Manchester United

[Deano]

Doesn't Poch have a clause that prevents him joining a top club for x amount of months unless a fee is paid to Sprus ?

[Exiled_red]

Lets hope that there results pick up a bit and Ole moves Fernandes on in January

[Buzzo]

From the BBC. Ouch.

Harry Maguire suffered a shambolic 31 minutes before he put himself out of his own misery as England lost to Denmark at Wembley - his premature departure prompting the question of whether he now needs a longer break from the game.

Manchester United's 27-year-old captain cut a distracted and chaotic figure as he endured a personal nightmare, its conclusion with a red card carrying an air of inevitability from the moment he recklessly launched himself at Yussuf Poulsen to pick up an early yellow.

It was the start of a performance that was almost painful to watch - bad positioning, a suggestion of an injury and then amateurish control that led to the desperate lunge on Kasper Dolberg that not only injured the striker but sent Maguire down the tunnel.

Maguire looked totally devoid of confidence, a lost soul and an accident waiting to happen, which it eventually did.

It comes at the end of a period that looks to have taken its toll on Maguire and, sadly, leaves him looking like a defensive liability for club and country.

Misery for Maguire and England at Wembley - listen to Football Daily podcast
Maguire's troubles started in August when he was given a suspended sentence of 21 months and 10 days in prison after he was found guilty of repeated bodily harm, attempted bribery, violence against public employees and insult after a trial on the Greek island of Syros.

He maintains his innocence and has lodged an appeal - which means a retrial and the conviction being set aside in the meantime - but it feels and looks like the weight of this incident and its public aftermath has carried over into the new season. This normally exuberant, combative character, who revelled in his 'man of the people' persona at the 2018 World Cup in Russia, looks troubled.

Maguire was always extravagantly priced at £80m but a player who is a solid and serviceable Premier League defender and has become one of England manager Gareth Southgate's most trusted squad members now looks hopelessly out of form.

He has cut a struggling figure as United's defence has been run ragged by Crystal Palace, Brighton and, of course, Tottenham in that 6-1 humiliation at Old Trafford.

And when referee Jesus Gil Manzano showed him the red card, Maguire resembled an individual who had hit rock bottom.

England's men have received three red cards in a single calendar year for the first time ever
This was a performance from Maguire that was sending out distress signals from pretty much the first whistle. The control was poor, the discipline was worse, even the simplest of tasks - a pass, a clearance - looked an almighty struggle.

Maguire's display, in a footballing context, must be criticised, but it is clear his fragile form and what seems a confused mental approach to the game will need careful handling, not just by Southgate but, more importantly, by Ole Gunnar Solskjaer at United.

The defender looks like someone who might benefit from some time on the sidelines to gather his thoughts, clear his head and get back to something like the player and personality who had enough impact at Old Trafford after his move from Leicester City to be awarded the captain's armband.

It is a difficult balancing act because Maguire might not wish to be taken out of the line of fire and such are United's current struggles that Solskjaer may feel he needs his leader going in to battle for him.

What is clear is that he will now need more of the sympathy and support Solskjaer and United have given him so far.

Maguire's red card was a low point on a very indifferent night for England - the first time they have had two players sent off, with Chelsea defender Reece James dismissed for dissent after the final whistle.

[RedReet]

Only seems like yesterday there was talk of United winning the title.

[Shaggy]

Chris Waddle tipped them to win it and us to come 3rd

[dom9]

That looks like Phil McNulty's work.

Pretty much the most negative sports journalist out there (unless he's talking about Hodgson). He'd fit right in, contributing to our match threads.

[Buzzo]

Maybe he is Kenneth () ?

I'd agree with him on a lot of his Maguire comment. Big Harry looks totally broken. He was already masquerading as the worlds most expensive CB, and just about holding his head above water, now he is making mistakes in every single game. The run in with the Greeks and the potential of doing time allied to the fact that Man U are not as good as everyone was making out after lockdown seems to have broken him completely.

[Exiled_red]

Maybe he is Kenneth () ?

I'd agree with him on a lot of his Maguire comment. Big Harry looks totally broken. He was already masquerading as the worlds most expensive CB, and just about holding his head above water, now he is making mistakes in every single game. The run in with the Greeks and the potential of doing time allied to the fact that Man U are not as good as everyone was making out after lockdown seems to have broken him completely.

I think that the Greek thing hanging over him is affecting his game, reminds me of the Woodgate and Bowyer situation in the early 2000's. Bowyer was able to play fine week in week out but Woodgate sat out much of the time while that was going on because he couldn't concentrate on his football. It looks like Maguire might be going through something similar.

[Shaggy]

Maybe he is Kenneth () ?

I'd agree with him on a lot of his Maguire comment. Big Harry looks totally broken. He was already masquerading as the worlds most expensive CB, and just about holding his head above water, now he is making mistakes in every single game. The run in with the Greeks and the potential of doing time allied to the fact that Man U are not as good as everyone was making out after lockdown seems to have broken him completely.

He does look completely bereft of confidence - not uncommon in sportsmen or women - but suddenly the conversation seems to have pivoted to "ooh his mental health is not good, let's go on easy on him, poor Harry, he's gone through so much lately, be kind"...etc.

Uh, he had a scrap and got nicked. Most of us have been there ffs. Granted his profile makes it more difficult, but ffs. Perhaps he's just **** and is low on confidence.

[Shaggy]

(I don't mean you btw Buzzo - talking about journalists and the general mood on social media)

[Buzzo]

(I don't mean you btw Buzzo - talking about journalists and the general mood on social media)

I followed you.

Yeah, it is a good point and probably the easiest way to protect a guy who is just playing really, really badly. His problem was he was only just getting away with it last season.

He looks absolutely ****e now.

[Alex]

It has pivoted. But I dont think its the media per say. I watched the game and he looked like he was going to cry when he got sent off. He clearly isn't right mentally.

A lot of this for me goes along with how we should treat mental health doesnt it? Shouldn't the clubs treat it the same as a broken leg etc?

Although its hard to have sympathy for the millionaire footballer whos just bad at football, I agree.

[dom9]

It's probably a bit different for defenders and goalkeepers than forwards.

Look at Karius (and now Adrian). Everyone is now waiting (wanting, even?) for them to make a mistake again. Lovren had that baggage too. De Gea is on that path. Pickford is permanently tainted.

When a forward goes through a patch of limited confidence, the old cliche about scoring a fluky one to get you back up and running again kinda holds.

But if you're a defender, how do you do that? "**** yeah, what a clearance. I'm back on it again." It doesn't work like that.

[Kenneth]

He does look completely bereft of confidence - not uncommon in sportsmen or women - but suddenly the conversation seems to have pivoted to "ooh his mental health is not good, let's go on easy on him, poor Harry, he's gone through so much lately, be kind"...etc.

Uh, he had a scrap and got nicked. Most of us have been there ffs. Granted his profile makes it more difficult, but ffs. Perhaps he's just **** and is low on confidence.

**** him, it's hilarious how he's gone to ****.

[Alex]

Then again, we arent Doctors, so probably shouldn't be diagnosing the guy. Hes just a **** defender who is being coached worse than he was 2 years ago. Thats the main issue he needs to address.