Last 16

[Leyton388]

Lynching maybe ?

Reminds me of that Simpsons episode where all of Springfield turn up to attack the plane when their football team arrives home

No mate not a Lynching LOL. But a lot of them should not play for England again. We need to select young hungry players who will put a shift in.

[Mostar]

You forget who is in charge at Real?A REAL winner.Of course he would win trophies there.Also i know he wants to win the league title with Liverpool,but under current circumstances it's impossible.

Let's wait and see. Just because they have a flamboyant Jose and bottomless budget that does not mean that their success will be any greater. Many before him tried and failed and I wouldn't be surprised if he follows the suit. Barca will certainly have something to say and it has spoken very load in the past.

[EwarWoo]

I never expected us to go all the way. In fact I never expected us to get through this tie to be honest, but to come close and go out with some pride would have been nice.

[Kenneth]

All this talk of passion, fight etc etc....is it really that?

Maybe, just maybe, english footballers just arent among the world's best?

After all, since 1990, england have only managed 1 semi final appearance, 2 quarter finals, 2 second round exits and 1 failure to qualify. Compare that the the record of Germany, Brazil etc. They're just good and england arent.

England have no record of doing well at major finals, so i dont know why people expect differently.

Because I do believe that man-for-man, England are at least as good as that Germany side. There's another reason other than just it being the players. There are about 4 or 5 first XI England players who aren't up to it, and we notice that, but I think the same is true of the Krauts. There's something else and I don't know what it is.

[SK]

On a tangent - do you still trust Rafa?
To sort us out I mean...

if it's true he's taking lucas to inter, then he's doing a good job in sorting a few of our problems..

[paulg]

England are good enough, but no amount of individual ability makes up for a team that doesn't play together or for each other.
They don't care but they still expect the fans to spend big bucks to follow them around the world and cheer on while they wander about doing **** all.

Germany aren't that good, but we looked like a pub side today.

[Craig_H]

Because I do believe that man-for-man, England are at least as good as that Germany side. There's another reason other than just it being the players. There are about 4 or 5 first XI England players who aren't up to it, and we notice that, but I think the same is true of the Krauts. There's something else and I don't know what it is.

It's not about man-for-man though, otherwise teams like Wigan wouldnt beat Liverpool.

As a team collective, england are average to decent - nothing more and certainly not at the level of world cup challengers. England havent been world cup contenders for 20 years, so why people think they stand a chance, is beyond me.

[Craig_H]

England are good enough, but no amount of individual ability makes up for a team that doesn't play together or for each other.
They don't care but they still expect the fans to spend big bucks to follow them around the world and cheer on while they wander about doing **** all.

Germany aren't that good, but we looked like a pub side today.

Clearly they're not. If england always got to the latter stages and ****ed it up once, you could say it's a one-off. But they always go out early.

It's the germans who always seem to get to the latter stages. Because they are just better.

[Kenneth]

It's not about man-for-man though, otherwise teams like Wigan wouldnt beat Liverpool.

As a team collective, england are average to decent - nothing more and certainly not at the level of world cup challengers. England havent been world cup contenders for 20 years, so why people think they stand a chance, is beyond me.

But it's not the same 'team collective' as 20 years ago. Must be something in the England team culture to survive multiple managers and teams. Would put the blame mainly at the maneger if it was just one tournament, afterall, Capello was very poor, but there must be more.

[EwarWoo]

There's something else and I don't know what it is.

Got me the greatest English sporting achievement in recent history is making the final of the last RWC. Because they're the only team in recent history to perform beyond their talent and show some bottle, so it's better even than the win in the one before.

That's what's missing. And it's not just in the football.

our sportsmen are a bunch of pampered prima donna's who expect everything on a plate and who have no fight.

[paulg]

It's not about man-for-man though, otherwise teams like Wigan wouldnt beat Liverpool.

As a team collective, england are average to decent - nothing more and certainly not at the level of world cup challengers. England havent been world cup contenders for 20 years, so why people think they stand a chance, is beyond me.

I wish we'd just be honest, players, management and media and just say "if we get to the last 16, it's an achievement". All this build up is ludicrous and, yes, we've proved that the hype is vastly above what we can do.

At least Brazil, Italy and Germany have the right to expect to win it.

[Kenneth]

Clearly they're not. If england always got to the latter stages and ****ed it up once, you could say it's a one-off. But they always go out early.

It's the germans who always seem to get to the latter stages. Because they are just better.

Really insightful.

In what way? WHat is it that makes them better, because it isn't the abilities of the players.

[Mostar]

England are good enough, but no amount of individual ability makes up for a team that doesn't play together or for each other.
They don't care but they still expect the fans to spend big bucks to follow them around the world and cheer on while they wander about doing **** all.

Germany aren't that good, but we looked like a pub side today.

Perhaps your opinion will change after Argentina game (if Argos are through). I actually think they are quite good offensively and to me the only question is if they will be able to control the ball possession and Messi.

[paulg]

Perhaps your opinion will change after Argentina game (if Argos are through). I actually think they are quite good offensively and to me the only question is if they will be able to control the ball possession and Messi.

Defensively Germany were leaky, even in the group stages. Argentina are ropey defensively, too.

Uruguay and Brazil look the most rounded of the teams left, I think.

[Mattshark]

Really insightful.

In what way? WHat is it that makes them better, because it isn't the abilities of the players.

Better passing, movement, creativity, pace, effort, ambition and finishing.