England v Italy match thread

[el matador]

If you say so. I admire your optimism. I would swap him for Oxlade-Chambermaid in a blink of an eye, personally.

Goes without saying I would do the same but its not charity week.

Ox could be a special player. Unfortunately arse got in him.

[dom9]

I

Think

You

Forgot

To

Take

Your

Medication

This

Morning

Did you take it?

[Ams12]

Disagree, We could have easily won every game we have played with some attacking intent something Redknapp loves and Woy despises.

Agree with this! Roy's tactics took most of the attacking play away from the team...it was more to sit and hold formation which allowed Italy (and France) to play right in front of us with time and space on the ball! When we tried to get forward in the first half we caused them problems and im sure i we played with an attacking tactic we would have won within 90mins...bring in Harry!!

[kemm1]

Disagree, We could have easily won every game we have played with some attacking intent something Redknapp loves and Woy despises.

Well I disagree

I'm of the opinion that English football has long been overrated so we're not capable of what you think we can do against these types of teams, so it's an immovable debate.

[el matador]

If you say so. I admire your optimism. I would swap him for Oxlade-Chambermaid in a blink of an eye, personally.

Goes without saying I would do the same but its not charity week.

Ox could be a special player. Unfortunately arse got in him.

[kemm1]

That was as Roy as it's going to get. Some players have to take responsibility for not showing up, but I can't think of manager who would have played similar to that. Even Fat Sam would have looked better in comparison with his percentage football.

As I said Roy is **** but blaming the manager for England's failures at major tournaments has become a national tradition. I just dom't think we're good enough that's why Roy to his credit tried to do what Greece did in 04, but he's not nowhere good enough to execute that.

[kemm1]

I agree in that englands attacking players are inferior to most top tier nations. Young wellbeck rooney and milner wouldnt scare a premier league side let alone a top international one.

If redknapp had got the job we would have been more offensive but we would have conceeded loads more. Redknapp got lucky in that he had modric and bale who are infinitely better.

England had a choice to make in that do they go all out and get tanked by every decent side they play.or do they adopt a more italian style and go for organisation and discipline over expansion and
creativity.

They went with roy for now but roy wont be the long term manager imo. Theyre waiting for a someone else.

Fully agree, but we are a generation away

[kemm1]

Agree with this! Roy's tactics took most of the attacking play away from the team...it was more to sit and hold formation which allowed Italy (and France) to play right in front of us with time and space on the ball! When we tried to get forward in the first half we caused them problems and im sure i we played with an attacking tactic we would have won within 90mins...bring in Harry!!

Then when Harry fails who do you want after that?

[Muddled]

As I said Roy is **** but blaming the manager for England's failures at major tournaments has become a national tradition. I just dom't think we're good enough that's why Roy to his credit tried to do what Greece did in 04, but he's not nowhere good enough to execute that.

Dunno mate, the tradition is to usually make a scapegoat of a player.

If that fails, blame a referee. Then a linesman. Then lack of technology.

Roy has brain-ninja'd all our heads and made us all have low expectations.

We're not world-beaters by any stretch of the imagination, but we should have been more than capable of navigating an easy group and an easy(ish) quarter-final.

[kemm1]

Dunno mate, the tradition is to usually make a scapegoat of a player.

If that fails, blame a referee. Then a linesman. Then lack of technology.

Roy has brain-ninja'd all our heads and made us all have low expectations.

We're not world-beaters by any stretch of the imagination, but we should have been more than capable of navigating an easy group and an easy(ish) quarter-final.

LOL, yeah Roy is truly an abomination to the sport. I do get your point, the teams we have played so far are not great. I don't think this Italian side is nowhere as good as their 2006 WC winning squad, but technically I do believe we are behind them when we match the two teams.

It's just my opinion mate, i think we produce limited players not well rounded ones.

[Liverpool]

if it was a club game, youd expect those england players to win, and if it was a lfc penalty shoot out youd expect them to win as well, the whole loser thing around england is bizarre

[kris90210]

Then when Harry fails who do you want after that?

I like what Germany did a few years ago after they flopped at a major tournament. The came together, conducted a root and branch investigation into the way football was being run, thought about how they wanted to play the game. They put a plan in place and here we are a few years later and they're back to being one of the best sides in the world. So with that in mind...

For me, the first thing that needs to happen is the dismanteling of the old boys club that is the FA. They're a joke of an organisation. Hodgson being installed as manager says it all really.

Secondly, the media needs to be put in its place. For far too long, the English media has been allowed to have far too great an impact on the way England plays the game. You can almost sense the fear when players play for England. This is a tricky one, but something needs to be done.

Thirdly, they need to identify a playing style to aspire to. No matter who the next manager of Spain, Italy or Brazil is, you know the style of football they will play. England should look to replicate this for the sake of continuity. It can't help chopping and changing tactical setups every 4 years.

Fourth, the woeful technical ability of English players needs to be addressed. More development work has to be done with young players, because last night was embarrassing for England. Incapable of keeping possession. Shocking.

Fifth, they should identify a team of people to work on this project and give them time. In the same way as Germany put Klinsmann and Loew in charge. Dare I say, I think there should be a place for Gary Neville in the setup, with a bright upcoming manager. This team should look at best practice across Europe and start putting these things into place.

Sixth, they need to do away with a load of the old guard and start fresh. Start giving the upcoming youngsters international experience.

Basically, a total rethink is required. A total spring clean.

[Buzzo]

Good post Kris, hard to argue with any of that.

I've been in the car today and the Radio 5 live have had quite a few pundits on who have been totally scathing. The only defence of Roy really came from Paddy Barclay (surprise). The reality really seems to have set in with some pundits, that maybe this is as good as it is going to get for England for a while, and certainly Roy is doing a sterling job of lowering expectations (he made no mention of aiming to win the next WC). To be fair to Roy that is a completely accurate assessment, to be unkind to him, he is totally part of the problem.

I also agree with a young manager being ideal for England right now, it is totally unusual for expectations around the England camp to be so low, making it an ideal time to try out a youthful head coach. It is what the country is crying out for, but the FA seem more intent on spunking vast amounts of cash over what they perceive to be tried and tested managers.

One things for sure the goal of the FA should be to try and help the national team win a major competition, it shouldn't be out with the grasps of reality. Yet in employing Roy on a 4 year contract they have shown that they just want more of the same.

The so called 'Golden Generation' are nearing the end of their international careers, and England look to be about to embark on a real down turn in quality (the predicted team for the next Euros looks ****).

For my part as a Scotsman, I have obviously always wanted England to fail but normally I fear they will do rather well, and think they could win some of the games they have lost. There is normally an element of bad luck or misfortune in Englands failings which has been great to watch . Last night and this tournament was something new, a down turn in form from the World Cup (who'd have thought that was possible) and the realisation for me that England are just **** now. A really really average team, easily one of the worst on display in this tournament. 20 good mins against the Italians until they settled and worked out Roys rigid formation would cause them no bother.

I suspect it will be quite some time before we see an England team threatening to win a major tournament.

[kemm1]

I like what Germany did a few years ago after they flopped at a major tournament. The came together, conducted a root and branch investigation into the way football was being run, thought about how they wanted to play the game. They put a plan in place and here we are a few years later and they're back to being one of the best sides in the world. So with that in mind...

For me, the first thing that needs to happen is the dismanteling of the old boys club that is the FA. They're a joke of an organisation. Hodgson being installed as manager says it all really.

Secondly, the media needs to be put in its place. For far too long, the English media has been allowed to have far too great an impact on the way England plays the game. You can almost sense the fear when players play for England. This is a tricky one, but something needs to be done.

Thirdly, they need to identify a playing style to aspire to. No matter who the next manager of Spain, Italy or Brazil is, you know the style of football they will play. England should look to replicate this for the sake of continuity. It can't help chopping and changing tactical setups every 4 years.

Fourth, the woeful technical ability of English players needs to be addressed. More development work has to be done with young players, because last night was embarrassing for England. Incapable of keeping possession. Shocking.

Fifth, they should identify a team of people to work on this project and give them time. In the same way as Germany put Klinsmann and Loew in charge. Dare I say, I think there should be a place for Gary Neville in the setup, with a bright upcoming manager. This team should look at best practice across Europe and start putting these things into place.

Sixth, they need to do away with a load of the old guard and start fresh. Start giving the upcoming youngsters international experience.

Basically, a total rethink is required. A total spring clean.

Spot on
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Apart from the Gary Neville comment of course.

[Buzzo]

Dunno if this has been reported else where but they were talking about Pirlo's pelanty () and apparently he was asked afterwards why he had taken it in that style. The guy was total class last night, to top it off with the ultimate pen was genius Could you ever imagine an England player having the composure to do that?

Despite Italy trailing in the Euro 2012 quarter-final shoot-out following Riccardo Montolivo's miss, Pirlo showed remarkable courage to dink his penalty straight and over the feet of Hart who had lunged to his right.

Explaining his shot, known as a cucchiaio, or spoon in Italian, Pirlo claimed that the imposing figure of Hart, who had been screaming at penalty takers and bouncing up and down on his line, inspired him to place the ball down the middle.

"I saw that the goalkeeper was really fired up and I thought about doing that," he said.

"It was easier to shoot that way and it put a bit of pressure on the goalkeeper."

Pirlo's strike has drawn comparisons with the penalty scored by Czech Antonin Panenka in a Euro 1976 shootout against West Germany. The Italians also found themselves on the receiving end of a similar penalty from French great Zinadene Zidane in the 2006 World Cup final.

Italy coach Cesare Prandelli heaped praise on Pirlo who he described as a "star" in the wake of the shoot-out.

Penalties are a lottery but I thought we deserved victory in the end," said Prandelli.

"When Montolivo missed his penalty I was sad as he was one of the best players tonight. I was watching with my arm around my son and I told him he was lucky he didn't have to buy a ticket.

"When Andrea Pirlo stepped up I was very calm - he's a star and knew what he needed to do; and he did it.

"Around 80% of penalty shoot-outs go down to luck. Some players are used to this kind of pressure, some are just calm in these situations - but mainly it's down to good fortune."

Even England manager Roy Hodgson spoke of his admiration for Pirlo's composure.

"The cool, calculated way Pirlo chipped it, that is something you have or you don't have as a player," he said.

Italian midfielder Daniele De Rossi also heaped praise on Pirlo.

"If I had to choose a lasting image from the game I'd say Pirlo's penalty," he said.

"I'd not seen such a crazy shot as that since the days of Totti."

Former England defender Rio Ferdinand, controversially left out of the national squad for this tournament, took to Twitter to praise Pirlo's all-round performance and penalty strike.

"On a pure footballing note Pirlo just put on a pure footballing master class + the penalty was too much," he wrote.