Can someone tell me why

[Craig_H]

We only ever really go for it, when we're behind?

It's a common trait of our side. Boro at home, it takes us to go behind before we push forward. Wigan at home, the same thing. Hull at home, 2-0 down, we go for it. Back to 2-2, we stop. Hell, even Istanbul was the same.

Generally speaking, we dont actually push forward with any real purpose - until we go behind. And of course, like tonight, sometimes you go behind when it's too late to rectify it.

This mentality is seriously risky and not one of champions, i'm afraid.

Before people slate me, actually look at the evidence and ask yourself honestly if you can make a genuine case for this viewpoint being wrong.

[Joe King]

Its quite a good point. Its a combination of things - the lack of freedom from Benitez would have vanished, the fans get on the players back, the opposing team sits back and allow us to have the ball.

Its a problem and its why we need to have better ball players in the side with urgency and sharpness to play in the side.

[ukfootballfan101]

I agree, but I think part of it is the players we have in attack.

I'm a huge fan of Kuyt, I love the guy, but if it was a choice between him and Diego or Gourcuff i'd sell him straight away, we also need more competition for Riera on the left, he's done a great job for us, but I want someone tricky who can unlock teams like Everton, Ben Arfa would do nicely!

[Craig_H]

I really dont think it's got THAT much to do with the personnel.

I think it's because Rafa's footballing philosophy is to keep the ball, not force anything, not up the tempo and force errors from the opposition, but to keep it and wait for an opening, then try and strike.

His style relies on keeping possession, drawing out the opposition and then using the space that's left.

But there's two problems with that.

One, they know what we're waiting for, so they dont let themselves get drawn out.

Two, if they DO get drawn out, it relies on us to move the ball forward quickly and take advantage of the space they leave - but we've got it embedded into our footballing mentality that we DONT move the ball forwards. We retain the 'slow and steady' approach and consequently, find it incredibly hard to take advantage of any space that might be briefly left for us.

It's the sole biggest reason why we fail to turn our 'control' into goals and why we draw so much.

[Icon]

Raised my eyebrows when there was 2 mins left and we actually ran at them.

Was exhausting!

[Craig_H]

Raised my eyebrows when there was 2 mins left and we actually ran at them.

Was exhausting!

It's typical of Rafa and how he does things.

Only attack when you're losing

[Tee]

It is all about mentality - our team is coached not to concede first and foremost and then build from there. Wrong philosophy IMO - we should be going out to attack and take the initiative in most games, with odd exceptions I thought this was the Liverpool way.

[ukfootballfan101]

I really dont think it's got THAT much to do with the personnel.

I think it's because Rafa's footballing philosophy is to keep the ball, not force anything, not up the tempo and force errors from the opposition, but to keep it and wait for an opening, then try and strike.

His style relies on keeping possession, drawing out the opposition and then using the space that's left.

But there's two problems with that.

One, they know what we're waiting for, so they dont let themselves get drawn out.

Two, if they DO get drawn out, it relies on us to move the ball forward quickly and take advantage of the space they leave - but we've got it embedded into our footballing mentality that we DONT move the ball forwards. We retain the 'slow and steady' approach and consequently, find it incredibly hard to take advantage of any space that might be briefly left for us.

It's the sole biggest reason why we fail to turn our 'control' into goals and why we draw so much.

You're right about Rafa's style, but I still think there is a problem with the players, how often do we see Kuyt charge someone down, do a great job of winning the ball then mess up a pass or cross?

[Craig_H]

It is all about mentality - our team is coached not to concede first and foremost and then build from there. Wrong philosophy IMO - we should be going out to attack and take the initiative in most games, with odd exceptions I thought this was the Liverpool way.

Spot on. I wish someone would fill Rafa in on it.

[Joe King]

Spot on. I wish someone would fill Rafa in on it.

I doubt he would listen.

[Marky]

dunno.

[Craig_H]

I just dont get it. His Valencia team passed the ball, moved, got it forward quickly and were a joy to watch. We're clueless going forward.

[Icon]

It comes down to industry.

SG has it.
Xabi has it mostly

But thats about it....

[FatTony]

We only ever really go for it, when we're behind?

[Tee]

I just dont get it. His Valencia team passed the ball, moved, got it forward quickly and were a joy to watch. We're clueless going forward.

I was just thinking the exact same thing. And for this reason I retain hope in Rafa in terms of the way he can get us playing.

We have the players IMO, well a large percentage anyway to play that way, they just need a tweek in their approach, tempo and 'mentality' when they take the field.