Ryan Babel

[RedReet]

Dont know if I would agree with that, when he scores you can see the pure delight on his face. Keane gets talked about for moaning to much and Babel gets moaned about for not seeming fussed.

A few weeks ago I was convinced that he wanted out because of his apparent effort or lack of. But like you say, especially with that Newcastle celebration in mind (meaningless third goal, fluked in), he celebrated like a winner in the World Cup final, as if to show he has unfinished business here.

I really thought he'd kick on against Preston though.

I thought earlier in the season with Babel getting so much rest he'd be a lethal weapon in the second half against tired defenders. Time’s running out though.

[dww]

I think that Babel likes the club and wants to be a success at the top level and appears but seems to lake the ability to learn and the football brain to adapt to different situations. It is possibly that something will click but at the minute I would be in favour of cutting our losses. It is a shame as it has been noted by just about everyone that he has all the ingredients except the mentality/intelligence to be a top, top player.

I don't agree with the idea that he is obviously best suited to being a striker. The evidence is scanty but when he has been moved there in games the main benefit I have seen is that he is more central and therefore more often better placed to take speculative long range shots. His movement centrally creates no space for others and he doesn't even seem aware of others for passes in the way say Kuyt and Keane are. He'll either sink or swim as a wide forward/winger IMO and at the minute he is slowly sinking.

[el matador]

Good point, hopefully he can take his head out of his arse and push on a bit




Agree with most of that How do you think Gerrard creates the fear factor though? If anything, Babel is his own worst enemy with his decision making - he seems to go between being over-confident, shooting from distance when someone else is better placed and pussying out and giving the simple ball to Gerrard or someone else to go and have a go.

I read this the other day which was part of a huge post, which references Saachi and how Rafa is emulating his philosophy



You say that our rigid tactical system doesn't suit his play, which is possibly the case defensively (in that we're very well organised so his mind can't be solely on attacking), but going forward we've been very fluid lately, with sharp passing and much better movement, something you would think suits him. If you refer to the Saachi quote, though, the key to a great player (in Rafa's eyes at least) I would think is one who can be creative within what he asks of him which obviously includes defensive duties, so maybe question marks over this aspect of his game is why Pako thought he was a panic buy? As you say though the Olympics and his injury can't have helped but he does seem to lack any sort of footballing brain whatsoever.

I did read a quote that Rafa and Babel agreed that he would ease him into the season due to him being pacey/injured. Personally I think he's hit rock-bottom mentally at LFC...he must know from his lack of games that his days are numbered unless he bucks his ideas up..the sad thing is he just doesn't look arsed. I've almost lost faith in him tbh

Regardless though we're being linked with wingers all over the place, so whether the plan is to sell Babel, shift him up top, shift Kuyt up top and play Babel on the right we don't know yet I guess. This is his last season on current form though I would imagine

lies down

I think gerrard has the same aura that henry did at arsenal and keane did at united in that other players know that they are at the top of the pecking order when it comes to the game.

These players demand the ball and expect others to pass it to them even if they are in a worse position. Fabregas really became a great player when henry left in that he could make proper decisions about the state of play without being under pressure to pass it to henry as soon as he wanted it.

I think Babel is in a similar boat and would benefit from a more responsible role. Having said that i think his best position will be on the right of the trio (where kuyt plays for us in the 4231 formation.)

He needs some time to settle into the role and get used to playing on the other side.

We have to remember a few things about babel in that he's just spent the summer in the olympics and missed some of the pre-season. Also he was injured in the summer and going to beijing cant have helped his fitness.

Masher also had the same problem and we're only starting to see the best of him now.

Additionally, he has proved on occasion that he is the man for the big stage in big games against chelsea, arsenal and united. He has talent but we shouldnt lose patience with a player with such talent.

I genuinely believe that he will become a great player for us and will start to show that in the second half of the season.

[-V-]

He is a concern because he isn't taking players on 1 on 1 anymore. He needs more minutes on the pitch and hopefully he can then get his confidence back.

You can't say he isn't arsed anymore thats not true, if you watch his celebration when he scored last week you will see how much it meant to him. When he is a sub, he is always running around like a mad man warming him in the hope of getting on.

Its just a confidence thing, he has been on the bench too much

[G]

He wanted to go on loan and Rafa wouldn't let him.Think he's having a private moan over that and its showing in his play.He really dosen't look fussed about making a genuine effort to earn a place in the team,rather he appears to think he should be in it regardless.Maybe he thinks his performances last season had earned him his place in the team.If he'd have been fit and available at the seasons start he may well have kept his place.Going to the olympics certainly hasn't helped him,both to keep his place and keep rafa happy.

His goal celeb against the toon said a lot for me.You'd think he'd scored the goal of the season.to me it looked like he was loving scoring as if it proved why he should play but then it could have meant any number of things.Just thought it was a bit OTT

He has a lot of natural talent though,some of his goals last season where sublime.Hope he gets his head right and pushes on

[dww]

I think you can read almost anything into Babel's over celebration.

[Harv]

Sell him. He wont come good.

We cant afford to carry passengers no matter how "talented" they are.

[BG1973]

I chose this guy to be in my dream team this year as i really thought he would come on. What do people think, will he develop into the player we bought him to be?

been biding my time with him but I've never been convinced and now coming round to the opinion that he's ****e.

Hope something changes but can't see it.

For such an athletic looking fella he seems pretty weak.

[Fowler_God]

Loan move to Juve until the summer

[Craig_H]

He is a concern because he isn't taking players on 1 on 1 anymore. He needs more minutes on the pitch and hopefully he can then get his confidence back.

You can't say he isn't arsed anymore thats not true, if you watch his celebration when he scored last week you will see how much it meant to him. When he is a sub, he is always running around like a mad man warming him in the hope of getting on.

Its just a confidence thing, he has been on the bench too much

He needs to be arsed with the less glorious stuff as well. Anyone can be happy to score, he needs to be happy to put in a shift too. I rarely see him getting back to win the ball when he loses it.

[Ballykissdevil]

It's the seeming lack of interest that gets me. It's all well and good talking about fighting for your place and being the victim of discarded rotation and the like but when he DOES get picked he can hardly even be arsed playing with the rest of the team.

Every problem he has seems to be mental down to his confidence, or lack of it, and his decision making. He doesn't seem to be the most intelligent of players. Physically, he has the capacity to be amazing but the attitude doesn't seem to be matching up to that potential. It's holding him back.

He seems, dare I say it, lazy.

[DannyMan2006]

We've not seen the best of him, not by a long shot. In an ideal world I would keep him, at worst send him on loan to get form and confidence back.

I would say 80% of us think he will go on to be a star, the only point is what club he achieves this at. So why be in such a hurry to get rid. It's not as if we are desperate for the money. At present our squad seems fine and I don't see where selling Babel and bringing in someone else would greatly benefit the team.

[Maxiedge]

You know, I started a legendary thread last season entitled "The Enigma that is Xabi Alonso". It basically discussed whether Xabi would ever capture his first season form and become the player we hoped. Let's not forget that Alonso was pretty useless last season.

I feel the same about Babel. I think he's going through a pretty bad patch but he's still making a killer contribution IMO (scored against Newcastle, setup Gerrard/Nando with a flicked header last game, nice setup for Stevie before that).

I beleive he'll come good.

[saj]

You know, I started a legendary thread last season entitled "The Enigma that is Xabi Alonso". It basically discussed whether Xabi would ever capture his first season form and become the player we hoped. Let's not forget that Alonso was pretty useless last season.

I feel the same about Babel. I think he's going through a pretty bad patch but he's still making a killer contribution IMO (scored against Newcastle, setup Gerrard/Nando with a flicked header last game, nice setup for Stevie before that).

I beleive he'll come good.

Very harsh and unfair. Mascherano hasn't played to the same level as last year, does that make him useless?

[Neil Young]

I think you can read almost anything into Babel's over celebration.

For me it captured the essential paradox of life - that to live is, some day, to die. The explosion of joy at scoring a goal (an obvious simulacrum for both the pain and glory of birth and the ecstasy of orgasm, itself a pre-manifestation of the rite of birth that it presages) is at once and forever tainted by the meaningless of the goal (or, so clearly in a post-existentialist world where the numbness of death is both a daily reality and yet also a frightening secret we withhold from ourselves, life) itself. Beating Newcastle 5-1 is both satisfying and hollow and in Babel's over-celebration of the then important but ultimately futile second goal we see both its apogee and apotheosis.