How would we fare if we bought no-one else in?

[rnevitt]

I think if we went with what we have already got, we would probably finish where we are now. We would still be short up-front, out-wide and at centre-half. At the moment everything is going well, so the adrenaline and feel-good factor is carrying us through. Problems start when a couple of bad performances/results kick in. If the likes of Kuyt, Maxi, etc start to dip in form, there isn't enough backup to come in and take over. That is where the good sides are a class apart, you rarely see the best sides dip for more than 2 games at a time.

It is imperative that we buy in the summer and buy well. The whole club i on the crest of a wave at the moment, so we must capitalise on it to carry the momentum through to next season. We have been in this situation many times over the last decade or so, 2002 (when Diouf, Diao and Cheyrou were bought), 2009 (when Alonso was sold), but never made the right decsions. Hopefully, with Kenny in charge everything will be done correctly.

[Fierce]

There isn't any way in the world this current squad could challenge for the title

If we could be absolutely assured that on top of being fit and raring to go not a single one of them EVER picked up a knock of any kind, and Gerrard's fitness was that of 2 years ago, then yes we'd have a chance

[Rudo]

I was wondering how you think we'd fare next season with our current squad assuming that everyone is fit and raring to go?

At the moment I think we could win the league but I genuinely think we're a top 3 side right now. The feel good factor of Kenny's return has worn off but it's been replaced with spirit and faith in the tactics and playing style. You can see that players are enjoying their game.

Has it?

I reckon 5th or 6th.

Still think we need a min of 5 or 6 top quality players to give us a decent chance of cracking the top 4, or possibly beyond that depending on where we are, after the new year or whatever.

Top 4 has to be the priority tho.

[Exiled_red]

In all honesty though with or without the momentum we have now you have to look and say that Hodgson held this side back

Roy was in charge for slightly over half of the season and Kenny will be in charge for a little less

Roys performances and results were ****ing dire and Kenny's were pretty decent - even if you averaged them out over a season we'd be close to Spurs

So on that basis and the belief that Kenny would get more from this squad than Roy did I think if Kenny had been in charge we'd be quite someway ahead of Spurs and possibly comfortably top 4

That would have been the case for this season, however next season is different, we need to consider what will happen with other sides in the summer. We have to look at the sides around us, as you say at the moment we have more or less matched Spurs this season despite our 'Hodgson handicap'. Ultimately whether we finish above or below Spurs with Kenny in charge I'd fancy us to finish above them unless the make alot of good signings in the summer (and we do nothing). In fact there were suggestions that Spurs may have to sell if they didn't make the Champions League, either way I don't see them as the main competition.

Man City are an interesting one they are on paper at least the weakest of the current top 4. They have the funds and now they have Champions league football so they should be able to attract better players, although their big money signings haven't always proved successful. Also the Champions League could prove a distraction and affect their form in the league, we'll have to see how that goes. If City make some good signings which gel and aren't affected by the CL then we may have to look at other teams...

[Angryred]

I was wondering how you think we'd fare next season with our current squad assuming that everyone is fit and raring to go?

At the moment I think we could win the league but I genuinely think we're a top 3 side right now. The feel good factor of Kenny's return has worn off but it's been replaced with spirit and faith in the tactics and playing style. You can see that players are enjoying their game.

Not for me, it hasn't!...every time I see him, I wanna give him a big hug & kiss!..ain't nothing wrong with me before you lot start!!!!!!

[RedReet]

Don't get me wrong - i'm not criticising the players or kenny's ability to coach - it clearly works....but i personally think it can't be discounted either, - What kenny has done first and foremost, before we get into any tactical discussions, is....galvanised the club, he's united the fans, lifted the dark cloud over the players and the response is there to see.....and that for me as played as big a part as anything in getting us into this position.

Just my opinion - but i'm maybe coming across as negative, i'm not...i'm just being a little cautious....as despite how well everyone has been playing and how well kenny has done - i still feel, personally that we lack at least two or three quality players to really put ourselvs back in the top 4, and possible need a couple more for a serious title challenge...

but as i pointed out - there is a number of reasons for this....the main one being that, I'm pretty sure we will see Chelsea and City go and spend £100m this summer, I'm sure Arsenal have know realised they need to go and spend a fair whack on a few 'established stars', and Spurs always seem to have a bot of cash and will prob look to strengthen as well

So imo - we are a couple players short right now, but with those teams looking to improve, if we 'stuck' with the current squad, we'd still just be a bit behind.

Nah, we definitely need to strengthen. I’d like to see a new CB, LB, CM and winger/forward signed.

I’ve just seen a few people (journalists included) talk about the ‘Kenny effect’ saying that we won’t have that advantage next year which I disagree with. Newcastle at the weekend was the perfect example. Both the crowd and the players seemed a bit flat, yet we were still good enough and professional enough to get the job done comfortably. I see no reason at all why the players won’t repeat this in 12 months time and hopefully even better it with a few quality additions.

I think if we went with what we have already got, we would probably finish where we are now. We would still be short up-front, out-wide and at centre-half. At the moment everything is going well, so the adrenaline and feel-good factor is carrying us through. Problems start when a couple of bad performances/results kick in. If the likes of Kuyt, Maxi, etc start to dip in form, there isn't enough backup to come in and take over. That is where the good sides are a class apart, you rarely see the best sides dip for more than 2 games at a time.

It is imperative that we buy in the summer and buy well. The whole club i on the crest of a wave at the moment, so we must capitalise on it to carry the momentum through to next season. We have been in this situation many times over the last decade or so, 2002 (when Diouf, Diao and Cheyrou were bought), 2009 (when Alonso was sold), but never made the right decsions. Hopefully, with Kenny in charge everything will be done correctly.

Seriously? We've lost our best player and our best CB for the season as well as multiple other injuries to first team players. Despite this, Kenny has got the team playing well and deserves full credit for this rather that putting it down to a ‘feel-good’ factor.

[rnevitt]

Seriously? We've lost our best player and our best CB for the season as well as multiple other injuries to first team players. Despite this, Kenny has got the team playing well and deserves full credit for this rather that putting it down to a ‘feel-good’ factor.

I am not putting it down purely to a 'feel-good' factor, Kenny has obviously worked miracles and deserves the utmost credit. The man is a legend. But we also have to be realistic. The likes of Maxi and Kuyt can be very good but also very bad. We don't have enough cover in those areas to mount a challenge.

[Exiled_red]

Seriously? We've lost our best player and our best CB for the season as well as multiple other injuries to first team players. Despite this, Kenny has got the team playing well and deserves full credit for this rather that putting it down to a ‘feel-good’ factor.

We've been missing Aurelio, Johnson, Kelly, Agger, Gerrard and Carroll for significant periods of Kenny's reign, 5 of which you would have to say would be first choice.

[red g]

That would have been the case for this season, however next season is different, we need to consider what will happen with other sides in the summer. We have to look at the sides around us, as you say at the moment we have more or less matched Spurs this season despite our 'Hodgson handicap'. Ultimately whether we finish above or below Spurs with Kenny in charge I'd fancy us to finish above them unless the make alot of good signings in the summer (and we do nothing). In fact there were suggestions that Spurs may have to sell if they didn't make the Champions League, either way I don't see them as the main competition.

Man City are an interesting one they are on paper at least the weakest of the current top 4. They have the funds and now they have Champions league football so they should be able to attract better players, although their big money signings haven't always proved successful. Also the Champions League could prove a distraction and affect their form in the league, we'll have to see how that goes. If City make some good signings which gel and aren't affected by the CL then we may have to look at other teams...

I actually think on paper they are the strongest of the top 4 and Scum are the weakest ........

[Exiled_red]

I actually think on paper they are the strongest of the top 4 and Scum are the weakest ........

I meant going off the league table (I should have worded it better)

[PTP]

i do think one benefit that we have seen, maybe through a bit of 'luck' in the sense that it's almost been stumbled upon - but because of the following

1) some really unfortunate injuries to key players, Johnson, Gerrard, Aurelio, Agger and also Kelly who got his shot through injury to Johnson and made himself a first team regular only to get injured.

and

2) the fact that we signed some seriously ****e squad players - poulsen, jovanovic, konchesky...


And the fact we were out of europe and not challenging for 4th - it' really helped the youth come through..

Spearing
Flannagan
Robinson
Shelvey

have all got game time, all improved and the fact that the pressure has been off us slightly as we were out of everything, tied in with the bad injuries and how ****e some of the more senior players are....has meant that these 4 have been given a chance, they've all taken it - and for me it has reassured us a little - it has shown that, actually our 'squad' isn't too bad......we don't need to go and spend £15m on six 'squad fillers' from around europe - We just need to go and get the right players for the right positions - a top left back, a top left mid, and one or two others...

But these kids have shown, that we have some quality back up that will fight for the shirt, even if they are only given 1 minute of playing time - they're hungry.

It's something that united have done very well - they've always had a core of 'united' players that sometimes i've looked at and thought ****ing hell - how is he at united - the likes of wes brown, John o shea etc

This players are vital to united - they aren't world beaters...they know that, ferguson knows that.....but they serve a purpose, they love their club, want to be a part of the club, and if that means that they might only make 10-15 appearences a season, then so be it.. it gives them a bit of core, a bit of unity, and a bit of something to fall back on and build around...

We seem to have that coming through now especially wehn you add Kelly into the mix too - it is encouraging

[Exiled_red]

i do think one benefit that we have seen, maybe through a bit of 'luck' in the sense that it's almost been stumbled upon - but because of the following

1) some really unfortunate injuries to key players, Johnson, Gerrard, Aurelio, Agger and also Kelly who got his shot through injury to Johnson and made himself a first team regular only to get injured.

and

2) the fact that we signed some seriously ****e squad players - poulsen, jovanovic, konchesky...


And the fact we were out of europe and not challenging for 4th - it' really helped the youth come through..

Spearing
Flannagan
Robinson
Shelvey

have all got game time, all improved and the fact that the pressure has been off us slightly as we were out of everything, tied in with the bad injuries and how ****e some of the more senior players are....has meant that these 4 have been given a chance, they've all taken it - and for me it has reassured us a little - it has shown that, actually our 'squad' isn't too bad......we don't need to go and spend £15m on six 'squad fillers' from around europe - We just need to go and get the right players for the right positions - a top left back, a top left mid, and one or two others...

But these kids have shown, that we have some quality back up that will fight for the shirt, even if they are only given 1 minute of playing time - they're hungry.

It's something that united have done very well - they've always had a core of 'united' players that sometimes i've looked at and thought ****ing hell - how is he at united - the likes of wes brown, John o shea etc

This players are vital to united - they aren't world beaters...they know that, ferguson knows that.....but they serve a purpose, they love their club, want to be a part of the club, and if that means that they might only make 10-15 appearences a season, then so be it.. it gives them a bit of core, a bit of unity, and a bit of something to fall back on and build around...

We seem to have that coming through now especially wehn you add Kelly into the mix too - it is encouraging

Six months ago I thought we needed both a number of first team players (~4 or 5) and some squad players. Now I think that we should just focus on buying players who should be regulars, the current players who they displace and the kids can make up the places in the squad. I really don't want us to spend money on players who will spend the majority of their time on the bench, we should use the money we save by not having to buy such players to ensure the players we bring in are top draw.

[PTP]

exactly - i remember people criticising Rafa for doing it - but he had too - we were in a position were we had to basically 'fill the squad' and needed quantity and couldn't afford quality!

I've heard a few people give kenny credit for brining in these young lads and that raf never did....i find it harsh on rafa to be honest, in his time he gave plenty of kids games, that were clearly not up to it - i can't be bothered looking back but i have see a list of people like say Darren Potter who he had a look at and bombed out.

And also whilst kenny has given these lads a chance....would they have got a chance if we hadn't have suffered all these injuries, or if we were still in the hunt for 4th, or if some of the 'squad' players were actually reasonable???

[RedReet]

I am not putting it down purely to a 'feel-good' factor, Kenny has obviously worked miracles and deserves the utmost credit. The man is a legend. But we also have to be realistic. The likes of Maxi and Kuyt can be very good but also very bad. We don't have enough cover in those areas to mount a challenge.

Perhaps I'm the wrong person to be having this discussion with.

I do generally agree with what you’re saying and we do need to strengthen, but I also feel people are often guilty of vastly underrating our players and attribute our change in fortunes to this ‘feel-good’ factor rather than accepting that it might actually be a fair reflection on the ability of our players and the coaching staff.

I don’t even know if that makes sense, my head had been broke for the past week or so and I’ve been struggling to think straight.

[red g]

exactly - i remember people criticising Rafa for doing it - but he had too - we were in a position were we had to basically 'fill the squad' and needed quantity and couldn't afford quality!

I've heard a few people give kenny credit for brining in these young lads and that raf never did....i find it harsh on rafa to be honest, in his time he gave plenty of kids games, that were clearly not up to it - i can't be bothered looking back but i have see a list of people like say Darren Potter who he had a look at and bombed out.

And also whilst kenny has given these lads a chance....would they have got a chance if we hadn't have suffered all these injuries, or if we were still in the hunt for 4th, or if some of the 'squad' players were actually reasonable???

no, no and no......think its fair to say that probably 80% of young kids get there chance through injuries and while most teams would use the squad....as you mentioned ours is ****!!