Crouchie

[Red Chilli]

problem is Rafa isn't always the best at man-management. He certainly won't do what Ged would've done in this position - play him for a few games to give him that confidence back. I'm not advocating he does either, but a few pats on the back wouldn't go amiss, and from what we know of Rafa it isn't really his stlye.

No, he's unerringly ruthless isn't he

[redpablo]

he needs to get angry, in a positive way, and start proving his worth when he gets the nod like tonight

[Morph]

I agree with you.

I think that Rafa has told him to find a new club. Of course Rafa would never tell that to the media.

Suppose that 3 yr contract he wouldn't sign was just a load of bull**** then?

[reddragon]

No, he's unerringly ruthless isn't he

Yep.

To be fair to Rafa though, his argument would be that he has to think of the results/club/team first, and individuals second. If he even lets Stevie think he's surplus to requirements [as he did after Istanbul according to Stevie - although we all know he's a bit of a drama queen, like] then he isn't going to give Crouchie the star treatment.

Rafa wants players who have the right temperament and mental strength, and if you can't knuckle down and fight for your place you haven't got what he's looking for

[sean_lfc]

Yep.

To be fair to Rafa though, his argument would be that he has to think of the results/club/team first, and individuals second. If he even lets Stevie think he's surplus to requirements [as he did after Istanbul according to Stevie - although we all know he's a bit of a drama queen, like] then he isn't going to give Crouchie the star treatment.

Rafa wants players who have the right temperament and mental strength, and if you can't knuckle down and fight for your place you haven't got what he's looking for

[sean_lfc]

I agree with you.

I think that Rafa has told him to find a new club. Of course Rafa would never tell that to the media.

Crouch to Juve in January and Chiellini to us?

Another possibility is that he will move to City as part of any deal for Johnson or Richards.

I think that that's bollocks.

How you could - realistically, seeing that Rafa keeps his cards closer to his chest than his heart - even come to such a wild conclusion?

Just because of a few media reports from way back when (ie. Juve, Johnson/Richards) you use it as a grounds for 'a possibility'.

I could then just come up with a statement such as, 'I think we'll sell Crouchie to Sevilla in January and there is a possibility for an exchange with Alves, £15m + Crouch'

Total horse****.


Crouchie's got things on his mind, ****ing obviously. As Polo pointed out, he seems to have misplaced his confidence in his position within the club, which is only natural, as we have got/bought 2 new strikers (Torres/Voronin). Last year, the competition was less dramatic, but with Torres on the block and Voronin things have changed, which will obviously change Crouchie's perception of the new reality he faces - namely: That he is not First/Second choice anymore, but merely 3rd/4th.

It's a transitional period. At this moment, beginning of the new season, he's still getting to terms with this fact, hence his mind being distracted and thus his performances dipping. So what. I bet before Christmas he'll have got his act together - mentally and psychologically.

Whenever change happens in life, people start thinking. When you think, by definition, you have no 'peace of mind'. And when you don't have peace of mind, the things you normally do with your intuition are interferred with by your mind. Pretty straight-forward stuff.


So jumping to wild and outlandish conclusions such as 'Yea, I think Rafa's told Crouchie to find a new club' is absolute horse****. These footballers are pretty normal human beings, just like we are. They go through the same emotions and through the same ups and downs as each and every one of us. It's natural.

I think Crouchie will come good, it's all a matter of how he deals with it, mentally.


So all this hokus-pokus (not aimed directly at you AFII) 'I don't think he's good enough and this (ie. his playing badly at the moment) proves he ain't LFC material' is silly. Crouchie has proven himself, it's only his head that's going through a different cycle at the moment.


Right, anyone fancy a cuppa?

[willa1975]

I imagine it's tough for Crouch now...Torres is, without question, our #1 striker. He's got the transfer fee to prove it, and he is living up to expectations so far. But the second striker position is up for grabs. Kuyt's form has been poor lately, and Voronin strikes me more as a supersub type than a regular starter.

I would start him against Wigan. I do feel that Crouch needs to get regular games to play to his potential. He's not the type who can just play every now and then, or come in with 20 minutes to go and influence a game. Unfortunately, he also tends to blow hot and cold, so I think the million-dollar question is whether or not his current form is reflective of rust from not playing regularly, or if it's a sign of things to come from him this season.

Of course, it's got to be a tough decision for the manager when Kuyt isn't doing enough to keep Crouchy on the bench, but Crouchy isn't doing enough to force his way into the starting 11 either.

[reddragon]

I imagine it's tough for Crouch now...Torres is, without question, our #1 striker. He's got the transfer fee to prove it, and he is living up to expectations so far. But the second striker position is up for grabs. Kuyt's form has been poor lately, and Voronin strikes me more as a supersub type than a regular starter.

I would start him against Wigan. I do feel that Crouch needs to get regular games to play to his potential. He's not the type who can just play every now and then, or come in with 20 minutes to go and influence a game. Unfortunately, he also tends to blow hot and cold, so I think the million-dollar question is whether or not his current form is reflective of rust from not playing regularly, or if it's a sign of things to come from him this season.

Of course, it's got to be a tough decision for the manager when Kuyt isn't doing enough to keep Crouchy on the bench, but Crouchy isn't doing enough to force his way into the starting 11 either.

much as i'd LIKE to agree I can't - Kuyt has been immense so far this season and is starting to cement his place in the first 11. Crouchie has to start scoring and contributing more when he does get a chance. Unfortunately, this means the pressure is on him, and I'm not sure if he can take it. Hopefully he will cos we need him to be playing well - but if he doesn't he'll be in a never ending sprial downwards and will be out at the end of the season.


Come On Mate - we're all rooting for you!

[glynner]

with Torres on the block and Voronin things have changed, which will obviously change Crouchie's perception of the new reality he faces - namely: That he is not First/Second choice anymore, but merely 3rd/4th.

I bet before Christmas he'll have got his act together - mentally and psychologically.

I hope so. I would love to see a fired up, confident Crouch play alongside Torres - I think that's got the makings of a terrific partnership.

[sean_lfc]

I agree whole-heartedly, I think - in an ideal world, from Rafa's point of view - there is no 'ideal partnership'. He would want any one striker to be able to combine with any other one striker in whichever game, whatever the opposition; carrying out Rafa's instructions to perfection and scoring goals whilst at it.

I think at times we have seen this happen, but Rafa wants this to happen consistently, whenever he 'pushes a button', so to speak. And this is EXACTLY the reason why Rafa continues with his rotation policy, not just for the strikers, but for pretty much all areas of the pitch. By continuing with his rotation policy (which I think quite a few of our players (or any players for the matter would) seem to have slight difficulties with) he will make sure that over time, like he did at Valencia, he can replace players without a note of his grand symphony going out of tune.

THIS I think is the 'below the iceberg' stuff I have been talking about, the grandest of grand schemes.

[Fiddy]

Yeah, in Rafa's ideal world all four strikers would score 15 goals each.

However, this isn't an ideal world, and this is probably more realistic...

Torres 25 goals
Crouch 14 goals
Kuyt 12 goals
Voronin 11 goals

[sean_lfc]

Yeah, in Rafa's ideal world all four strikers would score 15 goals each.

However, this isn't an ideal world, and this is probably more realistic...

Torres 25 goals
Crouch 14 goals
Kuyt 12 goals
Voronin 11 goals

I think Kuyt might score 13, not sure about Voronin's 11, 10 and a half seems a bit more apt.

[glynner]

I agree whole-heartedly, I think - in an ideal world, from Rafa's point of view - there is no 'ideal partnership'. He would want any one striker to be able to combine with any other one striker in whichever game, whatever the opposition; carrying out Rafa's instructions to perfection and scoring goals whilst at it.

yeah but there are some partnerships which are just never going to click

I don't think Kuyt can play with Voronin - they just don't work well together as a strike duo

I'm not sure Rooney and Tevez can form a lethal combo, either. I guess we'll find out this season.

That being the case, if you are going to rotate strikers, you can't just pick any one forward to play with A.N. other, can you ?

[sean_lfc]

Actually, **** the sarcasm for a moment there.

You pick on my 'ideal world' statement...if Rafa weren't the perfectionist that he is, we'd be ****ing nowhere. And I am quite certain that what I have written is - give or take - pretty much what Rafa's stance is as well: Perfection; Rotating without a hint of difference to the overall harmony and prowess of the team. Otherwise, why the **** do you think he continues to rotate and sometimes comes short (ie. B'ham, P'mouth)? Because that's EXACTLY what he believes in and it is EXACTLY as he will continue to do until he has achieved said situation or either leaves the club.

[glynner]

Yeah, in Rafa's ideal world all four strikers would score 15 goals each.

However, this isn't an ideal world, and this is probably more realistic...

Torres 25 goals
Crouch 14 goals
Kuyt 12 goals
Voronin 11 goals

i hate to say it, but I can't see Kuyt scoring more than 10 league goals this season. I hope I'm wrong, but at the moment I'd be surprised if he bagged 5 before Christmas. What I am interested to see is how many goals he sets up - if he's not gonna score many he should be at least a decent provider for others