Lille post-mortem

[el matador]

Can't argue with that, but like I said I don't believe in the losing the dressing room stuff.

Unquestionably Xabi has been a huge loss, but there were so many times when we played well and achieved great results when he was with us but not playing due to injury or whatever. Confidence back then was obviously much higher, and I believe our players lost confidence at the start of this season and have been too gutless to rekindle it. They've shown no reserves of character - something we showed in spades last season with the amazing late surges to force last-minute winners.

the two biggest personalities within our dressing room both look a little disinterested at the minute. Coincidentally, these two are our captain and vice captain, the two local lads, and probably the only two players left from the houllier era. The two players who love the club the most.

They said at the start of the season the excuses had to stop and this was the crucial season and that we had to deliver.

We havent delivered and carra says he isnt bothered about leaving the only club he genuinely loves and has played his entire career for and gerrard doesnt look bothered at all on the pitch.

If any other players than these two loyal servants had done the same thing we shouldnt bat an eyelid but because its the two foundations of this team we should be taking note.

For me, both of them are making clear statements about the way the team and the club are being managed by benitez and the american owners. Its not good enough and short of them both putting in transfer requests (which they both wont) there's not a lot else they can do.

But its clear that they dont believe in rafa.

[Rich]

The sentiment was fine and the team's performance certainly justified it, but i didnt understand the rush to thrust it in his face so desperately.

Furthermore, when only one of his seasons in charge yielded a title challenge, i dont know why there was such a desire for such a long contract. Evidence suggested that last season was the exception to the rule and this season backs that up emphatically.

Arguably though we'd been building our league position every year, so there was no reason to suspect that we wouldn't be seriously challenging this year. And clubs tend to reward (relative) success with long contracts, which stops them getting poached too (or at least increasing the compensation package value).

[el matador]

Why is it?

Why cant a new manager use the quality that's already here (and it is here, it's just the current manager can no longer bring it out) and make a few tweaks to mould it into his own team? Why would that need to take 5 years?

rafa could be here for 50 years and we still wont win the title.

[Shaggy]

Do you think he'd walk away? Not if we lose next week, just generally i mean.

Do you think he'd stay just for the money, or do you see him walking if things got bad enough by his own standards, to think '**** this' ?

I haven't got a ****ing clue mate.

One the one hand I think he has such professional pride and belief in what he's doing that he'd stay and stubbornly believe he could turn it round. And I kind of admire that.

On the other hand I'd like to think he cares about the club so much - and unarguably he does (something else I really admire and love about the man) - that he'd do the honourable thing and walk away.

In short I have no idea.

[Craig_H]

rafa could be here for 50 years and we still wont win the title.

What you on about mate? I wasnt talking about rafa.

[Endless Dream]

Anyone see how pissed off Gerrard was when Babel ****ed up his pass to him, down the left hand side? You can tell how pissed off the better players are with the others

Yes but Gerrard is playing just as **** so he can;t really say anything?

[Shaggy]

Really? I'd expect to see the exact intervierw i've seen many times:


- we worked hard and tried our best
- we knew it was going to be difficult
- we have talked about how Lille will play
- now we have to focus on the next game, and try to finish 4th

No because we saw what he said after the Wigan game, and how hurt and angry he was. If we go out of this Euro Disney cup to ****ing Lille, surely he'll be frank with us. He's not deluded.

[Craig_H]

I haven't got a ****ing clue mate.

One the one hand I think he has such professional pride and belief in what he's doing that he'd stay and stubbornly believe he could turn it round. And I kind of admire that.

On the other hand I'd like to think he cares about the club so much - and unarguably he does (something else I really admire and love about the man) - that he'd do the honourable thing and walk away.

In short I have no idea.

I was actually thinking from a 'i cant be arsed with this ****e setup from these yank cunts' perspective, with regards to whether he'd quit or not

I dont think he'd walk because he thought it'd be best for the club, because as you say, he's not the sort who'd ever ever doubt himself or his methods, even for a second. He'll be thinking that it's for the best for the club, if he stays.

[Shaggy]

Yes but Gerrard is playing just as **** so he can;t really say anything?

He can't say **** with most of the passes he's given this week. Garbage.

[wiw]

Yes but Gerrard is playing just as **** so he can;t really say anything?

No denying it. This must be his worst ever season with us surely?

[el matador]

What you on about mate? I wasnt talking about rafa.

just making a point bud - not having a dig at you.

[Craig_H]

No because we saw what he said after the Wigan game, and how hurt and angry he was. If we go out of this Euro Disney cup to ****ing Lille, surely he'll be frank with us. He's not deluded.

As Harry Hill would say on TV Burp...

Hmmm........not sure.

[JohnDoe]

No denying it. This must be his worst ever season with us surely?

Definitely, this is the worst season in Gerrard's career, by a mile.

[Craig_H]

just making a point bud - not having a dig at you.

No, i know you werent having a dig mate

But you replied to my post with a point about rafa, as if replying to something i'd said about rafa - but i was talking about a new manager, not rafa

I was saying i dont see why a new manager would have to mean a new '5 year plan', because most of the squad is good and it only needs tweaking and a new playing mentality. I dont think the 'surgery' would need 5 years to come into effect.

[Lecter]

Torres is '****' for spain, is he?


Not been great this season mainly due to fitness, but generally, he's hardly ****.

Gerrard's never been great for england, for what it's worth. It's never impacted on his Liverpool performances though.

I was talking this season regarding Torres

Its like what I said earlier hes in a nark at the moment (like he has been in other matches in previous seasons)

Normally hes in a nark when either decisions or his own form isnt going for him