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Houllier or Rafa's?

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    Houllier or Rafa's?

    As the curtain prematurely closed on yet another EPL title I thought I'd have a quick look at Houlliers squad to compare his players with the pile that walked on to the pitch this afternoon in what was the most important game of the season. It was last chance saloon and we folded pathetically to a team fighting relegation.

    People keep saying that the squad is better under Rafa, how much the squad has improved, but lets compare like for like with the players on the pitch for Gerrards last game.

    Jerzy Dudek
    John Arne Riise
    Jamie Carragher
    Sami Hyypia
    Steve Finnan
    Harry Kewell
    Steven Gerrard
    Dietmar Hamann
    Danny Murphy
    Emile Heskey
    Michael Owen

    Other than Dudek and Murphy, would you swap anyone? At times each of Houlliers squad were considered some of the best in the league. Riise was
    always fancied by rival supports...our scandinavian Roberto Carlos. What he lacked defensively, he made up for in attack. Carra and Hyypia at the time were the best, most solid partnership in the league. Finnan, one of the top 3 in the EPL, solid as a rock. Kewell (forgetting his sick note) had talent in abundance, Gerrard (no need), and Hamman (the best again). Murphy was average, but then even this average player liked to score against the mancs. Heskey played the supporting role for Owen very well, and could play the lone striker role far better than Kuyt. Owen, one of the best goal poachers to ever grace the pitch. On the bench we had Baros, Pongolle and the handball legend that was Henchoz.

    Compare this with the likes of Kuyt, Babel, Skyrtel, ElZhar, Ngog and Lucas and its not even close. Other than Alonso, and adding an injured Torres and Reina, Houlliers 11 were the better side with far more to offer moving forward, and much stonger in defence. Ultimately, they never achieved what they should've done under Houllier, but for all the money Rafa has spent I don't see the huge strides that others do.

    So thats 18 now for the mancs...it was onl a couple of weeks ago that Fergie said it was between them and us....
    Last edited by FatTony; 28-02-09, 06:54 PM.

    "If Gerrard continues to play up front, leaving this lack of creativity and intelligence in Midfield, the season WILL be over by Xmas."

    I still don't think we'll finish in the top 4 this season."

    FatTony 24/08/09

    #2
    Originally posted by FatTony View Post
    Jerzy Dudek - not playing
    John Arne Riise - glad he's left
    Jamie Carragher - declining
    Sami Hyypia - declining
    Steve Finnan - declining
    Harry Kewell - crocked
    Steven Gerrard
    Dietmar Hamann - off the radar
    Danny Murphy - plays for Fulham FFS
    Emile Heskey - **** off
    Michael Owen - **** off
    This is 2009, those players are all useless now. The fact is we had to replace them no matter what. We have built a good squad for now, and more importantly for the future
    Sack swinging like Dub-D40 on a door hinge

    Comment


      #3
      Originally posted by wiw View Post
      This is 2009, those players are all useless now. The fact is we had to replace them no matter what. We have built a good squad for now, and more importantly for the future
      Yes, but we haven't replaced them with players who are as good as they were, thats my point.

      We've built a good squad for the future how exactly? By having several average players for each position?

      The fact of the matter is Rafa has only brought in Torres, Reina and arguably Alonso who are better players than anything Houllier had. Flooding the squad with large numbers of average players goes hand in hand with Rafa's safe approach to football.

      "If Gerrard continues to play up front, leaving this lack of creativity and intelligence in Midfield, the season WILL be over by Xmas."

      I still don't think we'll finish in the top 4 this season."

      FatTony 24/08/09

      Comment


        #4
        Rafa's squad is generally good and stronger.

        He doesnt get the best out of them though.

        Comment


          #5
          Sorry I may not have read your post properly. I'll answer properly in a bit
          Sack swinging like Dub-D40 on a door hinge

          Comment


            #6
            Originally posted by Craig_H View Post
            Rafa's squad is generally good and stronger.

            He doesnt get the best out of them though.
            Stronger only in the sense that he has more resources than Houllier, but definitley weaker in ability.

            "If Gerrard continues to play up front, leaving this lack of creativity and intelligence in Midfield, the season WILL be over by Xmas."

            I still don't think we'll finish in the top 4 this season."

            FatTony 24/08/09

            Comment


              #7
              Originally posted by FatTony View Post
              Stronger only in the sense that he has more resources than Houllier, but definitley weaker in ability.
              Not sure i'd agree.

              Comment


                #8
                Originally posted by Craig_H View Post
                Not sure i'd agree.
                Not really being very specific.

                Well, can you say which of the team playing today is individually better than those listed above for Houlliers last game?

                "If Gerrard continues to play up front, leaving this lack of creativity and intelligence in Midfield, the season WILL be over by Xmas."

                I still don't think we'll finish in the top 4 this season."

                FatTony 24/08/09

                Comment


                  #9
                  Jerzy Dudek
                  John Arne Riise
                  Jamie Carragher
                  Sami Hyypia
                  Steve Finnan: Would rather have kept him than Dossena
                  Harry Kewell
                  Steven Gerrard
                  Dietmar Hamann: Him over Lucas any ****ing day of the week!
                  Danny Murphy
                  Emile Heskey
                  Michael Owen: ALL DAY LONG!!!! Should sign the ****er for nothing in the summer!

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Originally posted by FatTony View Post
                    Not really being very specific.

                    Well, can you say which of the team playing today is individually better than those listed above for Houlliers last game?
                    It's not just about individuals though, it's also about the sum of all parts, the mentality, the team ethic etc.

                    Rafa's team has proven to be virtually unbeatable in the Champions League, compared to GH's lot, there's no contest.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Originally posted by Craig_H View Post
                      It's not just about individuals though, it's also about the sum of all parts, the mentality, the team ethic etc.

                      Rafa's team has proven to be virtually unbeatable in the Champions League, compared to GH's lot, there's no contest.
                      Europe I'd agree, but I'm talking about the EPL.

                      You can't dismiss the importance of individual talent, just look at the Mancs and Chavs.

                      Rafa's team has once again proved that it does not have the mental strength to win the EPL, or indeed the quality of talent.

                      We can't keep clutching at Europe, it may not always be there.

                      BTW Is that an addmission that individually, 5 years on and £130m later, Rafa's team doesn't have the quality of Houlliers?
                      Last edited by FatTony; 28-02-09, 07:38 PM.

                      "If Gerrard continues to play up front, leaving this lack of creativity and intelligence in Midfield, the season WILL be over by Xmas."

                      I still don't think we'll finish in the top 4 this season."

                      FatTony 24/08/09

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Originally posted by FatTony View Post
                        Europe I'd agree, but I'm talking about the EPL.

                        You can't dismiss the importance of individual talent, just look at the Mancs and Chavs.

                        Rafa's team has once again proved that it does not have the mental strength to win the EPL, or indeed the quality of talent.

                        We can't keep clutching at Europe, it may not always be there.

                        ****ing ****, I live there!!!!

                        Comment


                          #13
                          They need to sort it out asap as we are now 3rd and have the chavs breathing down our necks

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Originally posted by pondus View Post
                            ****ing ****, I live there!!!!
                            I could not dig, I dared not rob:
                            Therefore I lied to please the mob.
                            Now all my lies are proved untrue
                            And I must face the men I slew.
                            What tale shall serve me here among
                            Mine angry and defrauded young?

                            Comment


                              #15
                              We have not had a full out attacking team since the days of Evans! At least his teams would go for it. Think back then we had the right team but wrong man in charge. We should have moved heaven and earth to bring back kenny after the 1995 season he won the prem with blackburn as he would of no doubt have jumped at the chance.

                              Comment

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