Our Striker problems are self inflicted

[kev776]

Torres... World Class, injury prone

Kuyt.....Scores every 2 or 3 games when played upfront

Babbel....To me hasn't been given a chance up-front to show what he can do, in my simple mind he is wasted on the wing.

Ngog....At the moment he is Championship standard at best, may improve in time.

My issue is why are we playing 2 of our 4 strikers in wide positions constantly. We have Riera and Maxi as our wide players, not the best in the world but better wingers than kuyt or Babbel.

Use Babbel with Benny as impact players, get Kuyt playing with/in place of Torres please Rafa. To use Ngog as the only alternative to Torres is criminal.


Maxi-----Gerrard---Mascher----Riera

-------Kuyt/Benny

-----------------Torres/Kuyt/Babbel

[Exiled_red]

I'd like to see us play two up real strikers up front (but it's not going to happen), for me that's two of Torres, Kuyt and Ngog. Babel isn't a striker. The system you suggest with Benayoun off the striker is similar to what we play now with Gerrard in that role. The problem for me is we have had so many of these creative type players that we don't know where to play they aren't wingers or centre mids and the aren't really forwards, at the moment Babel and Benayoun fit into this catagory (previously we've had Smicer, Garcia, Berger etc...)

I feel sorry for Ngog, the lone strikers job is a thankless task, and you really have to be a world class player to carry it off effectively in this league. I think Ngog has done a decent enough job when he has played it he holds the ball up well, but the other issue with a lone striker is you need players to support him and chip in with goals and we simply don't have that! Ideally as a young player Ngog would have been featuring alot as sub when we have been winning comfortably, that's the time to blood young players. Unfortunately we haven't had that luxary this season.

[Roboklopp]

There's merit in what you say to be fair. Given the failure of the 451 to work successfully without Alonso (& when Torres is injured), Id like to see Kuyt up top with Torres to take the heat off him.

He often looks terribly isolated & is stuck in the opposition's half alone, getting kicked ****less by 4 or 5 defenders & expected to perform miracles. I dont think this helps his injuries at all. I know the Prem is a hard place, but he never had them before he came here.

It would also ease our problem of not having enough men in the box.

[Parr_Zee]

I think that when Torres is injured, we need to switch from 4-5-1 with N'Gog as the main striker (too much pressure for him), and change to a 4-4-2 with Kuyt and N'Gog sharing the goalscoring responsibility.

[MrMichael]

Thing about Kuyt upfront is that although he lacks the pace and ability to change up suddenly to be a really regular goal scorer in this league, his running and movement off the ball does tie-up defenders and creates space for those around him. I can remember plenty of quotes from our other forwards over the last few years about just that, how much they like playing with him as he does so much donkey work for them.

I think it would especially benefit Ngog to be played with Kuyt in direct support rather than stuck out wide.

[Exiled_red]

Thing about Kuyt upfront is that although he lacks the pace and ability to change up suddenly to be a really regular goal scorer in this league, his running and movement off the ball does tie-up defenders and creates space for those around him. I can remember plenty of quotes from our other forwards over the last few years about just that, how much they like playing with him as he does so much donkey work for them.

I think it would especially benefit Ngog to be played with Kuyt in direct support rather than stuck out wide.

Kuyt has to play up front in a front two, he can't play as a lone striker for these reasons

[SB]

Kuyt has to play up front in a front two, he can't play as a lone striker for these reasons

Dead right. We only have Torres who can play the lone striker so why won't Rafa play the conventional 442 with N'Gog and Kuyt together up front

[-V-]

What? How?

We all know Torres' injuries are holding him back but I don't think he asked for them.

Kuyt couldn't handle the pressure of playing as a lone striker and doesn't have the pace to do it but thats Rafa's fault for playing him so often as a lone striker, diminishing his confidence when we could all see he wasn't up to the task. In a front 2 Kuyt is actually pretty decent.

Babel isn't a striker

Ngog is a young kid with very little experience of a top level football

We barely have any real 'Strikers'

[The Birdman]

Chelsea, Man U and Arsenal all play variations on 4-3-3/4-5-1.
For me Torres isn't suited to playing with another striker which is why the system with Gerrard off him works so well.
I'd like to see us play 4-1-3-1-1 all the time at home with someting like this -
Reina
Johnson Carra Agger Insua
Mascher
Kuyt Lucas Maxi
Gerrard
Torres.

Obviously you can swap the players to fit your own personal preference but for the majority of the home games 2 centre halfs and Mascher should be enough protection.

Edit: That system should be enough for 90% of the away games as well. Lucas has shown in the few games Rafa has released the shackles from him that he makes good forward runs and more importantly times them brilliantly

[The Birdman]

Dead right. We only have Torres who can play the lone striker so why won't Rafa play the conventional 442 with N'Gog and Kuyt together up front

Because you can't train and prepare for injuries, we'll work day in day out on shape, pattern of play, defensive positioning, attacking runs etc....

Even if Torres is out it is less disruption to the team and shape and system just to replace like for like. If we changed formation every time someone got an injury we'd be all over the place because everything changes from starting positions to runs, responsibilites etc...

[Exiled_red]

Because you can't train and prepare for injuries, we'll work day in day out on shape, pattern of play, defensive positioning, attacking runs etc....

Even if Torres is out it is less disruption to the team and shape and system just to replace like for like. If we changed formation every time someone got an injury we'd be all over the place because everything changes from starting positions to runs, responsibilites etc...

Surely we can and should prepare different styles of play, obviously we can't prepare for every eventuallity, and should focus on our main style of play but we should practice playing more than one system so that we have a plan B

[SB]

Because you can't train and prepare for injuries, we'll work day in day out on shape, pattern of play, defensive positioning, attacking runs etc....

Even if Torres is out it is less disruption to the team and shape and system just to replace like for like. If we changed formation every time someone got an injury we'd be all over the place because everything changes from starting positions to runs, responsibilites etc...

N'Gog for Torres = like for like

I know what your saying but that is just wrong

[SB]

Surely we can and should prepare different styles of play, obviously we can't prepare for every eventuallity, and should focus on our main style of play but we should practice playing more than one system so that we have a plan B

Is the correct answer IMO. 442 is what most players are used to surely.

[The Birdman]

Surely we can and should prepare different styles of play, obviously we can't prepare for every eventuallity, and should focus on our main style of play but we should practice playing more than one system so that we have a plan B

Is the correct answer IMO. 442 is what most players are used to surely.

Doesn't work like that.
Why would we practise 4-4-2 in training with Torres when we have no intention of playing that formation with him in the team in any game.

Or should Rafa say "listen Nando, you are injured a lot no? you sit out the next 4 days training while we look at possibilities when we play without you"

Just doesn't happen

[The Birdman]

Is the correct answer IMO. 442 is what most players are used to surely.

Who plays 4-4-2 these days??
And why would players be used to that formation as there are 10's of variations on a 4-4-2 shape