Rafa Transfer FACTS....

[fred_plasticine]

we had just finished 30 points behind arsenal the season before rafa took over.
15 and 19 points behind man utd and chelsea repectively.
he's had to rebuild a squad of pretty average players. you only have to look at where the players he sold play their trade now. baros, anyone? diouf? need i say more?

if you're not given huge sums of money in advance but are dependend on sales then yes net spend is hugely important.
when you're able to buy a 20+ striker and you're able to recoup some of that money - great.
but if you need to rely on other clubs to buy what you have on offer in order to get the money together to shop for a 20+ striker than that's a different story altogether.

[FatTony]

that is a terrible argument.
so you didnt want us to sign xabi and morientes for a combined 17mill? you also would have preferred we kept hold of cheyrou, letallc, diao, biscan etc on expensive contracts? pure genius.

Morientes was a disaster. I would've kept Biscan and Le Tallec as squad players yes. I would've kept Murphy, Pongolle and either Cisse/Baros/Bellamy too (purely as squad players) as well as Warnock.

They sure weren't any worse than the likes of Gonzales, Josemi, Mortientes, Nunez, Kronkamp, Palletta, Pennant, Voronin, Dossena.

It amazes me how poor Houlliers squad was when it won the FA Cup, UEFA Cup, League Cup AND the Champions League.... In fact, "Rafa's" team has yet to win anything really.

[BFG]

Morientes was a disaster. I would've kept Biscan and Le Tallec as squad players yes. I would've kept Murphy, Pongolle and either Cisse/Baros/Bellamy too (purely as squad players) as well as Warnock.

If we'd done that there'd be no money for Torres, Benayoun etc. I'm sure Rafa would have kept some of the players you've mentioned. It's not his fault that in order to sign better players he's had to sell players that would have been useful to keep in the squad.

It amazes me how poor Houlliers squad was when it won the FA Cup, UEFA Cup, League Cup AND the Champions League.... In fact, "Rafa's" team has yet to win anything really.

It's widely accepted that Houlliers squad had gotten worse by the time Rafa came. He's won the FA Cup and Champions League and got to another final. Is anyone blinkered enough to really believe we'd have gotten anywhere near Istanbul without Xabi or Little Luis?

[Icon]

Rafa likes his FACTS apparently...

Fulham
Aston Villa
Chelsea
Tottenham
Sunderland

Which means that we won't lose another game this season

Rafas has an 'H' in......Hull also?

[Scratch]

Rafas has an 'H' in......Hull also?

So only one more loss for the season...and we seem unable to draw games, so that leaves us with 26 games to win...32 wins, 6 loses...96 points...we will be champions!

[FatTony]

If we'd done that there'd be no money for Torres, Benayoun etc. I'm sure Rafa would have kept some of the players you've mentioned. It's not his fault that in order to sign better players he's had to sell players that would have been useful to keep in the squad.



It's widely accepted that Houlliers squad had gotten worse by the time Rafa came. He's won the FA Cup and Champions League and got to another final. Is anyone blinkered enough to really believe we'd have gotten anywhere near Istanbul without Xabi or Little Luis?

No, not at all. The blinkers are being worn by most people on here who think Rafa's made no mistakes.

Houlliers players made up something like 11 of the 15 man squad that actually won something under Rafa and the players that won us that were Gerrard, Carra, Hamman, Smicer and Alonso.

People are blinkered when they keep saying that we needed this massive overhaul because Houlliers squad was ****.

[Icon]

So only one more loss for the season...and we seem unable to draw games, so that leaves us with 26 games to win...32 wins, 6 loses...96 points...we will be champions!

Cool - feel a whole lot better!

[Scratch]

Cool - feel a whole lot better!

Positive Mental Attitude

[DannyMan2006]

How can we be compare transfer spending to the other big 3?

When Rafa came in every single one of those clubs had a better squad. Man Utd had been great for a while, Arsenal had not long since finished the season unbeaten, whilst Chelsea had already splashed the cash in a big way.

Then there is the other factor. The article mentions Man Utd figures being massaged by Ronaldo. Forget that one. Their figures have been massaged by the development of their youth team players. They have been either brought through to the first team or sold on at big profits.

If Rafa had the same quality coming through the youth team ranks his spending would look a lot better.

[DannyMan2006]

No, not at all. The blinkers are being worn by most people on here who think Rafa's made no mistakes.

Houlliers players made up something like 11 of the 15 man squad that actually won something under Rafa and the players that won us that were Gerrard, Carra, Hamman, Smicer and Alonso.

People are blinkered when they keep saying that we needed this massive overhaul because Houlliers squad was ****.

We wouldn't have got their without Luis Garcia though. His goals against Chelsea and Juventus spring to mind, but I think he got about six in the CL that season.

He was of course a rafa signing.

[BFG]

No, not at all. The blinkers are being worn by most people on here who think Rafa's made no mistakes.

Houlliers players made up something like 11 of the 15 man squad that actually won something under Rafa and the players that won us that were Gerrard, Carra, Hamman, Smicer and Alonso.

People are blinkered when they keep saying that we needed this massive overhaul because Houlliers squad was ****.

I haven't seen a single person say Rafa has made no mistakes.

Do you remember what our record was like in the CL under Houllier? We were a soft touch and everyone knew it.

Garcia scored 5 goals in the knockout stages in 2005. If Houllier had been there we'd have seen the likes of Diouf and Cheyrou put us out of the competition at the first available opportunity. Basically Rafa had very little to spend (especially when you consider Owen left that summer too) and played a blinder in bringing in two of the most influential players we had in that run. He also managed to motivate players and utilise their strengths while covering up their weaknesses with his tactical acumen. He bought very well and made existing players better (Carra the left back was transformed into a great central defender almost overnight, Biscan suddenly looked like he could do a job, Finnan started playing like we all hoped he would and Traore won the CL FFS!)

So apart from highlighting how successful Rafa was in 2005 in terms of his signings, improvement of existing staff and some tactical masterstrokes I'm not sure what your point is. Without Rafa we'd never have had Istanbul, you know it, I know it, my dog knows it. **** me he's great isn't he. Rafa.

[the rev leeroy brown]

Without DIDI HAMMAN we'd never have had Istanbul, you know it, I know it, my dog knows it. **** me he's great isn't he. DIDI

[DannyMan2006]

Ah, Didi Hamann. Another great player nearing the end of his time who needed replacing. Shame he wasn't 21 as we'd have saved £18m on Mascherano.

GH got the sack because his players didn't do the business. Rafa came in, added a couple of players and they did do the business. So winning the CL was thanks to Rafa Benitez, not Didi Hamann.

Hamann was a key player in Istanbul, but I can point to other players who had a major part to play, and not just Rafa signings. Mellor and Pong as well as Gerrard v Olympiakos.

Alonso away to Juve in Turin was a master class. Sami and Luis with the goals at home. Biscan away to Depor was incredible, from useless under GH to a classy player under Rafa.

I could go on. But it is safe to say that winning the CL was down to Rafa, not Didi Hamann.

[FatTony]