Klinsman, No!!!!!!!!

[Tom]

Well, I did read you post, so please remain polite.

Here is a part of it:

"As for Klinsmann denying it. Well his sports consultancy firm do work for Gillette don't they. He's not going to bugger up a lucrative business relationship by spilling the contents of private negotiations in the international press is he?"

I did not allude that you said you had info on this, you categorically denied that - but your quote above does question the truth in Klinsmanns statement and thus, to me at least, hint at the opposite - the rumours of him being offered the LFC job being true, hence my post above.

And I am not going to join a "band of jokers" - I am fairly certain that you don't think all that debate your points are jokers.

I don't want to get in an argument over this, so I will leave it here.
We both want the best for the club, and we both think things are not perfect behind the scenes.

I just think it is time to support the manager and not engage in debates about replacements, admittedly I asked questions about the topic, but I will back out of that debate now as I see nothing good coming from continuing.

I'm not hinting at anything, and to suggest that I am does me a disservice by taking what I said out of context. That statement was my opinion on why Klingon might have felt he should keep his mouth shut and was delivered in the context of me saying that I'd heard nothing about him.

And as for swearing, well i think i'm entitled to considering the amount of **** I'm being showered with by certain people on this board. Just completely fed up with it.

[Dhav]

Errrrrr, Dhavlos, what part of

"I did not have any offers from England" is "boosting your profile, ego and credibility by having your ridiculous, unproven, name linked with a much bigger job at a bigger club than the one you're joining"

Unless there's some other quotes I've missed so far

I saw that MrM, but I think he said that in jest and it shouldn't be taken too seriously. After all, suggesting you would have taken a job in England ahead of the job you've just taken is either a ridiculously foolish thing to say if true as it will not be the best way to endear yourself to your new fans, or is an ill-advised joke. SO just to clarify I think it''s Klinsmann or his agents releasing these stories to make it seem he rejected Liverpool to go to Bayern.

[DannyMan2006]

Errrrrr, Dhavlos, what part of

"I did not have any offers from England" is "boosting your profile, ego and credibility by having your ridiculous, unproven, name linked with a much bigger job at a bigger club than the one you're joining"

Unless there's some other quotes I've missed so far

Maybe people should look back to World War two to see how a part of the war was won. I'm sure many of you will have heard of the term "Propaganda War". This shows you the power Newspapers have over the people who read it and accept everything as gospel.

All I ask of fellow Est posters is to look at how many players we are linked with every transfer window. Where do these rumours me from? They can't all be true can they?

I remember a lad on Koptalk made up a transfer rumour - first he stated what he was going to do on the site, and then he set about spreading the quite obvious bull****. It got to such dizzying proportions that Rick Parry actually HAD to come out and deny the speculation!!!!!

FFS lads, don't believe everything you read in the papers. As for the joke that the owners should come out and rubbish the story by the unknown (no suprise there) Bayern insider, if they came out and rubbished every rumour in the press, they'd be there all bloody day!

It seems quite obvious that they are not very closely involved in th club, they have other businesses after all, and as they live the other side of the pond, I doubt they even see these rumours. So I wouldn't expect a statement anytime soon.

[redblood]

No it was a joke FFS


As for Klinsmann denying it. Well his sports consultancy firm do work for Gillette don't they. He's not going to bugger up a lucrative business relationship by spilling the contents of private negotiations in the international press is he?


Paul Joyce in the Express. Before we get any conspiracy theory bollocks he's a season ticket holder.

MORE PRESSURE PILED ON BENITEZ
http://www.express.co.uk/posts/view/...led-on-Benitez

Hey Tom he's a journo none the less mate, some of that story doesn't make sense to me.
How could buying a player of Rafa's choosing be a commitment to the club and not to Rafa.
Also I think it's not beyond the realms of possibilty that Klinnsman could've used his friends/contacts to table an offer to get Bayern of their arses.

[tomasjj]

I'm not hinting at anything, and to suggest that I am does me a disservice by taking what I said out of context. That statement was my opinion on why Klingon might have felt he should keep his mouth shut and was delivered in the context of me saying that I'd heard nothing about him.

And as for swearing, well i think i'm entitled to considering the amount of **** I'm being showered with by certain people on this board. Just completely fed up with it.

Thanks for clearing that up. I was not trying to be a tit btw.


Just because you get grief from some on here, there is no need to take that out on others. Although I can understand your frustrations at times.

[DannyMan2006]

He's hardly going to go into details of other offers he received when he is being unveiled as the next Bayern Munich manager.

I don't want to believe these rumours but there's so many of these Klinsmann ones flying about there must be a grain of truth in there somewhere.

You're joking me right? Every manager and player in a PC will always mention the other offers they have. The reasoning is that they instantly appeal more to the fans.

If he'd had any offers from England he would have said so. He still managed to get in the fact that he had recieved "various" other offers of course.

I still remember the fact everyone loved Momo staright away cos he turned down the bitters. And Kewell saying how he turned down every man and his dog. And how Skrtel had other offers from England. How Reina and Xabi were turning down offers from Spain. How Rafa had turned down Real, Bayern, Inter, etc, etc. I could go on forever.

If Klinsmann had had any offers from England he would have said so.

[redblood]

Maybe people should look back to World War two to see how a part of the war was won. I'm sure many of you will have heard of the term "Propaganda War". This shows you the power Newspapers have over the people who read it and accept everything as gospel.

All I ask of fellow Est posters is to look at how many players we are linked with every transfer window. Where do these rumours me from? They can't all be true can they?

I remember a lad on Koptalk made up a transfer rumour - first he stated what he was going to do on the site, and then he set about spreading the quite obvious bull****. It got to such dizzying proportions that Rick Parry actually HAD to come out and deny the speculation!!!!!
FFS lads, don't believe everything you read in the papers. As for the joke that the owners should come out and rubbish the story by the unknown (no suprise there) Bayern insider, if they came out and rubbished every rumour in the press, they'd be there all bloody day!

It seems quite obvious that they are not very closely involved in th club, they have other businesses after all, and as they live the other side of the pond, I doubt they even see these rumours. So I wouldn't expect a statement anytime soon.

I remember that happening it was quite funny.
Personally I don't read the tabloids they are full of complete **** 99.9% of the time.
I just implore our fans to not get caught up in what is an obvious witch hunt we really have to be careful the press know they have power to get managers the sack and they would only love to see it happen to us.
WE NEED TO BE BIGGER AND BETTER.
I would love to try and get some more momentum in support of Rafa and show that we don't believe this **** and defeat them, we have the power to.
Come on lads let's stop this now
YNWA

[Dhav]

You're joking me right? Every manager and player in a PC will always mention the other offers they have. The reasoning is that they instantly appeal more to the fans.

If he'd had any offers from England he would have said so. He still managed to get in the fact that he had recieved "various" other offers of course.

I still remember the fact everyone loved Momo staright away cos he turned down the bitters. And Kewell saying how he turned down every man and his dog. And how Skrtel had other offers from England. How Reina and Xabi were turning down offers from Spain. How Rafa had turned down Real, Bayern, Inter, etc, etc. I could go on forever.

If Klinsmann had had any offers from England he would have said so.

Yes, but look at his words, he said he went to Bayern "because he had no offers from England". Surely that is a tongue in cheek comment? When being unvieled at your new club you don't say you ended up there because you had no better offers! If that is the case, then you make up that you had other offers. I'm not taking those Klinsmann quotes above at face value.

[Shaggy]

I remember a lad on Koptalk made up a transfer rumour - first he stated what he was going to do on the site, and then he set about spreading the quite obvious bull****. It got to such dizzying proportions that Rick Parry actually HAD to come out and deny the speculation!!!!!

Was that the one when robski got his bull**** into the Mirror? I can't remember what the 'link' was, but it was printed in the Mirror and spread to some other sites like Teamtalk. Funny as ****.

[MrMichael]

He's hardly going to go into details of other offers he received when he is being unveiled as the next Bayern Munich manager.

I don't want to believe these rumours but there's so many of these Klinsmann ones flying about there must be a grain of truth in there somewhere.

Ture, but then he can't win either. This only goes one way.

You've basically said it yourself there, if you sling enough mud, eventually some sticks, If something say it enough times, it starts to become true, whether it was or not in the first place. What isn't important is what's actually going on. Its what everyone believes is going on. Its like politics. Or history.

I'm not saying there isn't some truth there. But last week the majority of people believed, mostly down to what the press had been saying, that the most likely outcome of all this would be that Maureen would be in charge this time next season. Now all of a sudden, that all must be bollocks if we've actually approached Klinsmann. So am I a fool if I retain some belief in the mendacity of this story too?

And as for swearing, well i think i'm entitled to considering the amount of **** I'm being showered with by certain people on this board. Just completely fed up with it.

The attacking of posters rather than debating of posts themselves is an unappealing trend on any forum, and one that does seem to happen on here a bit too regularly.

[The Erectile Banana]

You're joking me right? Every manager and player in a PC will always mention the other offers they have. The reasoning is that they instantly appeal more to the fans.

If he'd had any offers from England he would have said so. He still managed to get in the fact that he had recieved "various" other offers of course.

I still remember the fact everyone loved Momo staright away cos he turned down the bitters. And Kewell saying how he turned down every man and his dog. And how Skrtel had other offers from England. How Reina and Xabi were turning down offers from Spain. How Rafa had turned down Real, Bayern, Inter, etc, etc. I could go on forever.

If Klinsmann had had any offers from England he would have said so.

Yes, but look at his words, he said he went to Bayern "because he had no offers from England". Surely that is a tongue in cheek comment? When being unvieled at your new club you don't say you ended up there because you had no better offers! If that is the case, then you make up that you had other offers. I'm not taking those Klinsmann quotes above at face value.

Dhavlos has answered for me here. As he said you don't say you ended up there because you had no better offers and players and managers don't tend to go into details of other offers in press conferences. The only one I can recall revealing details of other offers was Kewell but that was during his court case.

[The Erectile Banana]

Ture, but then he can't win either. This only goes one way.

You've basically said it yourself there, if you sling enough mud, eventually some sticks, If something say it enough times, it starts to become true, whether it was or not in the first place. What isn't important is what's actually going on. Its what everyone believes is going on. Its like politics. Or history.

I'm not saying there isn't some truth there. But last week the majority of people believed, mostly down to what the press had been saying, that the most likely outcome of all this would be that Maureen would be in charge this time next season. Now all of a sudden, that all must be bollocks if we've actually approached Klinsmann. So am I a fool if I retain some belief in the mendacity of this story too?

No, you're not a fool, far from it. I think there's a lot of sense in what your saying. If something is said often enough then people will always accept it as fact even if it was blatantly untrue to begin with. It's the herd mentality and it is being perpetrated and exploited to a huge extent by the media.

I never really believed the Maureen stories but there does seem to be more substance to the Klinsmann link. Why else would a club like Bayern come out with comments claiming Klinsmann turned us down. I know some on here are saying they may be trying to boost their profile and make themselves look good but surely a club of their size do not need to resort to such tricks?

[Tom]

Belfast Telegraph, Green another season ticket holder. Take it or leave it.

lan Green: Rafa deserves better fate than Big Sam

Saturday, January 12, 2008

So, after Allardyce - regular readers of the column will know not to expect any sympathy from this quarter - who's next on the managerial hit-list?

Rafa Benitez?

I had hoped, for the sake of common sense, that the matter of Benitez and his future or otherwise at Liverpool should have been put to bed before Christmas - to change managers at this stage of the season would effectively end it.

It wasn't.

There isn't a day when the subject isn't raised in one newspaper or another and I'm close enough to Anfield to understand that what you're reading isn't all made up.

Heavens, Benitez himself can't stop talking about it.

Instead of laughing off the stories last weekend, Benitez chose to talk at length to the Liverpool Echo about his love of the fans, the club and the city and how he wanted to be there in the summer and for many summers after that.

Nevertheless, his uncertainty remained evident. This is all so unlike Liverpool.

When Gerard Houllier left in 2004, he was only the SECOND manager to be sacked in the history of the club. That's some record and was testament to how the then board felt things were drifting under the Frenchman.

Liverpool is a 'proper' football club, not given to knee-jerk reactions.

Benitez was chosen because he was young, hungry and displayed all the principles Liverpool like to see in their managers.

But, being Benitez, it was inevitable that he was in demand elsewhere and remains so.

In a book, 'Rafa', first published 18 months ago, the Liverpool chief executive Rick Parry was quoted as follows: "Why would he not go to Real Madrid? Real is a huge challenge, and Rafa's home club, and we had a real scare over the Madrid interest in him in 2006.

"But Rafa knows he would not have full control in Spain and he is also a man of honour. And he genuinely loves it here (in Liverpool). "He has a real bond with the fans and the club?he loves the passion of the place and is wedded to the job."

So, what's changed? - Ownership of the club, for a start.

Tom Hicks and George Gillett are accustomed to calling the shots in their American business ventures.

They don't see the difference in trying to tell people what to do in running an English football club.

Nor do they see a problem leaving transfer activity in the hands of the same Rick Parry, a man whose relative 'inaction' is well-known. Benitez sees it as a less than endearing habit.

If it costs the club Mascherano, who would argue against the coach's annoyance?

However, without a direct statement to the contrary from the Americans, I can see Benitez being ditched in the summer.

Recent results in the Premier League aren't helping even if the players should be taking some responsibility.

Lose to Luton on Tuesday night and Inter Milan next month and there'll be no saving the Spaniard. Replacements? Klinsmann? - No track record as a club coach and going to Bayern Munich by all accounts.

Mourinho? - A sure fire winner, yes, but detested by a majority of the club's fans.

O'Neill? - Who knows? Allardyce? Ha, ha?ha, ha, ha.

No, it's a mess and, I repeat, very unlike Liverpool.

[Liverpool]

This thread contains an immense amount of abuse and bull****. It seems if you do not agree or do not like what someone says then it is apparently OK to vilify that poster.The abuse Tom gets for reporting what he believes is true is disgraceful.This is not acceptable to me and I suspect many others. If you can't post in a civilised way do us a favour and don't bother posting at all. As for all the talk of "not believing what you read in the papers" can I point out that if the papers consistently reported lies they would lose all credibility and go out of business -ergo most reports should be initially believed until proven otherwise. This is particularly true of the Guardian quoted above. The simple fact is that there has been a huge amount of speculation on Rafas position. At no stage have our cowboy owners through their mouthpiece Parry EVER made an unequivocal statement that Rafa is their man and is going nowhere. To me this confirms the speculation-which comes from numerous sources-is true and that they have looked for other managers and may be continuing to do so. Rafa of course may remain in post unless an adequate replacement can be found. This does not mean that a manegerial search has not been and may be continuing.

[Tom]

Maddock, another season ticket holder. Ditto to above.

Benitez left exposed
By David Maddock 12/01/2008

Rafa Benitez (DM) Rafa Benitez (DM)
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Rafael Benitez's worst fears were realised last night, as news emerged that his job had been offered to Jurgen Klinsmann.

The former Germany boss was yesterday installed as the next coach of Bayern Munich, but senior officials at the Bavarian club confirmed they moved so swiftly because Klinsmann had been the subject of an official approach by Liverpool.

One high-ranking official admitted: "There was a detailed proposal made to Jurgen by Liverpool, just waiting for his signature."

would have been relieved yesterday to hear Klinsmann had chosen to resume his coaching career in his native country.
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But that relief will have barely had time to register, before the full horror of the situation dawned on him.

Klinsmann it seems, was not only sounded out as a possible Anfield manager, but had a contract on his desk waiting for him to sign following negotiations in America.

While it means that the Spaniard is safe at Anfield for the time being, it also suggests that Benitez's position at the club is virtually untenable.

Liverpool declined to comment on the offer to Klinsmann last night, but their refusal to deny it is confirmation of what has been apparent for some months - that American owners Tom Hicks and George Gillett want a new manager.

Benitez will continue until the end of the season, but he becomes almost a lame duck manager, with the knowledge that his bosses are clearly so keen to replace him as soon as possible.

Benitez yesterday proudly backed his ability to produce results at Anfield, but it would probably take the miracle of a Premier League title win for him to survive.

Martin O'Neill and Jose Mourinho now appear the main candidates to take over.

Benitez, though, was yesterday allowed to complete the signing of £6million Slovakia international centre-back Martin Skrtel from Russian club Zenit St Petersburg.

Benitez said:

"His qualities are similar to Jamie Carragher's, in that he's aggressive, good in the air and with pace."