Why is our defence so s***!!!

[calvoboy]

We just need a settled back four for a few games. Particularly a settled centre-back partnership. We've had every possible combination of Skrtel, Agger, Carra and Kyrgiakos so far this season, and it shows. Good defences are built on understanding and leadership from the two centre backs (and keeper).

That's why I couldn't understand picking Carra at right back last night (unless Degen was injured, was he?). Carra and Agger are our best partnership, we need to give them half a dozen games together to build up an understanding and lead the defence.

[brightred]

We shouldn't have let Hansen retire at such an early age.

[dww]

Lucas was I think turned sieways. I do not know whether there was a good reason for that or whether he got it wrong. But a bigger issue was that Insua showed him the inside but no onewas satisfactorily covering that possibility.

I agree it is all very scary.

Lucas was covering CB and doesn't have the natural reactions that a defender would have in that situation. It was a mistake by him but a forgivable one I think.

I think that the problem in general was one of a lack of coordination - someone had to make the decision to go in and make the tackle. I feel that was a result of a/ the fact that a lot of people were out of position; b/ we don't have a settled back unit - in that scenario instinct is more likely to take over and indecision is less apparent; c/ we have been playing poorly so individuals lack the confidence to back their own judgement.

[andrewces38]

It was a poor goal to concede and thankfully it didn't cost us a few points ,Insua showed a lefty inside poor decision , Agger Carra didn't even put any pressure on the ball or man and Lucas turned away which was also a bad decision.
All in All our defending this season is piss poor to be honest and I put a lot of that down to players over achieving in recent seasons when Sami was there to guide them , for me Carra is the main culprit very bad form all season long, too slow,hoofs the ball like a sunday league player and since he headbutted Skyrtl early in the season even his form is shot, Insua should be rested (not dropped because he's the one young player that rafa trusts and will come good)for a few games , and Rafa should have more trust in younger Players. If Johnson was ruled out then play a right back and not **** about with the center pairing just to accomadate .
IMO we should try and stick to a settled partnership at the heart of defence and play players in their rightfull positions Darby or Degan should be RB ahead of Carra he has not a single creative bone in his body . A truly legend of this club but im sorry his best is behind him

[dww]

I don't think this is worth another thread really so I just thought I would note how useful Arbeloa was for us - a steady defender who could also get the ball into midfield, understood our system well and could play in multiple positions.

[Rich]

Arguably missed just as much as Alonso

[Joe King]

Cards on the table time - someone save this post and laugh at me when I'm proved wrong....

Our defense is **** because:

1. Skrtel is suffering from an appalling lack of form
2. Carragher is suffering from a lack of form and being shifted back and forth between CB and RB
3. Insua, may be a promising player, but he needs to be dropped and shouldn't be first choice.
4. Hyypia gone and NOT replaced
5. Agger out injured early part of season, only seems to be latterly getting his form back
6. Johnson a great attacking fullback, poor defender - shouldn't have been bought, and certainly shouldn't have been bought at £17m when we're skint
7. Too many changes in the backline, many enforced by injury, some tactical. We need a settled line-up.
8. Set-pieces - a disaster area.
9. Lack of height in the team overall, leaving us more vulnerable at set-pieces.
10. The Greek Chabal

I agree with all of that and I like the use of bulletpoints. A+

[spanky]

i think its simple lack of basic defending and a lack of aggression when clearing the line. i just think about lyons first goal at anfield when the ball pinged around in front of goal and pepe made some cracking saves. well if you look at it nobody bar kelly and reina was bursting a gut to get it away, they all froze. its like we just freeze sometimes when a ball is played in at pace whereas last year we we're pouncing on everything and defending like our lives depended on it. forget zonal marking, if you can't do the basics your pretty screwed.

[BrianF80]

For you tactical whizzes out there...

Individually and collectively we have been so poor this season. I know Insua's a liability, Skrtel and Jamie have not been good by their standards. But the way Wigan got that goal was frightening. We seem to be defending badly all over the pitch. For God's sake how can we go from a team with one of the best defences in the league to one that seems certain to concede virtually every game.

We know Rafa is a brilliant defensive coach - what has happened.

I posted this somewhere else

There are some very obvious things about our defence this season.

Both our first choice full backs are suspect positionally and are/were aggressive in getting forward. Insua's weakness positionally is because he switches off every so often and Johnson I think primarily because of unfamiliarity. If that is the case with your fullbacks you need to have center halves that are exceptional in covering behind them when they mess up positionally and also good at pressuring high up the pitch when the full back is forward.

For me Agger is the only one who is complete enough to do this. I think that's why you are vacillating between B & C for Insua. With Agger to cover for his mistakes he's a B player, but when he's been alongside Carra/Skrtel/The Greek his mistakes have been more costly and he's been a C.

Unfortunately, on the other side we don't have a center half who is as complete and hence we have dialed back Johnson significantly so that Carragher is not isolated one on one as much and is covering rather than pressuring, so for me that pairing is a big big disappointment as Johnson is not allowed to fulfill his potential. He gets a B which is a pity because he is an A+ player and it's not his fault. Carragher has just been awful. If he wasn't so important psychologically and Skrtel hadn't fluffed his lines (while still being better than Carragher IMO), he would be out. He's done so many things this year that just defy explanation.

The midfield also isn't helping, Rafa has messed around with the roles to go to a more 442 type setup and so the defence is getting less support. In years gone past when we were under pressure Xabi as well as the normal screening would, on occasion, drop back into the defensive line to make up numbers or just to get us numbers up. That's not happening anymore, once you get through our midfield screen the defence is on their own. The Johnson own goal is a perfect example, if Xabi was playing where Mascherano was, he would have dropped behind Agger into the defensive line. It all means more pressure on the defence and inevitably more goals.

We've also been pissing around with our zonal marking scheme, understandably as we are not great aerially and the changes seemed pretty straightforward to me, but it's cost us on a couple of occasions.

Chuck in unsettled line-ups and too many games where the front 4 are giving up possession too easily causing pressure on the midfield in turn causing pressure on the defence and you have our season.

[frank the tank]

perhaps we should play to our strenghtsa bit more - put it this way, yes skrtel and carra have been off form big time but so has dirk kuyt - agger, gerrard and torres have been injured - as has riera and aurelio......this has been some unlucky time for rafa in terms of having a good squad available....

i actually look at the options available and wouldnt mind seeing a team of:

---------------------------REINA-----------------------------

----------SKRTEL--------CARRAGHER------AGGER-------------

JOHNSON--------------------------------------------AURELIO

--------------MASCHERANO--------GERRARD-----------------


BENAYOUN--------------------------------AQUILANI----------


-----------------------TORRES------------------------------



I feel that we would still score a few but maybe the team just needs to keep a few clean sheets to get it's overall confidence back..... also, johnson and aurelio would have some form of freedom to bomb on and get down the wings...............

[el matador]

the other way to look at this is that if we have the ball the opposition cant attack and when alonso was here we dominated possession in most games.

Since he's gone, we havent been able to keep the ball very well and if our opponents have more of the ball - its logical that they will create more chances.

But we look suspect and fragile.

[JohnDoe]

the other way to look at this is that if we have the ball the opposition cant attack and when alonso was here we dominated possession in most games.

Agree. We are much poorer in possession and it causes us to be under pressure more often, but it's not just that. Alonso was consistently our best ball winner. He won the ball more and got more successful tackles on average than even Mascherano. He was very underrated defensively, some people just never saw it because he didn't slide into tackles.

[Marky]

perhaps we should play to our strenghtsa bit more - put it this way, yes skrtel and carra have been off form big time but so has dirk kuyt - agger, gerrard and torres have been injured - as has riera and aurelio......this has been some unlucky time for rafa in terms of having a good squad available....

i actually look at the options available and wouldnt mind seeing a team of:

---------------------------REINA-----------------------------

----------SKRTEL--------CARRAGHER------AGGER-------------

JOHNSON--------------------------------------------AURELIO

--------------MASCHERANO--------GERRARD-----------------


BENAYOUN--------------------------------AQUILANI----------


-----------------------TORRES------------------------------



I feel that we would still score a few but maybe the team just needs to keep a few clean sheets to get it's overall confidence back..... also, johnson and aurelio would have some form of freedom to bomb on and get down the wings...............

I like the look of that team.

[Armchairkopite]

Insua is just utter ****e, full stop and i'm now starting to think Skrtel isn't up to it.

We can't just rely on Carragher as he's getting on and his form still isn't great so i say we need another two centre halfs and a left back.

Nail on imo, Insua cant tackle on his right side and thats just not good enough, although he is very young and has got other good attributes.

[Exiled_red]

perhaps we should play to our strenghtsa bit more - put it this way, yes skrtel and carra have been off form big time but so has dirk kuyt - agger, gerrard and torres have been injured - as has riera and aurelio......this has been some unlucky time for rafa in terms of having a good squad available....

i actually look at the options available and wouldnt mind seeing a team of:

---------------------------REINA-----------------------------

----------SKRTEL--------CARRAGHER------AGGER-------------

JOHNSON--------------------------------------------AURELIO

--------------MASCHERANO--------GERRARD-----------------


BENAYOUN--------------------------------AQUILANI----------


-----------------------TORRES------------------------------



I feel that we would still score a few but maybe the team just needs to keep a few clean sheets to get it's overall confidence back..... also, johnson and aurelio would have some form of freedom to bomb on and get down the wings...............

Am just curious to know has Aquilani ever played out on left side (or right) side of midfield?

I know it might not be popular but what about that team but with Gerrard on the right, benayoun on the left and Aquilani in the middle?