Jonjo Shelvey

[Exiled_red]

His form has gone to pieces since around December. Dreadful of late. I still think he's got it but needs to go and play somewhere every week for a season.

I've been thinking about loaning players out recently and I think that Man Utd's players do well after coming back from loans because of a couple of factors: firstly they tend to loan out players multiple times at an increasing level each time, and they continue to loan players out even when they are on the fringes of their squad. Think what Man Utd did Cleverly when they loaned him out to Wigan, he was probably in a similar situation in his development to where Shelvey is now, I think that we are unlikely to loan out players on the fringes of our squad (perhaps because our squad is weaker), but in terms of the player development this is the time where players need more games to push on, if they just sit on the bench for a year (as Shelvey is doing at the moment) their development will be hampered. I think Shelvey needs to be loaned out to another PL club next season, and I think there are a number of other players that are on the fringes of the squad that need to go out on loan for a couple of years (Flanagan, Robinson, Suso etc)

[BigChief]

Shelvey's a weird one. Keeps getting the manager's confidence yet keeps turning up like a rabbit caught in headlights. Can't have him standing in the way of other talent waiting to burst through plus players purchases like Coutinho, Ince?, Erikson?

Personally I reckon Shelvey's blown it and the next loan will be in the secret hope the club are looking to buy him.

[RichC]

I think a loan would suit him at the moment, he's been pretty poor since the back end of last year and needs to get a run of games.

[Captain Stu]

Current midfield is Lucas + Gerrard deep + 1 attacking centre mid, Henderson suits that role far better than anyone else.

[Muddled]

I think Shelvey's future will be as a 'squaddie'.

He seems to be a Jack of all trades, master of none and doesn't seem to be able to make a position his own.

[Captain Stu]

I think Shelvey's future will be as a 'squaddie'.

He seems to be a Jack of all trades, master of none and doesn't seem to be able to make a position his own.

Brendog wants to groom him as a future #10 but Suso is in the same mould and I think there's more to his game, a more intelligent player.

[cream]

I think Shelvey's future will be as a 'squaddie'.

He seems to be a Jack of all trades, master of none and doesn't seem to be able to make a position his own.

Aye, he's an ok player at times, nothing more.

[Muddled]

Agreed. Suso looks lighter on his toes and - like you say - seems to be more aware of his surroundings.

Shelvey just seems to be stuck in second gear and has a decent shot on him; looking at the direction our team seems to be heading - it's Suso that looks more fitting of a Rodgers project (c) and more suitable to the group (c).

[The Birdman]

He's 20 years old, everyone is posting as if he's a 28 year old with 50 caps having a run of bad form.

[Muddled]

I'm aware of his age. I just don't see what he offers as a player, other than a dynamic spell during a period of the odd game, here and there. He clearly has attributes, but none that make him a stand out candidate for any position under Rodgers.

All in my opinion of course.

[The Birdman]

I'm aware of his age. I just don't see what he offers as a player, other than a dynamic spell during a period of the odd game, here and there. He clearly has attributes, but none that make him a stand out candidate for any position under Rodgers.

All in my opinion of course.

I agree he's struggling but not sure what posters (in general) expect.
Take Cleverley at Man U for example, he's 23 and had played 75 games across 3 loan spells before coming back to Utd where he has played about 20 games.
All those games for Man U are as a 23 year old.

Shelvey has played 40/50 for us by the age of 20. 20.

In my opinion Shelvey can play anywhere across the midfield 5 in a 4-2-3-1.
He has the passing and physicality to sit, he has the technical ability to play anywhere in the higher '3'.

Is he good enough to right now? no.
Is Suso? No
Is Sterling? No
Is Borini? No

We're asking kids to play and perform regularly as if they are seasoned PL players and internationals.

What also doesn't help Shelvey is I bet he has played in 4/5 different positions for us this season, how is he supposed to nail down a role, understand the responsibilities and positional expectations of it if he is getting picked all over the shop?

[Muddled]

I agree he's struggling but not sure what posters (in general) expect.
Take Cleverley at Man U for example, he's 23 and had played 75 games across 3 loan spells before coming back to Utd where he has played about 20 games.
All those games for Man U are as a 23 year old.

Shelvey has played 40/50 for us by the age of 20. 20.

In my opinion Shelvey can play anywhere across the midfield 5 in a 4-2-3-1.
He has the passing and physicality to sit, he has the technical ability to play anywhere in the higher '3'.

Is he good enough to right now? no.
Is Suso? No
Is Sterling? No
Is Borini? No

We're asking kids to play and perform regularly as if they are seasoned PL players and internationals.

What also doesn't help Shelvey is I bet he has played in 4/5 different positions for us this season, how is he supposed to nail down a role, understand the responsibilities and positional expectations of it if he is getting picked all over the shop?

Good post.

I'm also undecided on Cleverley. However, that could be because my judgement of him is clouded by my hatred of Man Utd, or because I haven't particularly paid *that* much attention to him.

At Wigan I thought he looked competent and whilst he has continued to look tidy in the odd game I have seen of him at Man Utd, I think he'll be moved on for a ridiculous fee, offered by one of Fergie's boys.

Going back to Shelvey, I agree that his versatility is currently looking like his downfall, but in the 4-2-3-1 formation, I still fail to see where he would excel; he doesn't suit - for want of a better expression - the destroyer or quarterback role of the '2', nor does he suit either side of '3'. Perhaps his future is in the centre of that '3', but as mentioned previously, I would prefer to develop Suso into that position, purely because of his game intelligence, his poise and his vision - none of which are offered from Shelvey.

I'm not one to write off any youngster coming through - I got bored of defending my early stance on Henderson - but with Shelvey, I just don't see it.

I think he will be a useful option for squad cover now and I think he will be at 25. I hope I'm wrong and I will be amongst the first to hold my hands up if I am.

[Exiled_red]

I agree he's struggling but not sure what posters (in general) expect.
Take Cleverley at Man U for example, he's 23 and had played 75 games across 3 loan spells before coming back to Utd where he has played about 20 games.
All those games for Man U are as a 23 year old.

Shelvey has played 40/50 for us by the age of 20. 20.

In my opinion Shelvey can play anywhere across the midfield 5 in a 4-2-3-1.
He has the passing and physicality to sit, he has the technical ability to play anywhere in the higher '3'.

Is he good enough to right now? no.
Is Suso? No
Is Sterling? No
Is Borini? No

We're asking kids to play and perform regularly as if they are seasoned PL players and internationals.

What also doesn't help Shelvey is I bet he has played in 4/5 different positions for us this season, how is he supposed to nail down a role, understand the responsibilities and positional expectations of it if he is getting picked all over the shop?

As I mentioned above in the comparison between Shelvey and Cleverley, Man Utd can afford to loan out players who are on the fringes of their squad to the likes of Wigan, rather than giving them the occasional game when someone is injured or a few minutes from the bench (which is the position Shelvey is in at the moment IMO). Having the player available is good in the short term, but long term regular football is better for the players development, I think that too often we have taken the short term view whereas Man Utd have benefited from taking a more long term view, hence often our players haven't lived up to their potential.

I think regular football at another Premiership club (on loan) would allow him to find his best position, show what he can do and allow him to come back in a position to fight for his prefered position in the team. At the moment he's not at the required level, but if we keep him on the bench he isn't going to improve.

[fred_plasticine]

I agree he's struggling but not sure what posters (in general) expect.
Take Cleverley at Man U for example, he's 23 and had played 75 games across 3 loan spells before coming back to Utd where he has played about 20 games.
All those games for Man U are as a 23 year old.

Shelvey has played 40/50 for us by the age of 20. 20.

In my opinion Shelvey can play anywhere across the midfield 5 in a 4-2-3-1.
He has the passing and physicality to sit, he has the technical ability to play anywhere in the higher '3'.

Is he good enough to right now? no.
Is Suso? No
Is Sterling? No
Is Borini? No

We're asking kids to play and perform regularly as if they are seasoned PL players and internationals.

What also doesn't help Shelvey is I bet he has played in 4/5 different positions for us this season, how is he supposed to nail down a role, understand the responsibilities and positional expectations of it if he is getting picked all over the shop?

Good post

[Shackanory]

One thing I don't get. Suso has been sent back to the ressies. Why hasn't Shelvey? He could definitely use the time there well.