Was this the turning point?

[Shanks]

Thats pretty damning of the people who have been in charge of the youth system over the last 12 years or so. At least things have started to improve during the last 12 months.

Eh?

They are three of the biggest players to ever come through our system.

[Exiled_red]

Eh?

They are three of the biggest players to ever come through our system.

I think his point is that Fowler, Owen, and Gerrard all came through over 12 years ago, since then the record is poor.

[dww]

The point being that since Rafa rejected that contract and vowed to take full control, things haven't been the same.

For what reason Heighway left, I still don't see any changes..

How would you see changes in 2 years for youth development a process which takes at least five years for any difference to take root?

Heighway may deserve credit for Gerrard etc. I don't know but it is certainly true that after that purple patch we produced little. Maybe it was simply that others moved forwards and he/we did not. Something had to be changed.

In terms of picking out Rafa not signing that contract: Financially the owners have stopped putting funds into transfers. Key players left over the summer. While the first might be connected to the incident you are talking about it is the cause of that incident rather than the effect. Alonso and Sami leaving have completely independent causes.

I think you are trying to forcing a causative explanation onto a correlation/coincidence.

[little dave hedgehog]

i am imagining wafts of angry smoke drifting out of dww's ears right about now.

[Exiled_red]

[cream]

I think his point is that Fowler, Owen, and Gerrard all came through over 12 years ago, since then the record is poor.

Exactly, after Gerrard the youth system has produced dog ****. It's only in the last 12/18 months we can sense improvement, youngsters such as Pacheco, Dalla Valle and Sterling were all major coups and suggest the OP is talking out his arse.

[Sconniee2]

Surely the correct way to look at the youth system, according to Shanks, is to see what local talent has been produced in the last say 10-12 years from Merseyside....

I can name

Owen
Gerrard
Rooney

Two of them played for LFC the other steadfastly refused to do so despite KK best efforts.

Happy to be proved wrong, but who else would grace our 1st XI in the last 10-12 years???

The game has moved on, and that is precisely why Rafa wanted more control.

Also you cannot give someone control over the youth and then expect them to produce results in 2 years. It would be virtually impossible

[Shaggy]

Surely the correct way to look at the youth system, according to Shanks, is to see what local talent has been produced in the last say 10-12 years from Merseyside....

I can name

Owen
Gerrard
Rooney

Two of them played for LFC the other steadfastly refused to do so despite KK best efforts.

Happy to be proved wrong, but who else would grace our 1st XI in the last 10-12 years???

The game has moved on, and that is precisely why Rafa wanted more control.

Also you cannot give someone control over the youth and then expect them to produce results in 2 years. It would be virtually impossible

There are an incredible amount of Scouse professional footballers, decent ones at that, but bar the three you mention they're either mid-level Prem players (Baines, for example) or playing lower league football (Trundle, Lambert and tons of others).

[little dave hedgehog]

some may not be the best players ever, but may be pretty fantastic in certain other ways.

*cough cough*

joey barton

ahem...

[red g]

From heighway we had Steven Gerrard, Jamie Carragher, Fowler and, later still, Owen, who else have we seen break into the side? John Welsh, Richie Partridge and Stephen Warnock were three I can think of and none of them are at the club any more. The bottom line is, the youth academy under Heighway had not performed for close on a decade.

Personally i think Rafa is doing a fantastic job at youth level, we truly have some world class potential there now.

2006, only 2 yrs after rafa our youth team looked like this

Roberts
Darby
Antwi
Hobbs
Threlfall
Anderson
Flynn
Barnett (Roque)
Barratt
Hammill (Spearing),
Lindfield


it seems to be that we have loads more talent in the team nowadays and at last half a dozen that have a real chance of making it

If rafa does go, i truly believe he wil have left us a fantastic legacy.

[Shanks]

I think my main point from the original post, is that when Rafa turned down the initial offer the line was drawn and from then on, things became a tad more difficult for him.

It was about having overall control and not just about the youth set up.

He is having a lot more control but I'm not sure that's a good thing and is he is capable of actually producing better results from that?

[Hollowman]

Turning point? That was the end of January, nay? From February on we won 12 of 15 league games, including beating Chelsea and slapping the tits off United and Villa. We mullered Real Madrid 4-0 in the Champions League.

If it was a turning point then we must have the turning arc of a ****ing planet.

[Shanks]

Turning point? That was the end of January, nay? From February on we won 12 of 15 league games, including beating Chelsea and slapping the tits off United and Villa. We mullered Real Madrid 4-0 in the Champions League.

If it was a turning point then we must have the turning arc of a ****ing planet.

I'm talking about the initial decision and not so much the timing,
Perhaps we are starting to see the results of that right across the board.

[Hollowman]

I don't think so. I think we're starting to see the results of having negative net spending on the squad over the last two and half seasons.

[Exiled_red]

I don't think so. I think we're starting to see the results of having negative net spending on the squad over the last two and half seasons.