Final and Match for Third Place

[SB]

i heard he's doubtful for tommorow, but you never know..plus paul the octopus said the germans will win

Back injury reportedly but I bet he plays so he can equal the record for PTP

[-V-]

I'll tell you all something right now for a fact. Holland can only win if they do what the Swiss did. They have to sit very deep and park the bus and then try to hit spain on the counter. Its the only way. Hollands attacking front 4 are all very capable of hurting spain with fast counter attacks. But if they try to outplay spain and play their normal game then spain will cut through their defence like a knife through butter

[Mattshark]

I'll tell you all something right now for a fact. Holland can only win if they do what the Swiss did. They have to sit very deep and park the bus and then try to hit spain on the counter. Its the only way. Hollands attacking front 4 are all very capable of hurting spain with fast counter attacks. But if they try to outplay spain and play their normal game then spain will cut through their defence like a knife through butter

That is of course if Spain remember what a final ball is!

[Craig_H]

I'll tell you all something right now for a fact. Holland can only win if they do what the Swiss did. They have to sit very deep and park the bus and then try to hit spain on the counter. Its the only way. Hollands attacking front 4 are all very capable of hurting spain with fast counter attacks. But if they try to outplay spain and play their normal game then spain will cut through their defence like a knife through butter

Agree with you V. I was discussing this with a colleague on friday and we both agreed that if Holland learn to play with a sense of organisation and discipline, they could do something against Spain.

Problem is though, Holland do not have this in their makeup. They can only play one way and that isnt to sit back and get 2 banks of four behind the ball.

They'll try to out-football Spain and they'll lose.

Furthermore, whilst neither side are known for defensive solidity, Spain's back 4 of Ramos, Pique, Puyol and Capdevilla pisses all over Holland's backline, in terms of being strong, solid and difficult to break down.

Spain can be organised and hard to get through at the back. I dont think Holland can.

[Craig_H]

That is of course if Spain remember what a final ball is!

You've banged on about this supposed weakness in Spain's play, but the fact it, they are in the final. Not the amazing Germans, not the free flowing Argentina, not the 'golden generation' england. It's Spain. People slate their constant passing all day long, but i'd like to see how others fare when the opposition just put 10 men behind the ball and invite them to try and score.

They've done awfully well to get where they are, without having ever played a 'final ball'.

[Mattshark]

You've banged on about this supposed weakness in Spain's play, but the fact it, they are in the final. Not the amazing Germans, not the free flowing Argentina, not the 'golden generation' england. It's Spain. People slate their constant passing all day long, but i'd like to see how others fare when the opposition just put 10 men behind the ball and invite them to try and score.

They've done awfully well to get where they are, without having ever played a 'final ball'.

Yes, they have David Villa to thank for that, he has been outstanding for them.

[The_weatherman]

You've banged on about this supposed weakness in Spain's play, but the fact it, they are in the final. Not the amazing Germans, not the free flowing Argentina, not the 'golden generation' england. It's Spain. People slate their constant passing all day long, but i'd like to see how others fare when the opposition just put 10 men behind the ball and invite them to try and score.

They've done awfully well to get where they are, without having ever played a 'final ball'.

I think most teams just looked at what Inter did and copied that, it's hard to play against something like that all the time and on this level if teams are going to spend most of the time behind the ball it's going to difficult for the opposition no matter who that is.

[Craig_H]

Yes, they have David Villa to thank for that, he has been outstanding for them.

And Argentina have Messi, the world's best player. Yet, they got dumped out.

Maybe your criticism of Spain is somewhat misplaced and they are just a brilliant side.

[Craig_H]

I think most teams just looked at what Inter did and copied that, it's hard to play against something like that all the time and on this level if teams are going to spend most of the time behind the ball it's going to difficult for the opposition no matter who that is.

Exactly. People are slating Spain for lacking this final ball etc, but it's very easy to underestimate how difficult it is when you're hot favourites, had a brilliant Euros and when the opposition are so scared, that their entire gameplan is to just put everyone behind the ball and stop you playing.

Having won the euros and had the pressure of being favourites at this world cup, people were always going to set their stall out to simply stop Spain playing - anti football at its best and it worked in one game, but since then, Spain have had the balls and experience to stick to their own game and it's worked for them.

Easy for people to criticise them for their 'no final ball' but if/when they go home with the world cup, i know who'll have had the last laugh.

[Mattshark]

And Argentina have Messi, the world's best player. Yet, they got dumped out.

Maybe your criticism of Spain is somewhat misplaced and they are just a brilliant side.

And Messi had a pretty poor world cup, Villa on the other hand has been excellent

No it isn't, while Spain are a brilliant side, they haven't played brilliantly.

[-V-]

Spain haven't played brilliant because they are using 2 defensive midfielders which restricts their creativity. If they had removed Busquets and played another attacker then we would have seen more Barcelona like performances. But what they have done is been very effective and solid at the back.

[Mattshark]

Spain haven't played brilliant because they are using 2 defensive midfielders which restricts their creativity. If they had removed Busquets and played another attacker then we would have seen more Barcelona like performances. But what they have done is been very effective and solid at the back.

But that should be countered by them having attacking fullbacks. That is the point of the holding mid's.

[-V-]

But that should be countered by them having attacking fullbacks. That is the point of the holding mid's.

Yes but Ramos lacks a good final ball and Capdevilla doesn't seem to be trusted by his team-mates. He offers the overlap and alot of the time they just use him as a decoy. But it doesn't matter they have made it to the final by being more cautious

[Mattshark]

Yes but Ramos lacks a good final ball and Capdevilla doesn't seem to be trusted by his team-mates. He offers the overlap and alot of the time they just use him as a decoy. But it doesn't matter they have made it to the final by being more cautious

I think the issue is that they often haven't played a final ball and commonly haven't got enough men into the box. That is how I have seen it anyway.

[Craig_H]

And Messi had a pretty poor world cup, Villa on the other hand has been excellent

No it isn't, while Spain are a brilliant side, they haven't played brilliantly.

Cos you couldnt possibly or remotely ever be wrong about anything, could you? Not the great mattshark Arrogance beyond belief.