What's gone wrong this season?

[BigChief]

This question has been a painful one, and the answer is even more painful. One answer really, Rafa.

He's a great manager, but not the best suited for the premiership. Ironically, I think at Real he would do a fantastic job domestically and in the CL. However, the PL is not suited to his visions of how the game should be played.

Wenger has nailed it, Mourinho nailed it and obviously Demento has had it in his pocket for decades. I hoped that after 2005 Rafa would take a season or two to adjust and be as good as these three, if not better. He may still learn to be better than those three, but now we don't the budget (nor the time) to fufil his vision.

If Rafa stays I don't expect a drastic turnaround of how we play football next season. Torres, Villa, Ronaldinho, Masch, or whomever is playing for us. And this is the bitter pill to swallow.

[Dhav]

Possibly, but surely the players still want to win for themselves?

Agree with what you said in your first paragraph. So is that the manager's fault, the players, or both?

I really don't know whose fault it is. Probably both. But I hate seeing players hide behind the boardroom upheaval and use it as an excuse for poor form. I have no doubts that it is having an impact, but they should take more responsibility and try to right the wrongs on the pitch rather than hiding behind excuses.

[BigChief]

when i look at genuine world class players at the current champions (spit) they have more than us and they cost a lot more than we have spent. same with chelsea who have just spent more this january on 2 players than we do in a summer- would rafa have been in for anelka if he'd had a spare 15million lying around? considering that he was lined up if the morientes transfer feel through rafa rates him so i just think missed opportunity

and anelka pisses all over our current strike options (other than torres of course)

To continue to ignore Anelka was the "crunch" sound for me that we are not top 3 material under current administration/management. Torres just ensures we're top 4.

[CharlieMansonsSquint]

I really don't know whose fault it is. Probably both. But I hate seeing players hide behind the boardroom upheaval and use it as an excuse for poor form. I have no doubts that it is having an impact, but they should take more responsibility and try to right the wrongs on the pitch rather than hiding behind excuses.

Totally agree.

They really are taking the piss. Then again in their own little - sheltered out of touch with reality - world it seems as if it's a massive problem, never mind their 5 beamers in the garage, blonde wag, millions in the bank and playing for LFC every week. Yep, they've got problems alright.

[Dhav]

Totally agree.

They really are taking the piss. Then again in their own little - sheltered out of touch with reality - world it seems as if it's a massive problem, never mind their 5 beamers in the garage, blonde wag, millions in the bank and playing for LFC every week. Yep, they've got problems alright.

Yep. Remember Gerrard's interview just after signing a new deal in 2005 when he was on the verge of joining Chelsea and he said something like "what I've just been through the last few weeks is the worst thing in the world and I wouldn't wish it on my worst enemy" or something equally as over the top :whatever:

They're so out of touch. They need to take a long hard look at themselves and grow up a bit.

[redblood]

I don't think it's all his fault.

He's certainly made mistakes though. Unquestionably.

It's a collective thing. People will say it's Rafa's fault that he continually picks Kuyt, but it's Kuyt's fault he continually let's him and the team down. It goes both ways.

I'm frustrated with the manager, he just doesn't seem to be making any headway with the league, and I've lost faith that his way of doing things will bring us the league title.

But then I remember us winning 11 in a row 2 seasons ago playing nigh on the same team every week, save a couple of changes here and there, and I wonder what's changed?

Niall I would agree to a large degree with what you're saying.
Rafa has made mistakes, but to many players for me have not shown enough pride and passion to play for us.
Yesterday and Boro are 2 games in particular that have shown us that.
I'm not excusing Rafa for some of his decisions but for nearly every game we've played, the team that was on the pitch was more than capable of winning that game.
Yesterday we could've played a ten man MF full of defenders and if they had've been professional and shown urgency and pride they would've walked that game.
The players, the manager, the media, the backroom staff and the owners are all at fault.
We have at times this season played some of the best football I've seen us play in years and we have on more occassions this season than any in the last 10 maybe even 20 years socred 4 or more goals in a game.
The potential is there the willingness, desire and belief was there up until 6-8 weeks ago.
The players need to take their heads out of their arses and start really knuckling down and Rafa needs a little less rotation.

[cobain]

Forget the ownership situation, I'm talking about the on field performance in the league.

Collectively we seem to lack heart, fight and belief. Why?

Our football, and the quality of it, has regressed despite the addition of Torres, why?

Certain players have regressed badly from last season, why?

Or is the manager to blame with his peculiar managerial approach?

I want to gage some opinions on this, and none of this “it's the yanks fault”, “yanks out” stuff, they don't pick the team or play in the starting 11.

1. Pako leaving. I think this had a huge impact on everybody! I think Pako was the one who was getting players ready, fired them up etc. After Pako left, we did put a few good performances, but not as many as we would have liked.

2. Rafa's complacency! He is over-complicating everything! I mean, if there was 1+1=? he wouldn't solve it and write down number two, he would go 1+1=3-3-7+10+3-6+2

3. Alonso and most importantly Agger injured

4. Half of our team is ouf of form. Riise is ****. Kuyt is ****. Finnan is **** lately. Voronin is super****. Gerrard's gone missing in some of the games. Babel can't play on the left wing, Kewell can't go past 1 defender ...

5. Plus I think players simply don't give a f*** about Premiership anymore as they know they can't win it. I don't know, that's the feeling I get when watching them play...

and many, many more

[Red_Al_77]

Personally I don't think some of the players are half as good as we'd like to think. Also we are too narrow. Only Pennant plays anything like a winger but he has zero goal threat. Also we have one decent striker and three bit part players.

However for me the main barrier to us getting results in the PL is Rafa's tactics. You play your best formation and your best players and you let the opposition worry about you. Football isn't chess.

[willa1975]

I've all but lost faith in Rafa...he's got a lot to prove to me between now and the end of the season. Say what you want about him not being able to get enough of his first-choice players, but our squad is falling well short of its potential. Forget about United, Arsenal and Chelsea...we should not be behind Everton in the table going into February. Period. You can talk about Hicks undermining him, but the team's form was excellent when the row between Hicks and Rafa was at its height, and we went to **** in December after things started to die down.

Our form in November and early December, Reading excepted, was indicative of our squad's potential...compare the quality of our performances away to Newcastle and Marseilles with what we did against the likes of Wigan at Anfield and Middlesbrough away. Consider the fact that we have a superior goal difference to Chelsea but are ten points behind them in the table. This sort of inconsistency has plagued us for several years now and, if anything, has worsened this season. Consider the fact that every attacking player we've had over the past few years with the exception of Torres has floundered. Consider the fact that we are, more than ever, dependent on individual moments of brilliance from two players in order to get any points from our efforts in the league now.

There are too many things wrong with us for the manager to not be responsible. I agree that he's too cautious, and feel that Cobain is right in that he overcomplicates things, possibly to the point that our players spend too much time worrying about the x's and o's instead of playing football. Whatever it might be, I would give Rafa one more year if we finish in the top 4.

If we end up in the UEFA Cup next year, which is a very realistic scenario, Rafa's got to go. Say what you want about it being difficult to find a better manager, but I think a lot of managers out there could get us into the UEFA Cup, and nobody on here would have bet four months ago that Avram Grant would have Chelsea, with their injury problems, and now with their significant losses due the African Nations Cup, as far ahead of us in the league as they are. And Rafa's knack for success in the Champions' League won't matter if Everton are the only side representing the city of Liverpool in the competition.

[The Erectile Banana]

Personally I don't think some of the players are half as good as we'd like to think. Also we are too narrow. Only Pennant plays anything like a winger but he has zero goal threat. Also we have one decent striker and three bit part players.

However for me the main barrier to us getting results in the PL is Rafa's tactics. You play your best formation and your best players and you let the opposition worry about you. Football isn't chess.

I agree with this.

Rafa's tactics are confusing at times for us watching the match so I can imagine they're much more confusing for players on the pitch who are trying to carry out the orders.

A big part of it is I just don't think our players are as good as we think. Sure we have an excellent squad on paper, but our best XI (do we even have a best XI) is not at the same level of the other big teams.

I think the fact that our squad is so big has sometimes been more of a hindrance than a help. Players often look like strangers out on the pitch, leading to a lack of fluency and cohesion and ultimately poor results. I can see the benefits of rotation but I believe that fielding your strongest team week in week out is the best way of doing well in the league.

As someone has already pointed out Rafa fielded a pretty settled side in the league in the 2005/2006 campaign and I think it is no coincidence that that is his best campaign to date.

I think our squad is too bloated. Too many average to good players, not enough true quality. We need to trim it down and bring in some top players who will play every week if we are to challenge.

[glynner]

Before the Manure game, I had confidence in us no matter who we faced in the league.

Away from home, we played some good stuff at times, like against Newcastle.

Yeah, we didn't beat the Chavs or the Arse but we played well enough against them, and had chances to beat both.

Even the teams we should have beaten but only drew with (like Birmingham) didn't look as likely to score against us as they do now.

We are seriously lacking some confidence at the moment. It's not our only problem but it's a big one.

[Eikman]

Personally I don't think some of the players are half as good as we'd like to think. Also we are too narrow. Only Pennant plays anything like a winger but he has zero goal threat. Also we have one decent striker and three bit part players.

However for me the main barrier to us getting results in the PL is Rafa's tactics. You play your best formation and your best players and you let the opposition worry about you. Football isn't chess.

hey,I agree totally with you here,many of the players in the squad are highly overrated.I feel that only 5-6 players are good enough at the moment to be able to win the league,the others are mid table quality.

when it comes to rafa's tactics,well thats another story,if we keep a clean sheet we probably win, but if we concede a goal then we're in deep ****,can't just seem to kill a game,

[blacky]

I think Rafa as manager needs to take ultimate responsibility for this seasons problems. He has not adapted to the premiership, never brought in a defender last summer, he over rotates,changes formation too much, plays players out of position, over analyses the opposition sometimes i.e focuses on stopping the opposition play instead of playing to his own teams strengths, never replaced Pako...etc etc etc add all the stuff going on off the field to this and it spells disaster.

[fdoyle]

Does anyone think we are missing Luis Garcia? That little bit of creativity is totally gone from the team. We are now relying soley on the individuality of Gerrard and Torres, or some very ordinary 'wingers'.

Garcia used to drive me crazy, but he often set up the second or third goals at Anfield, if I remember correctly....

Time go go back to lurking....

[Shaggy]

As has been discussed, we've got problems in attacking areas - most of which have needed solving for ****ing ages (will we ever find *that* ****ing winger?!). We all know what these problems are.

However, more worryingly in my opinion, we now can't defend. For toffee.

Not set-pieces, not crosses, and not long punts into the box. We can't defend!