Mata

[Roboklopp]

Same here. Too early to analyze our new signings but clearly we threw all eggs in one basket going with British talent only and I am concerned that we haven't "properly diversified"

Yes Kenny has his vision of how he wants things to be done and he signed players that created most chances last year but Adam had a single season at PL level and you cannot say much more for Hendo neither.

We are short on the game changers and without one or 2 more I'm not so sure we'll be able to get into top 4.

Take Suarez out (Stevie is still not fit and who knows what imprint on the next season and when he'll be available) we are the average team at the best. We don't have a single player that can decide the game on his own.

If we don't get this right it will be even more difficult to attract top talent next year and with FFPR in the full swing we may have even less money to spend next year.

I guess will have to wait and see.

Exactly how I see it mate.

If what Balague says is true, I find that pretty grim Reading. That's not to say I'll be getting on Downing's back at the 1st opportunity mind.

[badpiggy]

I totally agree about our need for game changers like Suarez. The thing is though, and I'll admit that I'm covering up a horrible underlying feeling of pessimism about the coming season, you can't build a team on a load of spectacularly gifted players from scratch and guarantee success. That's pretty much Real's Galactico model. If the thinking is to get in players such as Adam, Henderson and Downing who offer something we don't already have - and in all fairness Adam and Downing definitely do this - but have theoretically little or no settling in to do then we should see an improvement.

But all that said, I don't think that sort of improvement alone will win the league. You definitely need at least 3 players that have the skills to make something happen out of nothing when your systems aren't paying off.

[Roboklopp]

Exactly Piggy, don't think anyone is suggesting a Galactico approach though.

[badpiggy]

Exactly Piggy, don't think anyone is suggesting a Galactico approach though.

I still hold out hope for an exciting signing before the end of the window.

[Shanks]

I think in Downing, Gerrard and Suarez, we have game changers..

[CJ]

I think in Downing, Gerrard and Suarez, we have game changers..

not sure. Suarez definitely, Downing - not sure but adds something and will keep creating chances from what i have read (maybe its my definition of game changer rather than anything else) and Gerrard again not sure he can do it like he used to.

there was a good point made about having unpredictable players. they dont always mean better league position. sometimes the team mates find them unpredictable to.

[Norbs]

not sure. Suarez definitely, Downing - not sure but adds something and will keep creating chances from what i have read (maybe its my definition of game changer rather than anything else) and Gerrard again not sure he can do it like he used to.

there was a good point made about having unpredictable players. they dont always mean better league position. sometimes the team mates find them unpredictable to.

Utd have only ever really had Ronaldo in the 'unpredictable' bracket. The rest of their stars over the years have been very good and uber consistent. The team was consistent as a result of that. Ronaldo was so good though that the team could live with it.

[Craig_H]

I love the way you make Ronado sound like he was a handicap for them to overcome

[Norbs]

I love the way you make Ronado sound like he was a handicap for them to overcome

[CJ]

thing is for a time they thought he was. he then became a huge asset for them.

however as with everything the truth is never quite as clear cut as an internet discussion indicates

[Slinky Skills]

To compare us to Villa is just plain ridiculous. Yes they had a spine of British players, but still they are very different from us. They didn't have arguably the best British player the last decade in Gerrard, and they don't have the pulling power when it comes to players like Suarez. I think it's good to have a British spine, and we can build from there, something Villa can't do. Reina, Suarez, Lucas and Meireles already add something extra, and I guess the next step in the Commolli/Kenny masterplan is to add more players like these.

This became more of an answer to the Arn post you quoted dww

=Fierce;2036983]Good grief. You're basically racist

So I hear you're a racist now Father.

[Liverpel]

Sid Lowe
guardian.co.uk, Saturday 30 July 2011 00.35 BST
Article history

Valencia's Juan Mata celebrates scoring during the La Liga match against Espanyol in January. Photograph: Jose Jordan/AFP/Getty Images
Tottenham Hotspur last night sought to beat Arsenal to the signing of the Valencia forward Juan Mata by tabling a bid worth close to €25m (£22m). Arsenal, whose manager, Arsène Wenger, admitted that Mata is a player he likes, remain the favourites to sign the 23-year-old but are yet to make a formal bid. Initial talks have suggested that Arsenal would offer less than Spurs, at least to begin with.

Mata's preference is to join Arsenal but, with Harry Redknapp making little secret of his pursuit of attacking players over the past six months, Spurs are seeking to force Valencia's hand and bring pressure to bear on the player. Mata's camp, though, is awaiting definitive movement from Arsenal. That may yet depend on the departure of Cesc Fábregas. Sources at Barcelona said they are cautiously optimistic about signing the midfielder – and that it was him or no one.

Mata, whose contract allows him to depart Valencia for €21m before 1 August, is open to a move to the Premier League. He already speaks a little English. Valencia, too, are keen to sell, with the sporting director, Braulio Vázquez, admitting: "We are ready if [Mata] does depart." The Spanish club's huge debt requires the annual sale of key players and Mata looks set to follow the footsteps of David Villa and David Silva to the exit.

According to an agreement reached when Mata last renewed his contract, Valencia are obliged to sell to a foreign club that matches the €21m bar before Monday. Spurs have made an offer that exceeds that minimum fee in order to strengthen their hand.

[wiw]

So what is Downing better at than Mata? Mata can be a Downing type of player if he need to be it and be better at it. Can Downing be a Mata type of player. No.

How many years left at the top for Downing? Say two or three. How many years left at the top for Mata? Say seven or eight.

Mata would simply been the better signing. He would have offered us more short and long term.

If he want to leave in three years time or so then we would almost certainly be able to get £25m+ for him. Downing will most probably be finished as a starting XI player at a top club at that time.

But the fact remains that he isn't a Downing type player. If that's the sort of player we wanted, then it's better to get someone who plays that way through instinct rather than instruction

[Craig_H]

What's a 'Downing type player' exactly?

A not top quality winger, who doesnt have electric pace, doesnt skin defenders and isnt anywhere close to being world class?

If so, bingo - we've got one!

[Lecter]

What's a 'Downing type player' exactly?

A not top quality winger, who doesnt have electric pace, doesnt skin defenders and isnt anywhere close to being world class?

If so, bingo - we've got one!

Think you are being harsh on him

One thing Downing is, is an out and out winger who has good delivery (Beckham never had electric pace or got past people yet he could put in great crosses)

Whilst Mata is a far better player technically I'm none convinced that hes an out and out winger

Hes a winger in the same manner that Garcia was, ie not a winger

Could Mata play out wide most probably, could he be as effective as he is inside - I'm not sure. Is he what we need out wide - again I'm not sure