Liverpool is a city of fighters, and that is what I will do. So I'll fight..

[DomL]

The squad needs a big clear out but i dont see that as a major problem. All the players mentioned should leave bar Pennant he has a good attitude and gives alot to our team and is a fine squad player.

Shouldnt be in our first 11 but he should be here as second choice.

Reina, Agger, Masch, Gerrard, Torres, Lucas, Babel, Skertal, Arbeloa is a great base to build from and if either a new manager comes in we wouldnt need the rebuilding that happend before Rafa has set us to servive without him thats why i am so thankful for him he has done alot from top to bottom of this club just needs to take hat extra step.

If Rafa has lost the players then their is a problem and many fans will be split because players will leave if he stays or go's. As the likes of Gerrard could leave and would people want him our Rafa. Then that extra step for me should be without Rafa.

But if Rafa still has the players and they just arnt performing and arnt good enough then Rafa should have another season with first choice targets sealed in terms of players and coaches if that happens and i see improvement in technical apsects of our game and we win while playing very good football then this season was a one off and the pressure got to him and right he really is the right man for the job.

The fact that he has had to reshape the team because of Carra and Hyppia has been a huge problem but we still should be dealing with set pecies and our attacking play should be better. Hopefully things can get better soon.

[Skillz]

The problem is that Rafa had to build a team challenging for a top four place and not challenge for the title.

We needed the CL money so he couldn't take the chance to sign one quality player instead of three squad players. If the quality player got injured then we would probably miss out on the CL.

He had to build up the team from top to bottom and that includes the Academy.

Well said

Rafa came here with a plan to take us to the top. It is a long plan and if we backed him then we should back him long enough to see if it comes off. I am starting to think he would of been better off losing in Instabul and Cardiff but winning in Athens, if you know what I mean

[Pablo]

Well said

Rafa came here with a plan to take us to the top. It is a long plan and if we backed him then we should back him long enough to see if it comes off. I am starting to think he would of been better off losing in Instabul and Cardiff but winning in Athens, if you know what I mean

I know what you mean mate, winning in Istanbul raised expectations massively and put extra pressure on us ever since. Still I wouldnt give up No. 5 for the world!

[bobbyfallon]

I know what you mean mate, winning in Istanbul raised expectations massively and put extra pressure on us ever since. Still I wouldnt give up No. 5 for the world!

****IN FACT

[Skillz]

I know what you mean mate, winning in Istanbul raised expectations massively and put extra pressure on us ever since. Still I wouldnt give up No. 5 for the world!

Nor me, mate. Just trying to put some perspective on it. Rafa would be in a much stronger position now if we won last year rather than in his 1st year. It would appear as natural progression and therefore he would be backed a lot more. Fact is we deserved to win last year more than in Instanbul.

Moot point though really.

[Joe Le Toff]

To a point but then it becomes a liability.

That's what separates the good managers from the great ones - their self-awareness and knowing when to change. To recognise when they've made a mistake.

For the most part, Rafa doesn't appear to be learning.

Spot on

[andyinswinton]

The trouble is that if Rafa left now, the new guy would come in and spent 3 years clearing out the current players and bringing in his own.

You need to decide whether to stick with what we have got and hope it leads somewhere or accept that we aren't going to do anything and write off the next 3 years or so with somebody elses ideals.

Personally, I'd stick with Rafa. He needs a huge kick up the arse because he has gpt some things wrong this season and some of his transfers just haven't been up to scratch but there still isn't one credible candidate to take over the job.

[Skillz]

Got a feeling we might turn it on tonight. Sounds to me like Rafa has drawn a line in the sand, if you know what i mean.

[MattB]

Got a feeling we might turn it on tonight. .

I gave up thinking that on boxing day

[Skillz]

I gave up thinking that on boxing day

That's funny, cos that is the 1st day I thought we had a real problem, and we won that game.

Go with me mate we are going to turn it around tonight.

[Rashid]

Ferguson got 7 years, so why not ?

Virtually all managers who win the league, in any country, do so in their first few seasons.

[Skillz]

Virtually all managers who win the league, in any country, do so in their first few seasons.

Wonder why that is?

No offense Rash but think about it.

[desertscouser]

It hasn't been 56m quids, but more closer to 25 odd millions.

The players as professionals just have to believe in what Rafa and his coaching team are doing, instead of reading newspapers and entering the debate into rotation or who needs to play in place of Kuyt. That would greatly help.

Problem is, neither of our other forwards are good enough to cement a place alongside Torres. They're all in and out of the team. That's not good for continuity. Rafa is tied to the players who aren't performing.

Fredo, you really do my head in at times.

Rafa has spent 56 million quid this season. That's a fact. If you can't grasp that then you've got problems. Save your net spend analysis when we discuss the owners.

[Guest]

Fredo, you really do my head in at times.

Rafa has spent 56 million quid this season. That's a fact. If you can't grasp that then you've got problems. Save your net spend analysis when we discuss the owners.

So net spend isn't to be taken into consideration ?

You pay 20 quid on something and sell the same thing at 10 makes you spend 20 ?

How did you do in Maths ?

[desertscouser]

So net spend isn't to be taken into consideration ?

You pay 20 quid on something and sell the same thing at 10 makes you spend 20 ?

How did you do in Maths ?

Read the thread. Your responding to my argument so respond to it without moving the goal posts.

Rafa spent 56 million quid on new players this season and our first 11 hasn't really improved judging by our league position. I AM NOT TALKING ABOUT NET SPEND.

If you still cannot grasp what I'm talking about I implore you not to respond.