Real Liverpool Fans?

[Guest]

Another post asking fans to be unquestioning cap-doffers to the manager no matter how bad he is for the club. It is out of lifelong love for Liverpool that I am strongly opposed to the man currently in charge. Articles like this effectively require Reds to support the manager over the club. It's a ridiculous servile attitude. I am opposed to anything that harms Liverpool FC and that man is dragging the club into a mire.

But we were very good for 4 years under his reign, steadily improving every season up to the point of getting close to the league title last season. How can you conclude that the man is dragging us into a mire?

You're frustrated and that's understandable, don't let this turn your grey cells into a soup up there.

I understand that there comes a time when everything goes that bad that there's no turning back, but I can't understand why everything is laid to the manager's feet, when some of our most important players are simply not turning up. It's like telling your managers to get motivated when they should have been doing it by themselves in the first place.

[BobTheCharmer]

But we were very good for 4 years under his reign

no we weren't. at times last season we were very good. but for most of his reign the football has been boring. we're forever being told we'll get a style like that of valencia well its rarely happened.

you are deluded if you think otherwise.

[Guest]

you are deluded if you think otherwise.

Yes I am and I am also deluded to think LFC will never be great again.

[BG1973]

Another post asking fans to be unquestioning cap-doffers to the manager no matter how bad he is for the club. It is out of lifelong love for Liverpool that I am strongly opposed to the man currently in charge. Articles like this effectively require Reds to support the manager over the club. It's a ridiculous servile attitude. I am opposed to anything that harms Liverpool FC and that man is dragging the club into a mire.

What was your opinion of him at the end of last season?

[Kinell]

What was your opinion of him at the end of last season?

7 months is more than enough time for an opinion to change.

[squaddie]

I do agree to a point. I find it painful having to (on the rare occasion i manage to get the game) have to be surrounded by 'fans' who make you feel awkward if god forbid you feel the need to stand up and scream/shout/sing your ****in heart out... The severity of this obviously depends on which game you go to and where you sit. But ive got to say, the last couple of games ive been to i cant help but keep looking at the kop and wishing i was there instead.

On the other hand, if we didnt have these so called 'fair weather fans' paying for tickets how the **** could/should we expect to fill a larger stadium. Im pretty positive you dont get a quality atmos every game at the larger 60,000 seater stadiums.... And at the end of the day who are we to tell someone whos paid for a ticket they dont deserve to be there.

Plus the point about a 'real' Liverpool supporter backing the manager to the hilt. What deems a 'real' fan...... Ive listened to plenty of fans who spend most of their hard earned wages on tickets who bay for Rafa's blood just as much as the 'glory hunting' sports phone in ******s..... Does that mean their not a real fan?

[scully]

What was your opinion of him at the end of last season?

My opinion at the end of last season was why did a **** mid-season cost us our chance of a title? I imagine something similar will happen this season, around late February Rafa and the team will suddenly wake up and try to make something of the season, but yet again it'll be too late, except this time the damage will be far greater than last season as I have little hope of us getting into the top 4. I have absolutely no faith in Rafa's ability to get his team playing the way they should be playing over the course of a whole season, he still doesn't get the fact that to win this league you have to treat every single game like a cup final.

Seriously Saturday pushed me over the edge. After the game I got into a taxi driven by some **** whose hatred of Liverpool was already known to me, I had a lump in my throat and honestly thought I was going to start blubbing. I can honestly say it was the worst low I had experienced as a Red for 20 years, these past 2 months have been ****ing unbearable and that was the last straw. I absolutely desperately want us to go all out against Wolves, I want Rafa to turn things around and make me feel bad for hating him so much right now. But even if we had a magnificent roll for the rest of the season I don't think I will ever trust him again.

[Mattshark]

My opinion at the end of last season was why did a **** mid-season cost us our chance of a title? I imagine something similar will happen this season, around late February Rafa and the team will suddenly wake up and try to make something of the season, but yet again it'll be too late, except this time the damage will be far greater than last season as I have little hope of us getting into the top 4. I have absolutely no faith in Rafa's ability to get his team playing the way they should be playing over the course of a whole season, he still doesn't get the fact that to win this league you have to treat every single game like a cup final.

Seriously Saturday pushed me over the edge. After the game I got into a taxi driven by some **** whose hatred of Liverpool was already known to me, I had a lump in my throat and honestly thought I was going to start blubbing. I can honestly say it was the worst low I had experienced as a Red for 20 years, these past 2 months have been ****ing unbearable and that was the last straw. I absolutely desperately want us to go all out against Wolves, I want Rafa to turn things around and make me feel bad for hating him so much right now. But even if we had a magnificent roll for the rest of the season I don't think I will ever trust him again.

Because of one, admittedly very bad, spell? That is OTT imo.

[Guest]

My opinion at the end of last season was why did a **** mid-season cost us our chance of a title? I imagine something similar will happen this season, around late February Rafa and the team will suddenly wake up and try to make something of the season, but yet again it'll be too late, except this time the damage will be far greater than last season as I have little hope of us getting into the top 4. I have absolutely no faith in Rafa's ability to get his team playing the way they should be playing over the course of a whole season, he still doesn't get the fact that to win this league you have to treat every single game like a cup final.

Seriously Saturday pushed me over the edge. After the game I got into a taxi driven by some **** whose hatred of Liverpool was already known to me, I had a lump in my throat and honestly thought I was going to start blubbing. I can honestly say it was the worst low I had experienced as a Red for 20 years, these past 2 months have been ****ing unbearable and that was the last straw. I absolutely desperately want us to go all out against Wolves, I want Rafa to turn things around and make me feel bad for hating him so much right now. But even if we had a magnificent roll for the rest of the season I don't think I will ever trust him again.

You have to understand that players aren't robots and Rafa doesn't have a remote control to make them play as he wishes up to the lowest and finest details possible.

If they can't be arsed to play for the club then he's going to bear the responsibility for underachieving players. Managers prepare and lay the foundations for the players to thrive, and we've been steadily doing that during his time here, culminating to a second place finish 4 points off being champions last season. We never had a '****' first half of the season as you intimate, we had a bit of a blip after the new year when Man. Utd seemed to be regaining their form.

Saying all that, I am not sure the players are going to turn our season around, as I think they can't be arsed anymore. They want Rafa sacked, allegedly, and they'll get their wish.

[MrMichael]

You have to understand that players aren't robots and Rafa doesn't have a remote control to make them play as he wishes up to the lowest and finest details possible.

If they can't be arsed to play for the club then he's going to bear the responsibility for underachieving players. Managers prepare and lay the foundations for the players to thrive, and we've been steadily doing that during his time here, culminating to a second place finish 4 points off being champions last season. We never had a '****' first half of the season as you intimate, we had a bit of a blip after the new year when Man. Utd seemed to be regaining their form.
Saying all that, I am not sure the players are going to turn our season around, as I think they can't be arsed anymore. They want Rafa sacked, allegedly, and they'll get their wish.

You know dude, I respect your undying effort to adopt a glass-half-full mentality, but i'm starting to come round to Scully's way of thinking on this. Its easy to look back with rose-tinted specs, but there was quite a period last season during which we really weren't playing very well, but were generally getting the results. In fact I'm not sure we're playing all that much worse this year in terms of actual performances, but where we had the confidence to hang onto leads or go for late winners, now we're doing the opposite.

I can in fact remember points in each of the last 3 seasons now when elements of our fanbase were becoming rather disgruntled with Rafa's tenure. On each occasion I though they were being premature, and they were usually proven to be so by performances later in the season, but as much as we've had periods under Rafa when we've played some excellent football, we've also had sustained periods when we really haven't. Up until this year however, mental fortitude and belief in an overall plan has seemed to be the thing that's pulled us through, now we seem to have lost a lot of that things to me are looking really quite bleak. You can get away with iffy performances if results are generally good. But when your play is crap and your results are crap.....

And no matter how much its the owners, or the players fault, in football the buck where results are concerned always stops with the manager. I'd love Rafa to turn this around, but for the first time since he stepped through the door at Anfield, I don't have a great deal of faith that he will.

[Reece]

Christmas eve eve and reading that depresses me. I can't really argue with any of it either. I just love the guy, despite what some people may argue I genuinely believe he absolutely loves Liverpool and has fought for what he believe is best for us, and therefore am willing to give him at least until the end of the season before calling judgement. Hooah.

[-V-]

My opinion at the end of last season was why did a **** mid-season cost us our chance of a title? I imagine something similar will happen this season, around late February Rafa and the team will suddenly wake up and try to make something of the season, but yet again it'll be too late, except this time the damage will be far greater than last season as I have little hope of us getting into the top 4. I have absolutely no faith in Rafa's ability to get his team playing the way they should be playing over the course of a whole season, he still doesn't get the fact that to win this league you have to treat every single game like a cup final.

Seriously Saturday pushed me over the edge. After the game I got into a taxi driven by some **** whose hatred of Liverpool was already known to me, I had a lump in my throat and honestly thought I was going to start blubbing. I can honestly say it was the worst low I had experienced as a Red for 20 years, these past 2 months have been ****ing unbearable and that was the last straw. I absolutely desperately want us to go all out against Wolves, I want Rafa to turn things around and make me feel bad for hating him so much right now. But even if we had a magnificent roll for the rest of the season I don't think I will ever trust him again.

You know dude, I respect your undying effort to adopt a glass-half-full mentality, but i'm starting to come round to Scully's way of thinking on this. Its easy to look back with rose-tinted specs, but there was quite a period last season during which we really weren't playing very well, but were generally getting the results. In fact I'm not sure we're playing all that much worse this year in terms of actual performances, but where we had the confidence to hang onto leads or go for late winners, now we're doing the opposite.

I can in fact remember points in each of the last 3 seasons now when elements of our fanbase were becoming rather disgruntled with Rafa's tenure. On each occasion I though they were being premature, and they were usually proven to be so by performances later in the season, but as much as we've had periods under Rafa when we've played some excellent football, we've also had sustained periods when we really haven't. Up until this year however, mental fortitude and belief in an overall plan has seemed to be the thing that's pulled us through, now we seem to have lost a lot of that things to me are looking really quite bleak. You can get away with iffy performances if results are generally good. But when your play is crap and your results are crap.....

And no matter how much its the owners, or the players fault, in football the buck where results are concerned always stops with the manager. I'd love Rafa to turn this around, but for the first time since he stepped through the door at Anfield, I don't have a great deal of faith that he will.

Good posts

I agree. Every couple of weeks Rafa does the same thing, gives us a glimmer of hope that he is about to turn a corner but then the very next game blows away any hope by reverting to type. The night of the wigan game I was feeling slightly optimistic again as he had switched to 442 with natural width, natural balance in the middle and 2 frontmen. I thought here we go he's cracked it.

3 days later he brings back Lucas, Insua, Dossena, leaves out Ngog completely (our form player) and goes all out defence with 9 players sitting deep to combat ****ing portsmouth. Torres is left to fend for scraps in his own half and Rafa later says we had been playing well.

The man needs to be removed. He is costing us easy points every week. We aren't dropping points just because the players aren't good enough but more because he keeps picking the wrong system. We have a good enough squad to be cruising past portsmouth, its the manager thats screwing it up

[Mattshark]

Good posts

I agree. Every couple of weeks Rafa does the same thing, gives us a glimmer of hope that he is about to turn a corner but then the very next game blows away any hope by reverting to type. The night of the wigan game I was feeling slightly optimistic again as he had switched to 442 with natural width, natural balance in the middle and 2 frontmen. I thought here we go he's cracked it.

3 days later he brings back Lucas, Insua, Dossena, leaves out Ngog completely (our form player) and goes all out defence with 9 players sitting deep to combat ****ing portsmouth. Torres is left to fend for scraps in his own half and Rafa later says we had been playing well.

The man needs to be removed. He is costing us easy points every week. We aren't dropping points just because the players aren't good enough but more because he keeps picking the wrong system. We have a good enough squad to be cruising past portsmouth, its the manager thats screwing it up

No, it was the players that screwed it up at Portsmouth.

[Scratch]

No, it was the players that screwed it up at Portsmouth.

Big style...Johnson tame header to nowhere when he had time, and Mascher's stupidity put paid to any pre-match plans...up until the goal Portmouth had looked toothless, and after Mascher's recklessness the players just gave up.

[scully]

Because of one, admittedly very bad, spell? That is OTT imo.

How often have I and other posters burst that balloon of "one bad spell"? Sorry Matt, but I have long found it impossible to take you seriously as you are so utterly doctrinaire in your determination to prove yourself more-loyal-than-thou in your attitude towards our manager that you don't actually pay attention to opposing viewpoints, and I for one am sick of your condescending attitude. You don't so much think as look for ways of again justifying your own stance and just end up coming across as an "I saw nothing wrong" Arsene Wenger type. Loyalty is a good trait, but blind loyalty resembles mental laziness and is in the end suicidal.