throw in a couple of games watched in the pub and I'm pretty much sorted for the season.

Tee · 12-02-15, 01:09 PM

Will NOWtv work with a standard SKY HD box?

Scaramanga · 12-02-15, 01:13 PM

its a separate box, or you can use a ROKU and/or download the now tv app.

I think you need to make an original box purchase though to get the free games.

Oh, and its not HD which is sometimes annoying

BobTheCharmer · 12-02-15, 01:49 PM

How does the NOW box play? Picture quality wise.

What I mean is, I use the NOWTV app through my xbox360, the picture I get is clear but its not TV clear if you get my drift, its a bit like a film version of football, like dream team used to look on sky. Now this may be because the xbox is old and the connection is wired, my tv is fairly old and isn't full HD or all games streamed look this way?

Scaramanga · 12-02-15, 04:26 PM

its not crisp HD but its bearable

rodo · 12-02-15, 05:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BobTheCharmer

How does the NOW box play? Picture quality wise.

What I mean is, I use the NOWTV app through my xbox360, the picture I get is clear but its not TV clear if you get my drift, its a bit like a film version of football, like dream team used to look on sky. Now this may be because the xbox is old and the connection is wired, my tv is fairly old and isn't full HD or all games streamed look this way?

every game I watch stream wise on nbc and premier league pass looks that way and they are both official streams

Alex · 24-03-15, 09:51 AM

Got rid of Sky Sports today. Its £25 a month for something I hardly ever watch.

If I am desperate to watch a game at home Ill get a Now TV pass for the day. But even then I dont know that I can be bothered.

I get far more entertainment off Netflix for £6 a month. Only thing I am gutted to miss out on is The Ashes this summer. But im sure Ill find a way.

Daniel 7 · 26-03-15, 11:39 AM

I'm thinking of doing the same thing Alex. What's the deal with this now TV business? I've never thought of it.

The only potential fly in the ointment for me is the F1 coverage - I really like F1 (cue howls of derision from people who can't understand it

), and the only real alternative is the BBC coverage, which is mainly highlight packages.

Oh yeah, I have a BT Sport package too. Never watch it!

dom9 · 26-03-15, 11:44 AM

I understand Formula 1 and that is why I don't like it.

dom9 · 26-03-15, 11:45 AM

Btw, BT are re-entering the mobile market and will be offering premier league football to their mobile subscribers for no extra cost.

Rich · 26-03-15, 11:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dom9

I understand Formula 1 and that is why I don't like it.

Completely understand the snoozefest.

Alex · 26-03-15, 11:45 AM

http://www.nowtv.com/sports

Its £6.99 a day, or £10.99 a week.

So for a Test Match itll cost me a tenner. I can stomach that a few times. I guess for you itll be £6.99 per race that isnt on BBC. Thats got to be cheaper than Sky Sports?

Look into a Now TV Box or a Roku. Both can connect to a TV and stream it to that. I dont think its HD though.

Alex · 26-03-15, 11:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dom9

Btw, BT are re-entering the mobile market and will be offering premier league football to their mobile subscribers for no extra cost.

Premier League Football is the bait to lock people into their ecosystem. Its a good idea. Just a shame I dont like BT customer service and doubt id ever use them for anything.

Muddled · 26-03-15, 12:32 PM

We've been live on Sky Sports 22 times so far this season which is £153.78 if you'd paid for a day pass each time. What is the cost of Sky Sports (stand alone) if you stripped the price back? £25? That's £300 for a calendar year.

If we're live for another ten matches before the season is out, that leaves you ten more sporting events (granted, it would have to be on another day to your day pass) that you can watch before you're paying more.

All our live games, ten F1 races and a couple of tests and you're probably paying more than a yearly subscription. It's expensive, but so are the alternatives in a round about way.