Defending corners/Men on the line

[The Birdman]

The Scholes incident today got me thinking, do you think one of the reasons we don't have people on the posts is so that doesn't happen to us?
Arguably Utd would still have won or got at least a point if they had conceeded a goal but still had 11 men on the pitch, Scholes' dismissal gave Fulham even more belief that they could hold on physcologically more than anything because they knew they had the extra man.

I don't want to get too excited but I honestly think Fergie is losing it, always having a bite in the press about Rafa and us as a club, now they'll play Villa (hopefully desperate for the points after we've beaten them) without Vidic, Rooney and Scholes.
Tomorrow's game is vital, I'd go as far as to say it's our biggest of the season if we can win the momentum will defo be with us.

[Exiled_red]

Having seen it I don't know what he was thinking, I don't think it's a natural reaction to stick you hand out to block the shot on the line, so I don't think it's a legitimate reason not to have men on the posts. Lots of teams have men on the posts and it's rare to see a handball like that. Personally I would always have men on posts at corners

It was a stupid decision to make at such a stage in the match, I've heard an arguement of 'taking one for the team' if it was very late on in a match you were winning by a single goal and it could cost you a couple of points, and put pressure on the penalty taker (not very sporting though). But doing it so early in a game inevitably cost them today.

Also I don't think Scholes is that much of a miss for them as Vidic and Rooney as he doesn't play every week these days anyway

[red g]

Having seen it I don't know what he was thinking, I don't think it's a natural reaction to stick you hand out to block the shot on the line, so I don't think it's a legitimate reason not to have men on the posts. Lots of teams have men on the posts and it's rare to see a handball like that. Personally I would always have men on posts at corners

It was a stupid decision to make at such a stage in the match, I've heard an arguement of 'taking one for the team' if it was very late on in a match you were winning by a single goal and it could cost you a couple of points, and put pressure on the penalty taker (not very sporting though). But doing it so early in a game inevitably cost them today.

Also I don't think Scholes is that much of a miss for them as Vidic and Rooney as he doesn't play every week these days anyway

scholes will be missed, he has been playing really well the last few games and with potentially berba out, rooney out and ronaldo off form there are running out of match winners

[The Red Cardinal]

One interesting point about not having men on the line is it brings in offside against the guy blocking your keeper - not from the original corner obviously, but from any body who heads it on.

Re: the handball on the line thing, I think that's really interesting. It is, in those circumstances you describe, akin to cheating - I'm thinking Neville for example in "The Kuyt Derby" and I know it doesn't happen often but I wonder why it's not made a greater deal out of when it does.

[Exiled_red]

scholes will be missed, he has been playing really well the last few games and with potentially berba out, rooney out and ronaldo off form there are running out of match winners

I just meant he'll get a one match ban and he only seems to be starting every other game so is effectively on the fringes of their team at the moment, Rooney and Vidic play more or less every game

One interesting point about not having men on the line is it brings in offside against the guy blocking your keeper - not from the original corner obviously, but from any body who heads it on.

Re: the handball on the line thing, I think that's really interesting. It is, in those circumstances you describe, akin to cheating - I'm thinking Neville for example in "The Kuyt Derby" and I know it doesn't happen often but I wonder why it's not made a greater deal out of when it does.

Am watching it on football first and sky are saying it was a natural reaction and that the referee has no choice. Commemtator was saying that it's a harsh punishment to give a penalty and red card It probably the ultimate form of cheating in football if you think about it

[Dhav]

I just meant he'll get a one match ban and he only seems to be starting every other game so is effectively on the fringes of their team at the moment, Rooney and Vidic play more or less every game



Am watching it on football first and sky are saying it was a natural reaction and that the referee has no choice. Commemtator was saying that it's a harsh punishment to give a penalty and red card It probably the ultimate form of cheating in football if you think about it

The bit in bold is, frankly, complete nonsense. Like you say, it is the ultimate form of cheating because you are preventing a certain goal by illegal methods - what if Scholes isn't sent off but Fulham then miss the penalty? They will have been illegally denied a certain goal and have nothing to show for the fact they would have had a legitimate goal but for Man U's cheating. The penalty, after all, gives Man U a chance to prevent the goal being scored. That would be an unjust scenario.

We had this same debate last season after Phil Neville handled Lucas' goal bound shot, and many people said that in circumstances like that it is only fair that a goal should be awarded. The only reason why I don't agree with that is because I believe the ball crossing over the line for it to be a goal is sacrosanct and is one of the rules of football that must absolutely not be messed with. Otherwise I think a red card and a penalty for someone who illegally and deliberately prevents a certain goal in that fashion is frankly not punishment enough.

[Shaggy]

Scholes is a total cheat. Anyone remember his disgraceful yet comical attempt at scoring with his hand in some European game? Add to that his penchant for neck-breaking tackles (of course, lovely ickle Scholesy never means it) and now today's act of cheating.

[Dhav]

Scholes is a total cheat. Anyone remember his disgraceful yet comical attempt at scoring with his hand in some European game? Add to that his penchant for neck-breaking tackles (of course, lovely ickle Scholesy never means it) and now today's act of cheating.

Was that in the Super Cup earlier in the season?

All of their lot are ****ing cheats. Their antics today were a disgrace; Ronaldo's lunge that could have easily seen red, then their comical reaction to the Rooney sending off.

It's obvious to me that they think they can get away with murder on the pitch. Does anyone in their right mind and who knows anything about football disagree with a single word Rafa said in his so called "rant"?

[red g]

Scholes is a total cheat. Anyone remember his disgraceful yet comical attempt at scoring with his hand in some European game? Add to that his penchant for neck-breaking tackles (of course, lovely ickle Scholesy never means it) and now today's act of cheating.

Scholes has done some awful tackles over the years and i ralways emember the commentators almost joking about them....he doesnt know how to tackle another scum media darling