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    #10921
    Originally posted by Captain Stu View Post
    Just no. Robben is an absolute gob****e and he's purely driven by his own ego, it'd be more trouble than it's worth to keep him happy and don't forget that he works for himself only, won't track back and only plays when he decides he's 100% fit.

    Prize gob****e.
    Anyway, aside from being deliberately facetious with your post (soz n all) - one thing that was striking in the last two Champions League runs was how much Jupp has managed to get Robben and Ribery working on their defensive duties. Their tracking back has been remarkable for what they were known for - they were up and down their respective sides for the whole game in the final in particular. Their system doesn't accommodate passengers, reckon you've missed how much they actually do if you think that Robben hasn't been working for Bayern. He works a lot. Sure he doesn't always pass when he should, but he's a massive talent if you look at it objectively.

    Whether he could be arsed doing it for a team that isn't challenging at the same level, or for a manager less able than Jupp are different issues though

    Comment

      #10922
      Originally posted by Sarb View Post
      Rory Smith hinting that Suarez wants out but won't ask for move due to wanting a loyalty bonus. Oh the irony
      The club will ask him put in a transfer request, just like Torres.
      Brandt - Keita - Van Dijk - Sessegnon

      Comment

        #10923
        Originally posted by Daniel 7 View Post
        Anyway, aside from being deliberately facetious with your post (soz n all) - one thing that was striking in the last two Champions League runs was how much Jupp has managed to get Robben and Ribery working on their defensive duties. Their tracking back has been remarkable for what they were known for - they were up and down their respective sides for the whole game in the final in particular. Their system doesn't accommodate passengers, reckon you've missed how much they actually do if you think that Robben hasn't been working for Bayern. He works a lot. Sure he doesn't always pass when he should, but he's a massive talent if you look at it objectively.

        Whether he could be arsed doing it for a team that isn't challenging at the same level, or for a manager less able than Jupp are different issues though
        I think to call BR "less able" is a bit disingenuous. Maybe less experienced, but he has the potential to be as good, if not, better.

        Comment

          #10924
          A mate on Twitter said the other day - and I completely agree - that Robben clearly worked on his game this season simply because he was the villain after last years Champion's League final. He took it personally and it hurt his ego. I don't for one second think he's changed or grown as a player, he just decided to be less of a knob for one year.
          Flickr

          Comment

            #10925
            I never specifically said Brendan was worse, nor did I say we're signing Robben.

            Thing is with Jupp is that he's at the absolute apex of club management - whether we like it or not, Brendan's achievements don't stand comparison. Granted they are at different ends of the career spectrum, but there are other long established managers who haven't achieved anywhere near as much as Jupp.

            Brendan is still very much at the potential phase - we don't even know if he's actually doing a good job yet.

            Comment

              #10926
              Originally posted by Captain Stu View Post
              A mate on Twitter said the other day - and I completely agree - that Robben clearly worked on his game this season simply because he was the villain after last years Champion's League final. He took it personally and it hurt his ego. I don't for one second think he's changed or grown as a player, he just decided to be less of a knob for one year.
              Reckon you should move into sports psychology, you'd make a fortune

              Comment

                #10927
                Originally posted by Daniel 7 View Post
                Reckon you should move into sports psychology, you'd make a fortune
                Well, I DID study psychology for one whole year in college...
                Flickr

                Comment

                  #10928
                  Originally posted by cream View Post
                  The club will ask him put in a transfer request, just like Torres.


                  They will. To be honest, he shouldn't really see that as a big deal if he wants to move on. Any decent person in his position would think to themselves that they didn't deserve a loyalty bonus.

                  Comment

                    #10929
                    I don't suppose it's actually called a loyalty bonus but is triggered by something, like being at the club on a certain date or not putting in a formal transfer request. So it's just manoeuvring and negotiation, like any contractual dispute when the two parties have few interests in common.

                    It's much the same as the Andy Carroll story about him wanting a pay rise to sign for West Ham. What would you do? Not ask for more money even if you thought you might get it or something else in the package? I doubt it.
                    .
                    Suppose you have a physicist and a sociologist standing at the side of a field, observing a set of events unfolding on the field. The physicist does [describes] it using the terminology of mass and velocity and frequency of radiation and the rest. And the sociologist does it by describing it as a rugby match.



                    May the Lord bless this post.

                    Comment

                      #10930
                      Originally posted by Neil Young View Post
                      I don't suppose it's actually called a loyalty bonus but is triggered by something, like being at the club on a certain date or not putting in a formal transfer request. So it's just manoeuvring and negotiation, like any contractual dispute when the two parties have few interests in common.

                      It's much the same as the Andy Carroll story about him wanting a pay rise to sign for West Ham. What would you do? Not ask for more money even if you thought you might get it or something else in the package? I doubt it.
                      You might be right. I suspect though, looking on the outside, out of Carroll and Suarez, it would be Carroll that would recieve a loyalty bonus as we're selling him rather than him demanding a move. That's the way you'd hope it would be. I suspect clubs put clauses in the contract that say regardless of if you have stayed for x number of years, if you ask for a transfer you forgo any loyalty bonus payment (as you should)

                      Comment

                        #10931
                        Originally posted by Sarb View Post
                        Rory Smith hinting that Suarez wants out but won't ask for move due to wanting a loyalty bonus. Oh the irony
                        He must've read my post from yesterday then

                        Comment

                          #10932
                          Originally posted by Sarb View Post
                          You might be right. I suspect though, looking on the outside, out of Carroll and Suarez, it would be Carroll that would recieve a loyalty bonus as we're selling him rather than him demanding a move. That's the way you'd hope it would be. I suspect clubs put clauses in the contract that say regardless of if you have stayed for x number of years, if you ask for a transfer you forgo any loyalty bonus payment (as you should)
                          It always used to be you got 5% of the fee if the club sold you without you asking for a transfer and nothing if you did. The percentages may vary from one player to another but I imagine it's still the norm these days. So I agree that's why the club will try to manoeuvre Suárez into asking for a move, just like they forced Torres to.

                          I was really saying we shouldn't hold it against players for playing hardball on things like this and that the shorthand, media terms for this kind of thing can be misleading. It would be nice if a player voluntarily gave up a bonus for the good of the club but I can't imagine it's common, just like in similar circumstances in other walks of life.
                          .
                          Suppose you have a physicist and a sociologist standing at the side of a field, observing a set of events unfolding on the field. The physicist does [describes] it using the terminology of mass and velocity and frequency of radiation and the rest. And the sociologist does it by describing it as a rugby match.



                          May the Lord bless this post.

                          Comment

                            #10933
                            Originally posted by Neil Young View Post
                            It always used to be you got 5% of the fee if the club sold you without you asking for a transfer and nothing if you did. The percentages may vary from one player to another but I imagine it's still the norm these days. So I agree that's why the club will try to manoeuvre Suárez into asking for a move, just like they forced Torres to.

                            I was really saying we shouldn't hold it against players for playing hardball on things like this and that the shorthand, media terms for this kind of thing can be misleading. It would be nice if a player voluntarily gave up a bonus for the good of the club but I can't imagine it's common, just like in similar circumstances in other walks of life.
                            Yes we should. That is all

                            Comment

                              #10934
                              Originally posted by kingfunk View Post
                              Robben + Cash for Suarez? http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport...r-mill-4052735
                              No, he is not what we need,
                              Those that hid Anne Frank were breaking the law.
                              Those that killed her, were following the law.

                              Comment

                                #10935
                                Originally posted by Neil Young View Post
                                It always used to be you got 5% of the fee if the club sold you without you asking for a transfer and nothing if you did. The percentages may vary from one player to another but I imagine it's still the norm these days. So I agree that's why the club will try to manoeuvre Suárez into asking for a move, just like they forced Torres to.

                                I was really saying we shouldn't hold it against players for playing hardball on things like this and that the shorthand, media terms for this kind of thing can be misleading. It would be nice if a player voluntarily gave up a bonus for the good of the club but I can't imagine it's common, just like in similar circumstances in other walks of life.


                                In reality none of us would want to give up a bonus if it was part of our contract. However, if we earned £100k+ per week, some may probably be a little less fussed about it. But you have to look at each case really

                                If were Luis Suarez and I wanted to go to a CL club, bearing in mind what I'd done in the last 2 years and how it affected the club and the supporters, I'd be honest and the prospect of losing a loyalty bonus wouldn't affect what I said in public.

                                It's sad really. A brilliant player. A bit of honesty and he probably still would have left the club being adored by many fans. This will just leave a bitter taste, especially if it drags on

                                Comment

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