Long ball stats?

[Shaggy]

West Ham have been awful in alot of games this season though.

Precisely.

[Ron_Mexico]

Do they play more attractive football than us?

Man Utd - Yes
Chelsea - Debatable
Liverpool
Arsenal - Yes
Bolton - FLMAO
Everton - Clearly not
Portsmouth - No
Tottenham - No but it's debatable
Reading - No
Blackburn - No
Aston Villa - Haha, obviously not
Newcastle - No
Man City - Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzz no
Boro - No
Sheff United - Obviously not
Fulham - Hoof it to McBride, Helguson, John or Montella. No.
Wigan - Not at all
West Ham - No
Charlton - No
Watford - No

i think that's about right

we are just inconsistent, to say we're a long ball is team laughable, and we are much more sophisticated then bolton and blackburn- i dont see these teams playing flowing pass and move footie as often as us. the problem is we tend to revert to a more direct approach as soon as things get tough or if we are up against a top side. we also play alot of teams that sit back and defend

mate of mine says he can't figure Liverpool out, at times we are brilliant and other times we look dreadful

[lfc4ever]

i think that's about right

mate of mine says he can't figure Liverpool out, at times we are brilliant and other times we look dreadful

I think that's about right, we still haven't blended the squad yet. either through lack of quality players (and/or finance) and a lack of strength in depth (getting there).

On top of that, everyone wants an instant want it now success, which just doesn't happen.

[Bob]

I think it's probably fair to say Spurs are 'more fun' to watch than us. However, they concede **** loads of goals - so if that's the kind of "entertainment" people want then they can keep it. We've been there and done that under Evans.

Same goes for West Ham. It's all well and good doing it against Wigan (the worst side in the league at the moment) but they're in the bottom three. So they may be entertaining to watch, but again that's not the sort of entertainment I want.

Bad defending is ugly. It might be fun to watch as a neutral, but instances of top class defending can be almost as good to watch as expressive attacking football, so I'd say only the Mancs and Arsenal have genuine claims of playing better football than us. Those two sides play an attractive brand of football and, for the most part, don't defend abysmally.

So on that premise you most prefer watching Chelsea over Arsenal (on the basis of this season)?

I know which i'd prefer.

[Shaggy]

So on that premise you most prefer watching Chelsea over Arsenal (on the basis of this season)?

I know which i'd prefer.

Huh? Given that I've said Arsenal play more attractive football than us, and that Chelsea don't, I'd have thought it was pretty obvious who I'd prefer to watch.

Arsenal for the most part justify their brand of football. They've not just playing this way for two seasons - they won titles playing the same way and went a whole season unbeaten, no less.

So, quite clearly, I'd rather watch Arsenal.

[orri]

Do they play more attractive football than us?

Man Utd - Yes
Chelsea - Debatable
Liverpool
Arsenal - Yes
Bolton - FLMAO
Everton - Clearly not
Portsmouth - No
Tottenham - No but it's debatable
Reading - No
Blackburn - No
Aston Villa - Haha, obviously not
Newcastle - No
Man City - Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzz no
Boro - No
Sheff United - Obviously not
Fulham - Hoof it to McBride, Helguson, John or Montella. No.
Wigan - Not at all
West Ham - No
Charlton - No
Watford - No

Completely agree

[Nicey]

Chelsea play the most disgusting form of football I have ever seen for a top team

[Harv]

I must say i sat down and watched Reading the other week.....they play some lovely football. Fast wing-play, crosses infront of onrushing attackers, it was great stuff.

On that account i would say they play a more "attractive" brand than us.

Granted, its not as successful, its a fine line between playing attractive free flowing football, and shifting goals at rapid rate.

The mancs currently have a great balance. They can attack gung-ho for 15 minutes and then sit back and defend....then if needs be they can attack again. We dont seem to be able to do this, if we go behind we struggle to get back in the game.

Id have Arsenal, Mancs, Tottenham and Reading as more attractive to watch.

we are on par with Chelsea....can be devestating, can also bore the **** out of you.

[Guest]

What a load of bollocks in this thread. Man United are a direct team as they play a vertical game with a very high tempo most of the time. We play an European game, trying to calm the game and pass it at our own tempo and be patient. We certainly don't 'lump' the ball each time and play direct football.

Yes, we have played this way against Everton and against Chelsea, but that's just because Rafa has an array of tactics up his sleeve. Look at how we played against Portsmouth. We played possession football with probably non existant directness in our play. This could certainly be boring, but tagging us a long ball team because of two matches is certainly a bit over the top.

We need more mobile and direct forwards, people who like ball into feet and who can drag a defense all over the place. Our only player who does have fantastic movement upfront is Bellamy, but he still isn't a ball player as he prefers taking the ball into the channels and use his pace, ala Michael Owen.

We need someone very mobile but technically brilliant who can drag defenses and spot a pass and score goals when needed. A Wayne Rooney type of player if you know what I mean. Crouch is certainly not, nor Kuyt (who lacks technique and speed to be truly world class) and Bellers lacks the final ball and doesn't score enough.

If we had these options, we would have been a different team, with more pace. If Gonzales and Pennant had fullfill their potential early in the season, we could have been in for a treat, as we would have got fantastic mobility upfront.

We lack pace and that's why we look like being one dimensional at times. Our central midfielders (Xabi in particular) does not have much movement upfront to spot a pass. We always have to rely on Finnan or Riise to cross the ball which is very predictable. If only we applied the overlap properly but it isn't. The only good overlapping player at the club is Aurelio. That stretches teams and we don't do that enough.

[Michael]

A Hyypia hoof up the field, see so many times during the French man's regime (something Rafa has tried to stamp out) is what most people refer to as a long ball.

An Alonso, or Gerrard 40-60 yard PASS to change the direction of attack is not what I would consider a long ball….. 1. because it is going to a player in space who is unmarked….. 2. because it isn’t aimed at the penalty box.

Yes we play lots of passes, but we are not the typical long ball team…. Is it the definition that needs addressing…. This is why you will sometimes see stats that indicate we play a lot of long balls.


Why do we play long PASSES……


Rafa believes in the philosophy that when you don’t have the ball you should make the pitch as small as possible, making the retention of possession that much more difficult. That why we often see him pressing his hands together, reminding the players to squeeze position, make the pitch small.

When we have possession we want to make the pitch as big as possible…… generating space…. Unfortunately the other team is trying the make the pitch small… so to counter this, he employs a tactic of long lateral and diagonal passes. Played at speed to try and stretch the opposition and in turn generate space.

This tactic explains the purchase of Kuyt…… and the value of his running….. he runs to close space when defending…. And when we attack you will see him running all over the place… trying to find space to stretch out the defending team… looking to receive a long pass….

Simple really…..

I’ve only seen one journalist pick up on this before… he said something along the lines of “to really appreciate Kuyt, you need to see him movement in the flesh, something the TV cameras cannot pick up”

[Guest]

A Hyypia hoof up the field, see so many times during the French man's regime (something Rafa has tried to stamp out) is what most people refer to as a long ball.

An Alonso, or Gerrard 40-60 yard PASS to change the direction of attack is not what I would consider a long ball….. 1. because it is going to a player in space who is unmarked….. 2. because it isn’t aimed at the penalty box.

Yes we play lots of passes, but we are not the typical long ball team…. Is it the definition that needs addressing…. This is why you will sometimes see stats that indicate we play a lot of long balls.


Why do we play long PASSES……


Rafa believes in the philosophy that when you don’t have the ball you should make the pitch as small as possible, making the retention of position that much more difficult. That why we often see him pressing his hands together, reminding the players to squeeze position, make the pitch small.

When we have position we want to make the pitch as big as possible…… generate space…. Unfortunately the other team is trying the make the pitch small… so to counter this, he employs a tactic of long lateral and diagonal passes. Played at speed to try and stretch the opposition and in turn generate space.

This tactic explains the purchase of Kuyt…… and the value of his running….. he runs to close space when defending…. And when we attack you will see him running all over the place… trying to find space to stretch out the defending team… looking to receive a long pass….

Simple really…..

I’ve only seen one journalist pick up on this before… he said something along the lines of “to really appreciate Kuyt, you need to see him movement in the flesh, something the TV cameras cannot pick up”

Great post and spot on on many points mate.

Rafa's teams are reminiscent of the great Milan AC sides of the 90's (the one who crushed Barca in the CL final 4-0). This team was fantastic at pressing and when in possession were fantastic at keeping the ball in tight spaces.

[Tom]

We are NOT a long ball team. Utter nonsense.

In the observer on Saturday Marcel Desailley said that we played a much more sophisticated possesion football than chelsea in the first leg. I agree.

[Harv]

Great post and spot on on many points mate.

Rafa's teams are reminiscent of the great Milan AC sides of the 90's (the one who crushed Barca in the CL final 4-0). This team was fantastic at pressing and when in possession were fantastic at keeping the ball in tight spaces.

They also had Dejan Savicevic....we dont have anyone near his quality on the ball

IMO thats all we are away from becoming a great side. Someone who can consistently create opportunities for our other players.

[Guest]

They also had Dejan Savicevic....we dont have anyone near his quality on the ball

IMO thats all we are away from becoming a great side. Someone who can consistently create opportunities for our other players.

We need 2 world class centre forwards to complement what we already have, possible a wide right player to provide competition for Pennant on the right. But most important of all, we need players of the right mentality. Those who will play through brick walls and won't settle for second best no matter what.

Am not sure Eto'o or Villa are these type of players though. They will need time adapting to the English league. Can we tempt Rooney here with a cheeky bid ?

[Michael]

We need 2 world class centre forwards to complement what we already have, possible a wide right player to provide competition for Pennant on the right. But most important of all, we need players of the right mentality. Those who will play through brick walls and won't settle for second best no matter what.

Am not sure Eto'o or Villa are these type of players though. They will need time adapting to the English league. Can we tempt Rooney here with a grandmother?

h: