Would Gerrard & Owen be the players they are/were under Rafa?

[Taxi]

I really think that neither Gerrard or Owen would've been the same players had Rafa been in charge when they were 17/18.

There is no way Rafa would've introduced and regularly played a 17 year old Owen or an 18 year old Gerrard. It was this thrust into the mens game that I think ultimately made them the players they were/are and had Rafa been in charge at the time, they'd have still been playing in the youth setup or would've found themselves out on loan and possibly even lost for good.

[red g]

I really think that neither Gerrard or Owen would've been the same players had Rafa been in charge when they were 17/18.

There is no way Rafa would've introduced and regularly played a 17 year old Owen or an 18 year old Gerrard. It was this thrust into the mens game that I think ultimately made them the players they were/are and had Rafa been in charge at the time, they'd have still been playing in the youth setup or would've found themselves out on loan and possibly even lost for good.

in owen you mean a constantly injured one?

Bit harsh if you ask me, its all about injuries owen got his break because of injuries.

Insua has broken through and he is gash.

Ngog has broken through.....and if he was as good as owen would be playing week in, week out.

If pacheco wasnt permanently with the spanish side he would have played more in last month

Kelly would have played more if injuries hadnt played there part

El zhar has had a few chances.

Not buying yr argument to be fair.

[Taxi]

in owen you mean a constantly injured one?

Bit harsh if you ask me, its all about injuries owen got his break because of injuries.

Insua has broken through and he is gash.

Ngog has broken through.....and if he was as good as owen would be playing week in, week out.

If pacheco wasnt permanently with the spanish side he would have played more in last month

Kelly would have played more if injuries hadnt played there part

El zhar has had a few chances.

Not buying yr argument to be fair.

Ngog and Insua are both 21 though. Thats my point, Rafa wouldn't play a 17 or 18 year old and I'd say it was this early blooding that made them better. They had the talent, but experience counts and they both got lots of 1st team experience early on.

El Zhar's was 22 or so.

Pacheco looks like he's going to be loaned out.

[Chrono]

I remember reading that Rush was fairly ****e in training and the reserves and only really came in to the light in the senior team.

I guess you never know unless you give them games.

[Taxi]

I remember reading that Rush was fairly ****e in training and the reserves and only really came in to the light in the senior team.

I guess you never know unless you give them games.

Exactly and Rafa 100% wouldn't have thrust a 17 year old Owen into the team or regularly played an 18 year old in midfield. He's just too safe.

[Scratch]

And Owen may have, if properly groomed (so to speak) not had the injury ravaged career that he had, and Gerrard may not have suffered early in his career through those apparant "growing pains" that were a part of the Houllier years.

[Guest]

It's all very hypothetical mate don't you think?

[Taxi]

And Owen may have, if properly groomed (so to speak) not had the injury ravaged career that he had, and Gerrard may not have suffered early in his career through those apparant "growing pains" that were a part of the Houllier years.

Rooney's doing alright, injuries happen and some are unluckier than others.

[Redspin]

I remember reading that Rush was fairly ****e in training and the reserves and only really came in to the light in the senior team.

I guess you never know unless you give them games.

Not really comparable with Pacheco's situation. Rush was already a full international before making his Liverpool debut. I was at that game, Ipswich away, in 1980. I remember thinking that he'd played very well, without looking like scoring (my memory tells me it was 0-0 but I'm not sure). It actually took him until September 1981, fully nine months later, before he actually scored for the first team, so he was less of an instant success than even Ngog has been. If this forum existed then I'm sure Paisley would have been slagged off mercilessly for playing this kid who never scored.

[Kenneth]

I have no idea.

[Taxi]

It's all very hypothetical mate don't you think?

So what if it is? Whats your point?

Oh hang on, you're Rafa's love child so you'll want to only speak about facts.

[Chris]

Ace, another petty thread designed to criticise the manager.

[Guest]

So what if it is? Whats your point?

Oh hang on, you're Rafa's love child so you'll want to only speak about facts.

If it's for debating something that we'll never be in a position to really know, what is the point of it?

[Taxi]

Ace, another petty thread designed to criticise the manager.

Its a fair question in our circumstances. We have no money and will have to resort more to using our youth resources, but I have doubts whether or not Rafa is brave enough to try blooding a few of our most promising young players. I really do not believe that Gerrard or Owen would've played regularly until they were in their 20's, which they'd then have spent a season or two getting used to the men's game or they may have been loaned out.

[dww]

The thing is that people complained about Houllier's reticence to play young players but he was the one who put Gerrard into the team. He was the only one good enough to stand out in the crop of young players now.

Rafa has given Insua and Ngog decent amounts of game time and shown a willingness to have the likes of Kelly and Pacheco in the squad. I think that the basis of the argument that Rafa has shown himself unwilling to risk youth is untrue. In fact he has been taking a lot of stick for persevering with young players in the case of Insua and putting his faith in them as first line back ups in the case of Ngog. At the minute people want to see the bad sides of everything about Rafa.