Racism in Football

[Kenneth]

BBC headline says 'Ferdinand makes race row comment'. In the article Ferdinand is quoted as saying he won't comment. Great stuff. This is headline news in what way?

[Craig_H]

[wavydavy]

The Suarez/Evra thing seems to have died on it's arse yet this seems to be rumbling on. I've not been following this that closely. What's the general concensus about what's happened with Terry and Ferdinand?

[Craig_H]

Terry's a cunt.

[Neil Young]

[Liverpel]

The Suarez/Evra thing seems to have died on it's arse yet this seems to be rumbling on. I've not been following this that closely. What's the general concensus about what's happened with Terry and Ferdinand?

The general consensus is that the words "black cunt" were directed at a black man by a cunt.

[IN_RAFA_WE_TRUST]

If it is proven ,he said those words.
What do you think chelsea will do?

[Shaggy]

I think they will stand by him, which would be another example of football's lack of morals and disconnection with reality.

They should sack him. It's a sackable offence in any other walk of life.

[muddym2002]

[quote=Neil Young;2123869][/quote

[Chrono]

If it is proven in the sense that beyond doubt he did say what is claimed without the context Terry implies then he'll get banned from football. Can't see that happening and like Shaggy says they will stand by him.

[IN_RAFA_WE_TRUST]

They will send him to Racialists anonymous innit ? Or something. Along those lines . Counselling?

[BillobShaisley]

A possible angle of where daft old boy Whelan may be coming from. I'll ask some of the more reactionary to try and see the fine line between terms that I am trying to highlight and question.


[Can Opening]

It is IMO a tad absurd that when someone calls someone else a black cunt the issue is about the use of the word black. If he'd called him a ******, Wog or Coon etc then throw the book at him, absolutely, but I don't see the insult in being called black?

I don't see it worse to be a black cunt than a plain old bog standard cunt. Better than being a stupid cunt or an ugly cunt even? If someone calls Lampard a fat cunt, that is ok? Paul Scholes a ginger cunt? Closer to the point, how about Ryan Giggs a welsh cunt?

[Can Wide Open]

I grew up in wales, not quite the same racist baggage I accept, but my point is if someone calls me a sheep shagger there's a racist insult there. An assumption about me personally based on my race. If someone calls me a Welsh Cunt it's a plain old insult there's no race based pre-judgement (prejudice).

[Worms Everywhere]

If the extent of Terry's crime is that he said 'black' in amongst a string of other adjectives, I do have some sympathy for Dave Whelans stance. It's not a gentlemans game anymore, withstanding some unpleasantness has become a neccessity in most sports, even cricket.

Without getting into the debate about role models and TV coverage for which any anti-social behaviour such as swearing or spitting must be considered, or the general question of whether its right or wrong; The question I ask is whether it was a racial insult designed to insult the race rather than the person?

I'd argue not. Terry is an odious horrible cunt, it's well documented. But I don't think he or his vile comments are inherantly racist. Just horrible.

[puts on tin hat]

[Chrono]

If you call someone a black cunt it's because you are using the black as a negative in the same way as cunt. It wasn't observational and something that wouldn't come out of your mouth under such circumstances without intended racism. You could argue that calling someone a sheep shagger is racist too but it's more comical than anything serious although I would imagine some might take offence.

If it wasn't inherantly racist then why didn't he call him a cunt?

[Kenneth]

I dont think you can regard the black bit as purely an adjective tbh. I can accept that the main thrust is calling him a cunt, but the use of the word black in this context would certainly be intended as derogatory and hence racist. Actually, I hate the welsh so welsh cunt would be equivalent

Fair points about why calling people any other kind of cunt is deemed fine in most circles though.

[BillobShaisley]

Chrono - Kenneth

I think there's quite a few assumptions which are far from clear or self evident.

e.g.

using the black as a negative in the same way as cunt.....wouldn't come out of your mouth under such circumstances without intended racism.

- Intended insult for sure, not 100% sure of the racism, why not use a derogatory term instead of the 'plain' black?

the use of the word black in this context would certainly be intended as derogatory and hence racist

- You're making judgements/assumptions about another persons motivation. That opens up Terry's defence of agression without racism.



Interesting lack of parity in opinion when black is substituted for Welsh too.

You could argue that calling someone a sheep shagger is racist too but it's more comical than anything serious although I would imagine some might take offence.

- Id say there's no arguing involved at all, unless there was a specific personal reason for the accusation of bestiality beyond race.